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Thread: North Korea - A Communist Nation?

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    Post Video clips of North Korea

    The first four are MUST SEE:
    CLIP 1

    CLIP 2

    CLIP 3

    CLIP 4

    CLIP 5

    MILITARY PARADES, ETC.

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    Post Re: Video clips of North Korea - the REAL North Korea

    Margaritas ante porcas.
    When I look upon seamen, men of science and philosophers, man is the wisest of all beings; when I look upon priests and prophets nothing is as contemptible as man. Diogenes

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    Post Re: Video clips of North Korea - the REAL North Korea

    Quote Originally Posted by Social-Nationalist
    Thank you for the nice clips, I've been looking for the last one since I deleted it by a mistake (you can often see it at North Korean TV).

    You wanna tell us how the "real North Korea" is. So my first question: Have you ever been there?

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    Post Re: Video clips of North Korea - the REAL North Korea

    Ceausescu used to order the production of such media. Of course, the reality was different. The stores were empty, often power shortages were at the order of the day and so on. Of course, in those times, the industry still worked, there was still a CAER (the economical community of communist Eastern Europe), so people were having jobs and a minimal life level was insured. After 1989, all of that felt and it is like everywhere, the strongest, the most intelligent and the most active are at their best. The other ones are just trying to survive.

    I don't know whether you noticed an element in the films. In one of them, I think the second or perhaps the first, there is a big bridge of a river. Notice please the number of cars you see. There is preactically none, besides a couple of buses. So, beware of the mis-en-scenes made by communists, they are expert on that.

    Second, North Korea has a whole lot experience on this. During the communism, at the international fairs in Bucharest, we received such leaflets or brochures where the wonderful life of North Korea was explained.

    And also, somebody commented here, "jewels for pigs". I wouldn't say so, my friend. Look at everything in further Asia. What wa Japan 60 years ago? Plane nothing, a society almost stuck in the Middle Ages. What is it now? One of the best developped nations of the world. We cannot just say, they are not white, they are not good. We don't want them here, but we can at least agree with their realisations. Rationaliaty must be used and not dogmatics. We won't preserve anything if we just base our reasoning on dogmatics.
    And look at Malaysia, Taiwan and to China. I think in 50 years, Europe will be no match on International economic level for them, unless we became more unite and more capable of working together as European nations and try to forget historical differends.

    A man stuck with historical differends is a retard, in my humble oppinion.
    Last edited by Marius; Tuesday, September 28th, 2004 at 09:11 AM.

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    Post Re: Video clips of North Korea - the REAL North Korea

    I can see definite anti-communist logic at work here. If the DPRK is depicted in a positive light, it is only because "it's all staged". If people are protesting against their government, it is because it is tyrannical and oppressive and the people abominate it; if they are not protesting against the government, it is because they are afraid to do so and are repressed. If the Churches are full, it is because people are rejecting socialism; if they are empty, it is because religionists are persecuted. Everything which portrays the country positively is staged, always staged; everything which doesn't fit into the preconceived model is rejected, which amounts to everything positive, all contrary evidence. This is identical to conspiracy theorist methodology.

    We hear a lot of contradictory claims about the DPRK. Like the DPRK government is both all pervasive, the most well consolidated nation state in the world perhaps, and yet it's on the brink of collapse. If the DPRK were on the brink of collapse would everyone in Pyongang be a puppet theater actor to regime? The DPRK is a backwards nation with mass starvation...but its technologically and industrialy sophisticated to the point of nuclear weapondry and ICBMs and space flight. How many other backwards, starving nations do you think can make nuclear weapons and put sattilitse into orbit...because it requirse a bit more then starving rice farmers to do that.
    I don't know whether you noticed an element in the films. In one of them, I think the second or perhaps the first, there is a big bridge of a river. Notice please the number of cars you see. There is preactically none, besides a couple of buses. So, beware of the mis-en-scenes made by communists, they are expert on that.
    I have seen just as much traffic in Vancouver at certain times. And in the DPRK, almost ALL transportation is public. Go visit it and see for yourself.

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    Post Re: Video clips of North Korea - the REAL North Korea

    I am sorry to tell you, but I see exactly the logic of a guy who really never knew what communism really meant. My friend, I lived in Romania during communism. Ok, let me describe it for you, perhaps you would finally understand:

    1. Ceausescu, around the 1980s decided he must hyper-industrialise the country. Ok, good point, but he had nothing too much to start with. No problem, he start building the Danube-Black See Channel. With who? With students and people brought there to work somehow by force. Ok, he built the House of People (currently House of Parliament, the second world wide building in dimensions, after the Pentagon), he ordered the contruction of another big Channel, Bucharest-Danube (it's not even now finished, the governements after 1989 deserted it, somehow tragic, a lot of money went there before) and also, many huge siderurgical (steel processing) plants and a lot of heavy industry plants were built in the whole country. And, finally, in collaboration with Candu, some Canadian company, he ordered the building of a nuclear plant. So, it was also foreseen that in few years to be also capable of having nuclear weapons. Before 1989, Romania produced: line planes IAR Rombac 1-11, helicopters, three models of cars (Dacia, based on Renault, Oltcit, based on Citroën and Aro, a 4x4 Romanian model), tractors, agriculture machines, ...

    2. Do you know how people lived during this time? There were electricity cut-offs, in order to make the most economy of electricity as possible. Everything, including bread, gas and kitchen oil were rationed, you could not find anything in the stores, only perhaps pig feet. People used to stay in attendaing queues DAYS before the had found out new products would be brought.

