View Poll Results: Can Colonials uphold more than one Celto-Germanic tradition at a time?

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Thread: Can Colonials Uphold More Than One Celto-Germanic Tradition at a Time?

  1. #1
    Senior Member Brynhild's Avatar
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    Can Colonials Uphold More Than One Celto-Germanic Tradition at a Time?

    OK, there has been plenty of talk about heritage and culture in the Germanic nations of Europe, but what about the rest of us who are more far-flung in the wider areas?

    There are plenty of us here who have more than one Germanic ethnicity. Do you believe that it is - or isn't - possible to uphold the values and culture of all the separate ethnicities that are within the Germanic framework? Or should you adapt to the one ethnicity you feel most drawn toward?

    For Example, in Australia, we are still predominantly a Celto-Germanic nation, and those of us who love our country value all the traditions within the Celto-Germanic framework.
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    I'm not 100% sure of exactly what you're asking Brynhild, but I believe that in the case of a multi-(European)ethnic person who is born and bred in Australia, and who identifies themselves as "Australian", they should uphold traditional "Anglo-Celtic" (which just means "British Isles") values and culture.

    I don't think that some very minor level of non-British Isles European immigration to Australia is a problem, as long as they assimilate. If they're not willing to assimilate, their stay in Australia should be short-term only.

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    Wink

    Quote Originally Posted by Brynhild
    For Example, in Australia, we are still predominantly a Celto-Germanic nation, and those of us who love our country value all the traditions within the Celto-Germanic framework.
    1. Australia was colonised by the British race. To describe their nation as Celto-Germanic is the tyrannical arm of multiculturalism.

    2. Australia is not a country.

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    Senior Member MockTurtle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brynhild
    There are plenty of us here who have more than one Germanic ethnicity. Do you believe that it is - or isn't - possible to uphold the values and culture of all the separate ethnicities that are within the Germanic framework?
    No, I think it sounds almost schizophrenic, to be honest. I think the peoples in the Germanic 'colonial territories' follow the same natural laws as do those in the Old World nations. A coherent sense of 'group identity' is one of the most basic needs and desires of all humans; the sense of group identity in the Old World nations was forged out of centuries of common history and common struggle, as well as the gradual stabilization of the basic genetic material in each region. If the Germanics in New World countries manage to get a handle on things politically, they will eventually create unique identities based on the genetic material that exists.

    New Worlders often have misguided ideas about the 'ethnic identities' of Old Worlders; they tend to think that imitating the older ethnic identities is the only way to 'preserve' Germanic traditions. But this stagnant view of ethnicity is a big misconception. The Nordish-Germanic populations of New World countries are the new product of assimilation and stabilization of a variety of stocks from Northern Europe over time. They are still Germanic, but their identities will never be exact copies of those that exist in Old World countries. This is obvious because the genetic material is different in each case.

    Of course, this is the same process that originally took place in Old World countries anyhow. If you go back far enough, you will continue to find more and more scattered identities that had not yet gathered together into a larger coherent group.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bridie View Post
    I'm not 100% sure of exactly what you're asking Brynhild, but I believe that in the case of a multi-(European)ethnic person who is born and bred in Australia, and who identifies themselves as "Australian", they should uphold traditional "Anglo-Celtic" (which just means "British Isles") values and culture.

    I don't think that some minor level of non-British Isles European immigration to Australia is a problem, as long as they assimilate. If they're not willing to assimilate, their stay in Australia should be short-term only.
    You pretty much described what I meant

    Quote Originally Posted by Talan View Post
    1. Australia was colonised by the British race. To describe their nation as Celto-Germanic is the tyrannical arm of multiculturalism.
    Pardon me, but who were the Southern Irish?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Talan
    Australia is not a country.
    Oh, I forgot! It's an island continent - regarded as a country. Enough with the pedantic attitude already! You're behaving like a troll.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brynhild
    Pardon me, but who were the Southern Irish?
    New Chums. Name me a single colonist who identified as being Southern Irish.

    Quote Originally Posted by Brynhild
    Oh, I forgot! It's an island continent - regarded as a country. Enough with the pedantic attitude already! You're behaving like a troll.
    Erm... trolling? You can't answer questions of colonial identity without getting into ethnological definitions of space. Australia is not a country, it is "the Antipodes," that is, the opposite of Europe and the European sense of territory. When conversing with English imperialists, the so-called "British," it is correct to use the corruption "Orstralia" to emphasise that their society is in parallel to Australia's.

