View Poll Results: Do you hate other races?

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Thread: Do You Hate Other Races?

  1. #111
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    No, I don't hate other races.

    I hate those blacks trying to be white and those whites trying to be black, and people who hate races but want to be treated like kings or queens if they are among them.

    I would find more respectable a black person who has concience of his culture and respect the others not trying to invade them than a white who doesn't feel anything for his country and uses the cover of Nationalism just to kick "nigg*rs buttocks", and viceversa.

    I would find more interesting to talk to a black man with concience of his nation that talking to a white guy who thinks "Yeah, Hitler was a cool dude... He killed Jews, man"



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  2. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by skyhawk View Post
    You , like so many others here , have totally missed the point and if you think " whites " only " commit paper crimes " then you are indeed biased. eyes: Some of the very worst crimes ( massacres , to use your own terminology) in the USA have been commited by white people . Have you forgotten Columbine or the Oklahoma City bombings for example ?

    I too would , given the choice , choose to remove violent crime first and foremost ( if it were possible ) over the likes of financial skullduggery by city/corporate high fliers , in fact I would prefer to tackle both with a vengeance as I think the two have a real link. But that's another debate totally.
    A jealous husband murdering his wife more than likely has nothing to do with poverty whereas a street robbery in which the victim is murdered by his/her attacker may well be linked to the wider problems of society ( poverty )
    But the bottom line is they are both murderers and thus both criminals. You may not consider the Enron criminals as criminals( maybe because they are white ) but I assure you they are and I think the people who lost their pensions ( my biggest concern ) because of their actions would agree with me, be they white or black employees.


    I posted the article not to imply that white people are more likely to be serial killers like you try to make out , not surprisingly, I posted it in response to a claim by a previous poster that black people commit " more gruesome " crimes than white people which is clearly not a stonewall argument. So it is you that has " missed the point " eyes: in your haste and pathetic attempt to portray me as a racist.
    I agree that serial killing " goes way beyond economic considerations " but the fact remains that most of them come from working class/poor backgrounds so its relevence cannot be ignored regardless of in what context the subject is being debated.
    I wasn't ignoring the relevance of poverty, except to say that you give wonderful examples of how upper class people commit heinous crimes, while ignoring that poverty is of greater consistency and magnitude than race in the matter of crime. However, even this understanding does not suffice because you go on to show how wealthy white people are just as larcenous as poor black people.

    What I object to is your insistence that there is some sort of equivocation for violent crime because of race and poverty as intertwined causalities. This assertion of a direct relationship couldn't be frrther from the truth. Violent crime is not the result of poverty but rather the result of depravity. And that a young black man is more likely to die at the hands of another young black man tells me this depravity is community driven, not socially sanctioned, which underlies your premise.

    As for Enron, the key conspirator, Jeffrey Skilling was given a sentence of 25 years. The other main conspirator died before incarceration. These crimes are getting their due punishment, and I certainly admit such punishment is long over due.

    Finally, I stand by my belief that to combat the effects of historical racism, one does not resort to compensatory racial solutions. Doing so is clearly racist.

  3. #113
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    The nature of crime everywhere has changed , we live in a very violent society no question about it.
    And you fail to see the demographic development of European societies as a factor of this change. If you compare the living standards of Negroids living in the US to that of poor Europeans a century or more ago, according to your pattern of thought they should've had even higher propensity for crime. Some of the crimes we witness today would have been unheard of back then. So what is the excuse for Negroid crime? Do they absolutely need to live criminal lives?

    But the notion that individual races are more or less prone to violence is something that I strongly disagree with.
    Really? eyes: Your view (a traditional socialist one) of humanity reduces different groups of people into a grey, uniform mass distinguished from one another only by environmental trivialities. This is what I oppose. For you to believe in your statement and its further implications without (consciously) sacrificing your intellectual integrity along the way, you would have to believe that different groups of people have no differences in distribution and quality of innate psychological traits and aptitudes whatsoever. So, are different groups of people identical in terms of psychological traits/mentality? If there are differences, then it would not be unfounded to suggest that there lies a difference in traits influencing criminal propensity.

    Many people here , too many imo , see/comment only on the violent crimes of other ethnicities whilst tending to ignore the violent crimes of their own, almost to a state of complete denial.
    That doesn't happen. What we see and what you fail to recognize or admit is proportion.

