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Thread: Nihilism - The Continuity of Life

  1. #21
    Senior Member Leof's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IlluSionSxxx View Post
    I wouldn't say the problem is just their rationality. Rationality can be a good thing when applied wisely. I'd say their problem is the faith they have in the rationality of others. The believe in the individual because they know from their own experience that the individual is capable of evolving into a higher state of consciousness, but they do not realise how uncommon individuals with such capabilities really are.
    I agree there, nihilism tends to recreate the Christian docterine in that sense. The biggest problem with nihilism is that the nihilists only focus on mans superior traits and shun the negative ones which are still a part of him. The end result is an even more impossible moral structure. This is something Julius Evola and Carl Jung came upon and turned instead toward the integration of the shadow.

    I highly recommend you try Julius Evola's book, Ride the Tiger. Even people who don't like Evola like that book because he uses a very down to Earth writing method and leaves out a lot of his own manifesto and simply gives well thought out criticisms of the church and why it fell apart, why nihilism in turn fell apart and why the world that we are in today is destined to fall apart. He is not preachy nore overally venomous towards these establishments and seems to give them their due none the less.

  2. #22
    Senior Member Kurtz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IlluSionSxxx View Post
    Caste differentiation inevitably leads to class differentiation, I agree here. Still, both are two different concepts that shouldn't be mixed.
    Right. They are two concepts, but are mixed in the historic Indian caste system.


    Quote Originally Posted by IlluSionSxxx View Post
    But in the end, all lineages will lose their strength and others will develop. In a hereditary hierarchy, there is no option to replace a decaying elite by a new rising elite. In a national-socialist society, there is.
    An aristocracy has so many branches, it is almost impossible that the good blood run dry. A lineage loses strenght, then by addition of new high quality blood regains vigor. If the blood of poor quality is mixed, the lineage continues to decline. This is a cycle.


    Quote Originally Posted by IlluSionSxxx View Post
    The art of a volk represents the soul of a volk. It is not just the expression of the individual talents in the volk, but of the volk itself.
    Agreed to some extent. Though I think the greatest art, albeit linked to blood and culture, reflects the individual talents over all. This is why Ancient art can still touch our souls.


    Quote Originally Posted by IlluSionSxxx View Post
    The process of enlightenment is a process that must be taken individually, but the result of enlightenment actually makes a person more conscious of how small a part he is the great cosmic machine. Hence, enlightenment actually leads a person away from selfishness and individualism and towards collective interests.
    Agreed 100% with the first sentence. Agreed to some extent with the last. We recognize our own limited value, but we also learn, in an oblique way, the lack of meaning of everything. Including the volk. So both the individual and the volk have no a priori importance, though we should view both as meaningful. We should give them a meaning.

    Quote Originally Posted by IlluSionSxxx View Post
    A member of the volk still remains but a part of the greater sum, but the parts don't have to be of equal size. Geniuses and heroes inevitably make up a much greater part of the volk than your average Joe Public, because of the greatness of their personalities. Nevertheless, they too are but a part of the volk and shouldn't look at them as individuals.

    Like the wolf, man is a group animal and the survival and welfare of the group are inevitably connected to the survival and welfare of the individual.
    We should look to geniuses as individuals first and foremost, in my opinion. I beg to differ.

    For you last paragraph: we can't talk of survival now. Technology changed everything. I think that the right to be part of the volk is something one should be up to, by being talented or hard-working. There is no absolute welfare pertaining to a whole society. Whole groups of people could disappear, and that doesn't threaten the rest of the nation. It is sometimes even the contrary.



    Quote Originally Posted by IlluSionSxxx View Post
    From a national-socialist point of view, freedom is the ability to live a healthy and harmonious life with as little restraints as possible. This is the kind of freedom national-socialists strife for.
    I agree with healthy and harmonious as some völkisch ideal. But this is utopian, given that we are all more or less melancholic, frustrated, longing creatures unable to satisfy themselves with how things are.

    Quote Originally Posted by IlluSionSxxx View Post
    Isn't this a discussion of nihilism vs. national-socialism? Isn't this therefore still a more or less on-topic discussion? :
    Yes, if we keep this course, it is. There is no need for a thread-split now, I realize.
    "The heavenly motions... are nothing but a continuous song for several voices, perceived not by the ear but by the intellect,
    a figured music which sets landmarks
    in the immeasurable flow of time."

  3. #23
    Senior Member IlluSionSxxx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurtz View Post
    An aristocracy has so many branches, it is almost impossible that the good blood run dry. A lineage loses strenght, then by addition of new high quality blood regains vigor. If the blood of poor quality is mixed, the lineage continues to decline. This is a cycle.
    Let me take my own example... My girlfriend comes from a bourgeois family of intellectuals and industrialists. Her family is literally filled with lawyers, doctors, architects and used to be among the upper class of the region. Yet, some of these people hold simple labor class jobs (eg. waiter) and one of my girlfriend's uncles even ruined the (once very succesful) family business that her greatgrandfather started and her grandfather built up.

    I come from a lower middle class family of cleaning ladies, factory workers, accountants, nurses and seamstresses. As an IT consultant, I'm one of the highest educated people in my family and with my IQ àf 135 I'm probably also one of the most intelligent. Neither of my parents has even finished college. A cousin of mine is also quite an exception, being a social assistant with an extra degree in law. As a child, he used to be my role model.

    So even though my girlfriend's family breeds mostly qualified intellectuals and even though my own family breeds mostly working class people, both our families have their deviants. In a society of hereditary hierarchy, such deviant individuals would not be allowed to develop themselves naturally as they would be in a national-socialist society.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kurtz View Post
    Agreed to some extent. Though I think the greatest art, albeit linked to blood and culture, reflects the individual talents over all. This is why Ancient art can still touch our souls.
    Art is most likely to touch our soul when the emotions portrayed by the artwork are emotions we recognise within outselves

    Quote Originally Posted by Kurtz View Post
    We recognize our own limited value, but we also learn, in an oblique way, the lack of meaning of everything. Including the volk. So both the individual and the volk have no a priori importance, though we should view both as meaningful. We should give them a meaning.
    From where I'm looking, every individual is part of several collectives : his family, his hobby club, his marching band, his local community, his Volk, ... Every of these is part of the individuals identity and soul, but the soul of every individual member of such a collective also is part of a collective soul and identity. The importance of the collective depends on the inner strength of the collective, as does the importance of the individual.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kurtz View Post
    We should look to geniuses as individuals first and foremost, in my opinion. I beg to differ.
    Their talents are often quite unique, but they must never be used for individual gratification instead of the improvement of the folk. That's just selfish.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kurtz View Post
    For you last paragraph: we can't talk of survival now. Technology changed everything.
    Not really. In fact, our survival is now more at stake than it was a few centuries ago, even from a purely technological point of view. Because it lead to the nullification of natural selection, modern medicine is actually a danger for our survival because it aids in the process of degeneration.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kurtz View Post
    I agree with healthy and harmonious as some völkisch ideal. But this is utopian, given that we are all more or less melancholic, frustrated, longing creatures unable to satisfy themselves with how things are.
    That why laws are necessary to guide the masses into the right direction.

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