View Poll Results: Can you be a Muslim and be a Germanic preservationist too?

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Thread: Islam & Germanic Identity

  1. #171
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    Quote Originally Posted by Angelcynn Beorn View Post
    There's a not so subtle inference there that faith and logic can't co-exist together.
    If God is almighty, can he create a stone that is so heavy he can't lift it?
    "Nothing is more disgusting than the majority: because it consists of a few powerful predecessors, of rogues who adapt themselves, of weak who assimilate themselves, and the masses who imitate without knowing at all what they want." (Johann Wolfgang Goethe)

  2. #172
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    I never said Germanics should convert to Islam. I merely wanted to point out some little known aspects about Islam in order to draw on the discussion. I also felt Islam was worthy of defence. I concur with Ben Klassens essay on Islam in his book "Natures Eternal religion" bk 2 chapter 11. There is no quick link to this but it is worth a read.

    I didn't come on skadi to talk politics or Hitler but since others brought it up, I believe in his table talk he said that If Europe had converted to Islam instead of Christianity the whole world would now be White. You see Germanics have a talent for practical organisation and tend to rise. Within Islam they would do so, just as the Ottomans ended up being controlled by Jannisaries and Marmelukes. Just as the Turks were directed by German officers in WW1.
    The problem is our people are in a fix and there seems no way out of it. Even if a switch were thrown and all non-whites disappeared tomorrow, Germanics would still go extinct within fifty years. They are saddled with bad habits, a sick culture, confusion, materialism, brain pollution, silly ideas, under-confidence and severence from natures laws. And all this when the world is spinning into an environmental crisis.
    I do believe religion is the solution as opposed to politics.
    What people are identifying and in a way are envious of in Islam , is that Religion, though imaginary and at bottom a delusion, is a very powerful force for group cohesion, collectivism, survival and defence. The problem is that science has shown religions to be archaic and redundant to intelligent educated people such as modern Europeans.
    The question is; can we do without the stone age explanations about the universe? Can we go back to the garden of Nature and figure out its laws and apply them for our own survival as a new religion.
    Why bother picking over Islam and Christianity for scraps of Wisdom. Its like looking through a barrel of rotten apples for an edible morsel. Why do this, when we can go to the garden of nature, study its laws and pick a whole new barrel of clean, fresh apples, sparkling and fresh.
    I believe the Creativity Religion can and does do this and presents a real antidote to the problems our people face,

  3. #173
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    I am finding difficult to think some think that Islam could sustain or produce a nation of "whites".

    I think the Islamic world today sees it self engaged in a race war, and they see all Whites as jews or christians. They want to behead us all. We are still many years away from the part of this war when they decide if they will let any of us live if we convert to Islam.

    So don't bitch up yet and buy a prayer rug. Islam would see us all dead... christian, atheist, heathen, communist, capitalist, intellectual, blue-collar, warrior, pacifist, American, European, Russian, Serbian, or whatever.

  4. #174
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    Wink Take the extra step...

    I often wonder why people are reticent to take the obvious step when it comes time to discuss Islam and Christianity. I'm talking metaphysics here, so bear with me.

    First of all, the Jews have complete rights to their (inscrutable, but they deserve Him) deity and they can do what they want with their religion. They invented it. It's theirs. 'Nuff said.

    But Christians and Muslims are a special breed of whack job, since they took the Jewish tribal religion and turned it into something that is ultimately corrosive of their own people, their own tribes, their own nations. What a maddening bit of self-interest-defeating behavior.

    So it occurs to me that one good explanation for all of this self-defeating behavior is that there actually is a demonic agency involved. Let's assume that there is a "YHWH" of some sort, but that it is a particularly powerful desert djinn. Hardly the creator of the universe. Just a really potent evil spirit. It infects people with madness. And that madness can get passed from person to person, somewhat like vampirism.

    Look, if you're not chuckling at this idea yet then you're taking it WAY too seriously. But still, if we assume that YHWH, Jesus, and Allah are all manifestations of a spooky desert djinn, then it really clears up a lot of bizarre behavior.