    This , imo , furthers the likelyhood of attacks/violence based on racial differences and adds petrol to the fire. As a result the cycle of inter racial violence will continue to become more and more established and consume more victims.
    So, because non-Europids of non-Asian background have and have had a reputation for criminal tendency they opt to commit more crime? This is exactly the logic behind "multiculturalists" that make excuses for Islamist aggression - "because of the hostility of the host society", etc. Why is it so hard to stray even for a moment from this pathological victimization?

    I don't think that it is illogical to agree that many poor people will generally commit crimes of robbery , muggings , etc against richer people.
    No it isn't. But people aren't Pavlov's dogs. The threshold for engaging in criminal activities varies.

    The fact that coloured people are generally poorer than white people in this materialistic/consumer/status driven society could , falsely imo , lead to the assumption ( as is the case here ) coloured people are more inclined to commit such crimes because of racial make up.
    So what is the magical force that consistently produces the same phenomenal coincidences of Negroids commiting more crimes than Europids commiting more crimes than East Asian Mongolids (proportionately) all over the world, then?
    You can realize the validity of the observation even following your premises if you stop omitting one piece in your chain of logic:

    Underlying premise - acquisition of wealth within a framework of a structured set of rules depends on racial make up

    little wealth leads to crime ---> people of certain racial make up have little wealth ---> people of certain racial make up are more prone to commit crime

    Bearing the underlying premise in mind - the propensity to commit crime depends on racial make up.

    But this accounts for financially motivated crime only, doesn't it? For all crime to be the cause of poverty and financially motivated one would assume financial gain always from criminal activity. This is not the case, however, and you know it.

    The difference in who commits/commited the crimes in these areas ? None. In my first home it was very much a mixture. Poor black people , poor Asian people ,poor white people were the ones . In my current home , just white poor people. The common denominator was/is poverty not race
    Why do you cling to irrelevancies? The case has not been about who commits crime, but proportion and nature of crime! You expect people to share your views of truths drawing them from personal anecdotes rather than statistics and scientific assessment of the psychological differences of groups of people? A family member of mine has lived his entire life in one of Finland's poorest towns, and it shows, but I'm not delusional enough to compare that town to Detroit or claim that he is mentally sound.

    So it must be true that working class mass culture is the inherent problem with criminality ? No. It is the system that perpetuates and maintains the conditions of such an obscene disparity in living standards that leads to such a culture
    And a better alternative would be a system that nurtures the underdogs and good-for-nothings on the expense of others, I guess. How about some personal responsibility? Its easy to point fingers and blame others for ones own flaws and shortcomings.

  4. #114
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    I know I said I wouldn't post in this thread again but feel the need to address the following post. The reason is that both of the other members I replied to recently at least had the objectivity to accept that race and crime , certainly the crimes covered involving violent robbery and such , enjoyed some relationship with poverty and this is where SubGnostics post differs and thus singles itself out for a reply. No offence to the other members who posted great responses to my views on the subject . Thx

    Quote Originally Posted by SubGnostic View Post
    And you fail to see the demographic development of European societies as a factor of this change. If you compare the living standards of Negroids living in the US to that of poor Europeans a century or more ago, according to your pattern of thought they should've had even higher propensity for crime.
    Well the truth is they did but maybe you choose to ignore it because it contradicts your views. If we take a look at British criminality from say 1700-1900 ( when the vast majority of the population was white) you will find that the historical record confirms a great concern for the levels of criminality within society.

    The aristocracy believed that there was a " criminal class " ( genetically programmed to commit heinous crimes ) of people within their nations. Their reaction ( similar to your own ) was to dismiss the horrendous poverty and judicial inequality these people endured and opted to blame it on inherent/inate personal traits , cultural differences ,etc.........Sound familiar?

    The aristocracy didn't have the convenient scapegoat of race to fall back on as the " criminal class " was of the same ethnic/racial make-up as themselves. The exception being the case with the Irish immigrants to England who could and were subjected to the same scapegoating/racism we have seen ever since in many different societies. People like yourself perpetuate it but it is through the same blinkered vision ( no doubt based on racial superiority ) as was employed by 18th century aristocrats
    Some of the crimes we witness today would have been unheard of back then.
    As societies change so do the types of crime within them. There is nothing new about that. :

    So what is the excuse for Negroid crime? Do they absolutely need to live criminal lives?
    According to your highly subjective view.........yes. Others like to take more into account than just race when assessing crime and its causes. Is that a crime ?