    EDIT: Just in case you missed that, am asking if you call Great Britain a country.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Talan View Post
    New Chums. Name me a single colonist who identified as being Southern Irish.
    The Irish colonists (or convicts) identified with being Irish - although probably not "Southern" Irish.


    Erm... trolling? You can't answer questions of colonial identity without getting into ethnological definitions of space. Australia is not a country, it is "the Antipodes," that is, the opposite of Europe and the European sense of territory. When conversing with English imperialists, the so-called "British," it is correct to use the corruption "Orstralia" to emphasise that their society is in parallel to Australia's.

    EDIT: Just in case you missed that, am asking if you call Great Britain a country.
    You're right. Australia is a land within British overseas territory.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MockTurtle View Post
    No, I think it sounds almost schizophrenic, to be honest. I think the peoples in the Germanic 'colonial territories' follow the same natural laws as do those in the Old World nations. A coherent sense of 'group identity' is one of the most basic needs and desires of all humans; the sense of group identity in the Old World nations was forged out of centuries of common history and common struggle, as well as the gradual stabilization of the basic genetic material in each region. If the Germanics in New World countries manage to get a handle on things politically, they will eventually create unique identities based on the genetic material that exists.

    New Worlders often have misguided ideas about the 'ethnic identities' of Old Worlders; they tend to think that imitating the older ethnic identities is the only way to 'preserve' Germanic traditions. But this stagnant view of ethnicity is a big misconception. The Nordish-Germanic populations of New World countries are the new product of assimilation and stabilization of a variety of stocks from Northern Europe over time. They are still Germanic, but their identities will never be exact copies of those that exist in Old World countries. This is obvious because the genetic material is different in each case.

    Of course, this is the same process that originally took place in Old World countries anyhow. If you go back far enough, you will continue to find more and more scattered identities that had not yet gathered together into a larger coherent group.
    Most people continue the traditions that they were brought up with when they moved to the "New World". Many Germanic people that came here still had a degree of separation, similiar to others outside of Anglo-American society. It took laws and two world wars to break many links within the German community and that was not entirely "successful". Outside of integrating into the dominant culture, to whatever degree, regional differences will always exist Old World or New...regardless of ethnicity. Personally, I feel comfortable and at home on either side of the Atlantic...though, admittedly, I'm hardly typical in regards to the current ethnic experience except for perhaps those other first gens (on mother's side) here.

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    Senior Member Cythraul's Avatar
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    "Can Colonials uphold more than one Celto-Germanic tradition at a time?"

    By "colonials", I assume we mean "colonial countries" and not the individual offspring of colonial settlers. I believe that on an individual basis, it is important to maintain a consistant, dominant culture and race - although I do feel that within the Celto-Germanic framework, the commonalities are so great that is rarely detrimental to adopt aspects from different Germanic peoples.

    On a national level (and that's what I assume the thread is about), I don't think it's as important that a colonial nation maintains a strictly homogenous culture. I believe that blood and land are intrinsically related and that a piece of land soaks up the spiritual and cultural ether of its inhabitants. For example, the piece of land called 'Britain' has a vast history and belongs to the people to whom that history is ancestral. The piece of land called 'Australia' has not soaked up as much of the Germanic ether and therefore Germanics have less spiritual ownership of the land at this point in time. Specific strains of Germanic culture, therefore, can lay less of a claim.

    I know this seems a bit abstract and it's not to say that Australia isn't a genuine home to Germanics and that Germanics don't have sovereignty over it. I just mean that the spiritual bonds of land and blood grow stronger with time and where Germanic colonies are younger than old-world countries, absolute cultural consistency is often less enforceable.
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    In my opinion, there's a clear answer: no. Most Americans are bad at retaining their cultural and linguistic heritage, and even those that manage to make this effort (usually 1st and 2nd generation immigrants) don't teach it to their children. They teach them English and try to integrate them into the American society like good citizens. The tendency of any country which has a monoculture is to become as homogeneous as possible. Multiculturalism just doesn't work in countries like the USA. Let's face it, the only people who have preserved their heritage outside their motherlands are these Volksdeutsche in Europe who live in enclaves and the Amish in the US who isolate themselves from the modern world. Without an enclave, it's pretty difficult. And please don't tell me that these sausage fests or Oktoberfests are preservation of German heritage because it's a joke. So, who comes to America is better off becoming American. Anything else is like swimming against a waterfall. I'm speaking from own experience. Had I not returned to Germany, my generation would have lost my German heritage and my children wouldn't have been German anymore.

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