    3. Do you know how the nomenklatur lived during all this time? In luxury villas, with good cars and with restaurants and hotels to which the access was forbidden to the simple Romanian. In fact, they also do that today, but not from political reasons, but from financial ones. They are the richest.

    4. Do you know or imagine what does it mean to have in each office, in each community, no matter its number of people, around 15%-20% secret service informers? Can you imagine what terror that means? That you cannot really oppose to something you don't like, cause immediately you would have been taken into custody by the Police or your family would have had troubles? No, I really think you cannot imagine. Pitty!

    5. Do you know that during the last years of Ceausescu we had only 2 hours per day of TV time? During all this time, the happy life of a Romanian was shown and the huge support meetings (which in reality were forced, we were taken out from school to sign with flags on stadiums, to be filmed) for Ceausescu was underlined and widely presented.

    And yes, I am anti-communist and also anti-nazist. I really had it with living under dictatureship regimes. I am sorry if that dissapoints some dictatureship fans on Skadi, but this is my oppinion and I am proud to sustain it.

    Romania is in the current economical situation because since 1930 to 1944 had a nazi dictature and next, since 1947 to 1989, it had a communist one.


    Quote Originally Posted by Social-Nationalist
    I can see definite anti-communist logic at work here. If the DPRK is depicted in a positive light, it is only because "it's all staged". If people are protesting against their government, it is because it is tyrannical and oppressive and the people abominate it; if they are not protesting against the government, it is because they are afraid to do so and are repressed. If the Churches are full, it is because people are rejecting socialism; if they are empty, it is because religionists are persecuted. Everything which portrays the country positively is staged, always staged; everything which doesn't fit into the preconceived model is rejected, which amounts to everything positive, all contrary evidence. This is identical to conspiracy theorist methodology.

    We hear a lot of contradictory claims about the DPRK. Like the DPRK government is both all pervasive, the most well consolidated nation state in the world perhaps, and yet it's on the brink of collapse. If the DPRK were on the brink of collapse would everyone in Pyongang be a puppet theater actor to regime? The DPRK is a backwards nation with mass starvation...but its technologically and industrialy sophisticated to the point of nuclear weapondry and ICBMs and space flight. How many other backwards, starving nations do you think can make nuclear weapons and put sattilitse into orbit...because it requirse a bit more then starving rice farmers to do that.

    I have seen just as much traffic in Vancouver at certain times. And in the DPRK, almost ALL transportation is public. Go visit it and see for yourself.

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    Post Re: Video clips of North Korea - the REAL North Korea

    I was talking about the DPRK, not Romania. I know next to nothing about Romania. All I know is that Romania under Ceausescu's leadership was very different from the DPRK. I know supporters of Ceausescu in Communist organisations I have been a member of and people who have lived in Romania and preferred life under the leadership of Ceausescu, and could counter what you're saying, and I've seen them do it before; and I know that a clear majority of Romanians are of the same opinion, that 60% prefer life under Ceausescu's leadership, but this is all I know. I haven't studied the country as yet, and I won't take your word for it, nor that of any article you might chance to post, until I have studied it thoroughly, as I have the DRPRK, so as not to arrive at any opinions prematurely.

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    Post Re: Video clips of North Korea - the REAL North Korea

    Quote Originally Posted by Social-Nationalist
    I was talking about the DPRK, not Romania. I know next to nothing about Romania. All I know is that Romania under Ceausescu's leadership was very different from the DPRK. I know supporters of Ceausescu in Communist organisations I have been a member of and people who have lived in Romania and preferred life under the leadership of Ceausescu, and could counter what you're saying, and I've seen them do it before; and I know that a clear majority of Romanians are of the same opinion, that 60% prefer life under Ceausescu's leadership, but this is all I know. I haven't studied the country as yet, and I won't take your word for it, nor that of any article you might chance to post, until I have studied it thoroughly, as I have the DRPRK, so as not to arrive at any opinions prematurely.
    So, should I understand you visited North Korea? I think they just have treated you like a foreign guest, who they took only to the nicest places and never left him talk to any normal man, only to brainwashed and previously prepared people... Ceausescu used to that, too.

    Hm.. Living in Romania in Ceausescu times. What was different?

    1. The law is more enforced, that does not mean the important people of the regime, even if at lower level could not do whatever they wanted.

    2. Because of the infiltration with secret service agents and collaborators, many had fear to steal or something like that, but in the same time, the idea that nothing is private, so everything is our's, formed that time and gave place to luding and steeling after 1989.

    3. A minimal life level was insured. In two or three years after your request was registered you could have received and paid a color TV set, then also in a few years, a flat and also after a few years a car. There was no financial help for that, or credit possibility, NOTHING.

    Of course, all this disappeared after 1989 and it worstened after 1985. Now, everything is concurrential, you have to be good to move, to understand and to act quick. Also, the life is tough, of you do not put down others in front of you, they will put you down, eventually. This is perhaps the people you are speaking about, told you that. But, from this, to 60% believing that it was better on Ceausescu timed it's a long distance and people always tend to forget the difficult parts, especially when they are so nostalgic.
    Last edited by Marius; Friday, October 1st, 2004 at 10:53 AM.

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    Post Re: Video clips of North Korea - the REAL North Korea

    Quote Originally Posted by marius
    Do you know that during the last years of Ceausescu we had only 2 hours per day of TV time?
    Oh my goodness! This is terrible! "Only" 2 hours of TV time a day... I cannot possibly imagine what people did in their free time.

    Constantin

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    Post Re: Video clips of North Korea - the REAL North Korea

    Quote Originally Posted by ogenoct
    I cannot possibly imagine what people did in their free time.

    Constantin
    They were living signs at attending queues for products at the supermarkets. Unfortunately, it's not a joke.

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