    Really? eyes: Your view (a traditional socialist one) of humanity reduces different groups of people into a grey, uniform mass distinguished from one another only by environmental trivialities. This is what I oppose..
    And that is a traditional right wing view of socialism eyes:

    See, the irony is that you support a system that relies on , and has a great history of , the importing of cheap foreign labour. ( people of different ethnicities/races) Then you decide to bemoan the resultant demographic changes in the landscape. The social flux caused by this practice which benefits only the ruling classes will need to be externalized by the machine that created it. Hence.......... the immigrant labour itself is blamed for the ills of society....... and the system that is the true cause will escape the backlash as a result. vis a vis the destructive nature of capitalism with regards to racial and social relations is concealed....... well from many it is :p

    It's an old trick that seems never to fail. Strangely Pavlovian in some respects


    For you to believe in your statement and its further implications without (consciously) sacrificing your intellectual integrity along the way, you would have to believe that different groups of people have no differences in distribution and quality of innate psychological traits and aptitudes whatsoever. So, are different groups of people identical in terms of psychological traits/mentality? If there are differences, then it would not be unfounded to suggest that there lies a difference in traits influencing criminal propensity..
    I have some bad news for you. I have no intellectual integrity to sacrifice ( see education thread post ) so I am able to respond freely as ever

    It may come as a surprise to you that I do believe there are different traits/mentalities between the differing and diverse faces of humanity and it is something that I have great interest in and enjoy learning about.

    I just think that the propensity to commit crime isn't one and any attempt at studying crime and its relationship to the racial question is only valid if it takes into account the social conditions that created the criminal. To dismiss out of hand the effects of unemployment ,education , community conditions etc etc is a highly narrowminded approach
    That doesn't happen. What we see and what you fail to recognize or admit is proportion..
    Yes it does happen...........there are vastly more threads here concerned with the crimes of other races , immigrants etc than there are of crimes committed by Germanics. That's not a complaint , I mean it is to be expected , it's just a fact.

    No I don't. I just choose to use proportions reasonably. IE hypothetical statement........ More black people get caught stealing than white people in Joe Bloggs town , statistically. That's fine. .......... if we include the statistics that say there are far more poor black people there than poor white people. I don't think it unreasonable to suggest that the temptation to steal what one can't afford to buy will be more prevalent in poorer people



    So, because non-Europids of non-Asian background have and have had a reputation for criminal tendency they opt to commit more crime? This is exactly the logic behind "multiculturalists" that make excuses for Islamist aggression - "because of the hostility of the host society", etc. Why is it so hard to stray even for a moment from this pathological victimization?.
    There is no " pathological victimization " eyes:............. step outside the bubble.

    Western governments in the view of most people in the West have a " reputation " for benevolence.

    Not all reputations are deserved and under closer scrutiny can be utterly demolished. I tend to be skeptical of " reputations ".


    So what is the magical force that consistently produces the same phenomenal coincidences of Negroids commiting more crimes than Europids commiting more crimes than East Asian Mongolids (proportionately) all over the world, then?.
    The easiest answer would be to suggest that black slavery was largely abolished in only practice and not in reality. Not in the mentalities of the black and white people themselves.


    little wealth leads to crime ---> people of certain racial make up have little wealth ---> people of certain racial make up are more prone to commit crime
    Bearing the underlying premise in mind - the propensity to commit crime depends on racial make up..
    You choose to select race as the cause whilst ignoring wealth ( or the lack of it ) We just differ

    But this accounts for financially motivated crime only, doesn't it? For all crime to be the cause of poverty and financially motivated one would assume financial gain always from criminal activity. This is not the case, however, and you know it..
    I do know it and I refered to it earlier when discussing murder as a crime. You must have missed it.



    And a better alternative would be a system that nurtures the underdogs and good-for-nothings on the expense of others, I guess. How about some personal responsibility? Its easy to point fingers and blame others for ones own flaws and shortcomings.
    Once again a very stereotypical propagandist view of socialism.

    As for capitalism V socialism ............already answered earlier in this post .

    This is not the thread to discuss it but feel free to start a seperate one
    By three methods we may learn wisdom: First, by reflection, which is noblest; Second, by imitation, which is easiest; and third by experience, which is the bitterest.