  5. #175
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jäger View Post
    If God is almighty, can he create a stone that is so heavy he can't lift it?
    This is a very ignorant question, which is illogical at best.
    Can God make a married bachelor?
    Don´t you see that the words themselves make the question illogical?
    People can string any amount of words together and ask if God could do it, but it makes the words lose meaning.

  6. #176
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    The problem is known as the Omnipotence paradox and it can be interpreted as the question whether an omnipotent being is bound to its own constructs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Augustine of Hippo
    For He is called omnipotent on account of His doing what He wills, not on account of His suffering what He wills not; for if that should befall Him, He would by no means be omnipotent. Wherefore, He cannot do some things for the very reason that He is omnipotent.

  7. #177
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ormus View Post
    This is a very ignorant question, which is illogical at best.
    Can God make a married bachelor?
    Don´t you see that the words themselves make the question illogical?
    The logic is sound: "Can God create a stone that is so heavy you can't lift it?"
    This is sound, now if I substitute "you" with "he" it becomes illogical? This doesn't follow, it is no oxymoron, as you suggested, it is a paradox, he can't do both things at the same time, because they are mutually exclusive, and thus isn't all mighty
    Contrary to this, a married bachelor is indeed just a question of the definition of the words, this is not the case here.
    "Nothing is more disgusting than the majority: because it consists of a few powerful predecessors, of rogues who adapt themselves, of weak who assimilate themselves, and the masses who imitate without knowing at all what they want." (Johann Wolfgang Goethe)

  8. #178
    Senior Member Cythraul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by forkbeard View Post
    I never said Germanics should convert to Islam.
    Well forgive me but you seem to have suggested on occasion that it is our only, or best option.

    Quote Originally Posted by forkbeard View Post
    I believe in his table talk he said that If Europe had converted to Islam instead of Christianity the whole world would now be White.
    Problem is - some of us don't want the whole world to be white. I can't think of anything more hypocritical than to be an ethno-preservationist who wants to eradicate all others. Incidentally, that is one of the problems I have with Islam - the absolutism of it. The concept of dar al-Islam and dar al-harb (the land of peace and the land of war) makes Islamic intention clear. Why would I want to adopt the same wasteful policy in the opposite direction?

    Quote Originally Posted by forkbeard View Post
    Even if a switch were thrown and all non-whites disappeared tomorrow, Germanics would still go extinct within fifty years. They are saddled with bad habits, a sick culture, confusion, materialism, brain pollution, silly ideas, under-confidence and severence from natures laws. And all this when the world is spinning into an environmental crisis.
    I suppose Muslims are perfectly in tune with nature's laws are they? Yes we have our problems, but they are not ethno-specific. We are no more materialistic than Islam's adherents (if one of its ultimate heavenly prizes is lust-orientated), we are no less in tune with nature, and if you want to talk bad habits and silly ideas - try pulling out a matt numerous times a day, facing East and honouring a god who chooses paedophiles for prophets. We suffer these spiritual afflictions because we suffer a collective amnesisa, not because we refuse to embrace something new.

    Quote Originally Posted by forkbeard View Post
    Why do this, when we can go to the garden of nature, study its laws and pick a whole new barrel of clean, fresh apples, sparkling and fresh.
    If you're suggesting that Islam is in tune with nature, how do you explain the attitude towards dogs and pigs? How do you explain the fact that almost all Muslims in Britain live in towns and cities and rarely venture beyond the smoke unless travelling the motorways?

    Some people choose to view Islam through rose-tinted spectacles, which is understandable when faced with our frustrating state of affairs. We are clearly in need a of a big change, but Islam is absolutely not the answer. In attempting to preserve our race we'd be forsaking everything that makes our race vital.
    "If by being a racialist, you mean a man who despises a human being because he belongs to another race, or a man that believes one race is inherently superior to another in civilisation or capability of civilisation, then the answer is emphatically no." - Enoch Powell

  9. #179
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cythraul View Post
    I can't think of anything more hypocritical than to be an ethno-preservationist who wants to eradicate all others.
    That is indeed a very strange goal. It is better to think of outsiders as either tools or obstacles for our own goals and to act accordingly. The end result of this is not relevant and it is indeed unlikely to be the complete eradication of everyone else.