  5. #115
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    As far as neighborhoods go, crime creates poverty, not the other way around. There are many formerly nice, middle class neighborhoods which for some reason or other begin to attract a criminal element, at which point everyone who can afford to moves out of such neighborhood, property values decline, businesses relocate when they have a hard time attracting customers who don't want to go into a high-crime area, and the neighborhood goes downhill.

    Lack of money doesn't create violent/degenerate behavior, violent/degenerate behavior chases away anyone who can afford to flee.
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  6. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by SwordOfTheVistula View Post
    As far as neighborhoods go, crime creates poverty, not the other way around. There are many formerly nice, middle class neighborhoods which for some reason or other begin to attract a criminal element, at which point everyone who can afford to moves out of such neighborhood, property values decline, businesses relocate when they have a hard time attracting customers who don't want to go into a high-crime area, and the neighborhood goes downhill.

    Lack of money doesn't create violent/degenerate behavior, violent/degenerate behavior chases away anyone who can afford to flee.

    well they can't steal from the poor.. so they steal from people who have 'things' of value. making our middle class neighborhoods ghetto.

  7. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by SwordOfTheVistula View Post
    As far as neighborhoods go, crime creates poverty, not the other way around. There are many formerly nice, middle class neighborhoods which for some reason or other begin to attract a criminal element, at which point everyone who can afford to moves out of such neighborhood, property values decline, businesses relocate when they have a hard time attracting customers who don't want to go into a high-crime area, and the neighborhood goes downhill.

    Lack of money doesn't create violent/degenerate behavior, violent/degenerate behavior chases away anyone who can afford to flee.
    It is totally the opposite to what you claim SoV. Businesses largely relocate to find cheaper pools of labour in developing countries where health and safety , environmental responsibilities can be flouted. More profits as a result.

    The western communities ( in no small part built around the manufacturing complex ) are left in total disarray by the changes and the resultant unemployment leads to poverty , crime and the breakdown of the community.

    Take a look at Flint for example................... but it is the same story everywhere else. In fact the evidence is overwhelming.
    By three methods we may learn wisdom: First, by reflection, which is noblest; Second, by imitation, which is easiest; and third by experience, which is the bitterest.

  8. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by skyhawk View Post
    It is totally the opposite to what you claim SoV.
    Well, both points are valid, just because what you say is true too, doesn't mean what SoV said is wrong.
    No thing in the universe is monocausal, not even your poverty -> crime simplification.
    "Nothing is more disgusting than the majority: because it consists of a few powerful predecessors, of rogues who adapt themselves, of weak who assimilate themselves, and the masses who imitate without knowing at all what they want." (Johann Wolfgang Goethe)

  9. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jäger View Post
    Well, both points are valid, just because what you say is true too, doesn't mean what SoV said is wrong.
    No thing in the universe is monocausal, not even your poverty -> crime simplification.
    I never said poverty = crime , my stance is when analyzing crime , and in particular when analyzing crimes involving theft , poverty as a factor must be included in those studies.

    I agree with you things are not monocausal and that's not what I am implying. Maybe I should have said " in the vast majority of cases " for the sake of clarity.
    By three methods we may learn wisdom: First, by reflection, which is noblest; Second, by imitation, which is easiest; and third by experience, which is the bitterest.

  10. #120
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    @Skyhawk

    Quote Originally Posted by SwordOfTheVistula View Post
    As far as neighborhoods go, crime creates poverty, not the other way around. There are many formerly nice, middle class neighborhoods which for some reason or other begin to attract a criminal element, at which point everyone who can afford to moves out of such neighborhood, property values decline, businesses relocate when they have a hard time attracting customers who don't want to go into a high-crime area, and the neighborhood goes downhill.

    Lack of money doesn't create violent/degenerate behavior, violent/degenerate behavior chases away anyone who can afford to flee.
    For a perfectly good example of what SoTV is talking about, look into the history of housing projects in Chicago. Most of the buildings over there being torn down are half the age or less of the houses and buildings I've lived in. They need to be torn down because the people who lived there didn't take care of them (most likely because they didn't have to pay for them or even really to live there.) They were beautiful buildings with pre planned neighborhoods (parks, pools etc) when they were built, less than 60 years later they are condemned and being used as crack houses. A perfect example of blacks being lifted out of poverty by the state, only to quickly revert back to it left to their own devices (except for the welfare checks and all of that.) Main point- The crime followed the black community despite their being removed from poverty.

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