    Ethnopluralism on the other hand would require a superordinate zoo keeper that maintains the static existence of all groups. No power able to do this would be willing to do this. The US, for example, is clearly trying to overcome the Augustean threshold instead (Herfried Münkler: Empires: The Logic of World Domination from Ancient Rome to the US, 2007).

    Quote Originally Posted by Cythraul View Post
    Incidentally, that is one of the problems I have with Islam - the absolutism of it. The concept of dar al-Islam and dar al-harb (the land of peace and the land of war) makes Islamic intention clear.
    We need to regain such a division, except not on religious grounds (Christendom), but instead on folkish grounds. If it is possible to bring both in sync, then it is even better.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cythraul View Post
    Why would I want to adopt the same wasteful policy in the opposite direction?
    In order to help your extended family survive as a group, which Muslims are annoyingly good at despite failing at anything beyond that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cythraul View Post
    We suffer these spiritual afflictions because we suffer a collective amnesisa, not because we refuse to embrace something new.
    There is indeed not much new about Islam, but it is a practical example that can be studied in order to learn about the effects various social policies can have.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cythraul View Post
    We are clearly in need a of a big change, but Islam is absolutely not the answer.
    It is more like a disease, exposing our immune deficiency. I very much doubt that Islam as a complete system would yield desirable results, even if it was a schismatic variant similar to Shī‘ah that could keep actual Muslims away.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cythraul View Post
    In attempting to preserve our race we'd be forsaking everything that makes our race vital.
    What exactly is 'everything'?

  10. #180
    Senior Member Cythraul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hauke Haien View Post
    Ethnopluralism on the other hand would require a superordinate zoo keeper that maintains the static existence of all groups.
    Yes. But whilst it is not our job to ensure anything but our own survival, we should not actively seek the eradication of all else. The wider global implications of our subjective struggle must not be for us (or any one group) to predetermine.

    Perhaps it's because of my interest in the esoteric commonalities among ancient cultures, but I value most of the world's traditions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hauke Haien View Post
    We need to regain such a division, except not on religious grounds (Christendom), but instead on folkish grounds.
    I'm not sure it's the same thing. The concept of dar al-Islam and dar al-harb signifies that all outside of Islam's realm is to be converted - by violent means if necessary. We Germanics have our realm - Europe and the colonies - and as far as I'm concerned, we do not need to spread beyond that. What we need is to protect the land that belongs to us and make no aspirations for further colonisation. After all, if we want a divide based on folkish interests as opposed to religious ones, what better dividing line than that which separates the lands of our ancestors from the lands that never belonged to them?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hauke Haien View Post
    It is more like a disease, exposing our immune deficiency.
    I fully agree, and I think that's precisely why some Germanic preservationists choose to revere Islam - not because it is the cure for Germanicism's problems, but because it has managed to diagnose those problems we have.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hauke Haien View Post
    What exactly is 'everything'?
    Germanicism's identity consists of race, culture and religion. Islam could only ever serve to preserve us racially. Protecting racial integrity at the cost of culture and religion would be the net result, and that's a hollow victory to everyone except those interested only in how Germanics look. It's an absolutely superficial approach to preservationism. Whilst I'm interested in preserving the racial make-up of Germanics, I'm as much (if not more) interested in preserving the way of life. And yes, Christianity is as alien as Islam, but it is less forgiving (by its very nature - the nature that is often identified as inferior to Islam) in its destruction of folkish tradition.
    "If by being a racialist, you mean a man who despises a human being because he belongs to another race, or a man that believes one race is inherently superior to another in civilisation or capability of civilisation, then the answer is emphatically no." - Enoch Powell

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