View Poll Results: Should drugs be legalized?

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  • Yes, all drugs should be legalized.

    44 28.57%
  • Yes, some drugs should be legalized, others not. (Which?)

    60 38.96%
  • No, drugs should keep their illegal status.

    50 32.47%
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Thread: Should Drugs Be Legalized?

  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hussar View Post
    .......hmmm....i'm still unsure, but there is a sure thing : the prohibition doesn't resolve the problem.

    Perhaps we should reflect deeper on the resons of phenomenon , and localize the real "source of evil" (socially speaking). A drug addict is substantially a waek people. A person who can't live without some sort of external help. Now, even if Drug doesn't exist, THAT weak people will find something other (substitutive of drug), like Alcohol or smoke etc. etc.

    Of course society and Government, can't forbid alchol and cigarettes only cause few peoples who could abuse of them. Government can't forbid the use of a knife in the kitchen since the knife is potentially dangerous for a child.

    I mean, Government can't substitute personal responsability. Although, the drug question is very complicate and dangerous....
    I believe that is a very good point, Hussar. The government cannot forbid us to drive cars because there are many car accidents which cause deaths yearly. So WHY should the government forbid drugs because some weak people cannot handle them? I believe this ban hysteria is an exaggeration and it is against the original spirit of Germanic freedom.

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  3. #43
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    I think marijuana should be legal. But I think harder drugs should remain illegal.

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    Drug addicts will be there endangering others unless you turn society into a police state the likes of which has never been seen before, they are an unfortunate truth we must learn to deal with in the best way possible.

    Who do you think is paying the inflated costs of law enforcement and justice administration in Canada? Like I said before, if it were legal it could be taxed and the revenue raised from addicts and businesses, instead of non-users paychecks.
    Cuchulain: Why create more drugaddicts than necessary? I don't call people being victims of violent crime "an unfortunate truth"... or any crime really.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dagna View Post
    I believe that is a very good point, Hussar. The government cannot forbid us to drive cars because there are many car accidents which cause deaths yearly. So WHY should the government forbid drugs because some weak people cannot handle them? I believe this ban hysteria is an exaggeration and it is against the original spirit of Germanic freedom.
    Because weak people who can't handle drugs don't always keep to themselves, Dagna. Drugs would be legal if they didn't cause people to harm others as well.

    To call all drugaddicts "weak" is fallacious, as well as calling all drugaddicts criminals. Yet we will still do it.

    With freedom comes responsibility. Responsibility meaning the ability to account for one's actions and do what is considered to be proper. As in, not taking drugs that will make one a burden on everyone. Do normal people want to turn mentally disabled or something?

    If we want to say why the government shouldn't ban drugs because some weak people can't handle it, how about the government decriminalising rape because some weak people can't handle it? Or how about decriminalising theft, because it shows Germanic initiative to take what one wants?

    Freedom does not mean doing what one wants, unless one is an anarchist.
    People turn to poison as quick as lager turns to piss

  5. #45
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    Drugs should be legal but only for the purpose of shamanic/spirit journeys. They should be for the most part controlled by the community's spiritual leader(s), who can decide who is fit to go on such journeys and in what method.

  6. #46
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    I will not hold it against people if they use natural drugs/herbs for spiritual use, as long as it does not become the centre of the ritual but a supplement to it. Personally I don't do that kind of thing, but I will turn an eye and pretend not to see that. As far as recreational drug use is concerned, I am heavily against it.

    As "legal drugs" are concerned I would leave them legal. As "illegal drugs" are concerned I would leave most of them illegal.

    I have no problem with smoking - not because smoking is accepted, and least of all because I smoke myself - but instead because of the fact that they do not have much of a mental impact on the consumer. A person that has smoked a cigarette is still in an ordinary frame of mind, hence he largely poses a danger to himself. If he takes due care, he also damages no one but his own's health (and only the physical, but not the mental) - it surely cannot be that hard to go outside for a cigarette out of respect for those who do not indulge in them.

    I likewise have little problem with alcohol. Now, it does change your frame of mind when drunk in masses, but it is the degree of harshness of the drug that does it here, and draws the main line between marijuana and alcohol legality as far as I am concerned. You can have an occasional beer with your dinner just for the taste, without getting drunk - but you cannot smoke a joint of marijuana without getting stoned. Also, the rate of alcohol abusers is - as far as I am aware - relatively low compared to those who abuse marijuana when compared to the number of people who do them. Hence it is more of a "reasonable foreseeability of abuse and dosage" that draws the line here.

    For both alcohol and cigarettes, I do however support a minimum age. Whether it is decided that this should be 16 or 18 remains to be debated. I feel that most people aged 16 are able to understand the risks of both of them - it surely cannot be logical that we trust youngsters with driving a car before we trust them to dose their alcohol intake?

    Psychadelic mushrooms finally should be legal ... not for sale, but for picking. They are a natural drug that grow naturally in our surroundings, our ancestors did for a fact use them at occasions, and they are largely harmless ... if you know which ones to pick you will have a "safe trip". They do as a general rule not make you addicted either as far as I am aware, hence abuse is generally limited as well.

    As regards the harder drugs - I am still for that good old blanket ban. Many of them guarantee abuse almost to 100% ... I yet have to find someone who did not get addicted to heroin (it is at large a physical addiction), and the addiction rate for (crack) cocaine isn't quite low either (except that this one is largely a psychological one). And other things like XTC aren't much better either. I have seen enough formerly good people destroyed by them because they could not control when a habit became an addiction - and they were usually hooked fairly quickly. It took few of them long to lose the control over their intake ... and by the time they got off the stuff, if they did, they usually had done irrepairable damage to their brain.

    I did look into the possibility of getting them harder drugs prescribed via the chemist's as a solution to the problem as it would put an end to a lot of drug-related crime ... but just about how many people would not abuse that fact to get at their drugs more easily. It would cost the state - and ultimately the taxpayer - quite a bit of money, with little to no effect in battling drugs. And even with that - it is €4.80 for a prescription of any type in Austria, tendency rising ... the black market would not disappear, all it would be doing is selling them in larger amounts and to lower prices ... but don't be naive enough to think that the countries where those are largely produced can't keep up with the demand...

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Freydis View Post
    Because weak people who can't handle drugs don't always keep to themselves, Dagna. Drugs would be legal if they didn't cause people to harm others as well.
    An idiot in a car is more dangerous, isn't he?
    "Nothing is more disgusting than the majority: because it consists of a few powerful predecessors, of rogues who adapt themselves, of weak who assimilate themselves, and the masses who imitate without knowing at all what they want." (Johann Wolfgang Goethe)

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    Sigurd, I don't use any drugs myself either, but I do think people should be able to if they want and there is little to no possibility for abuse. IE: natural drugs such as marijuana, mushrooms or others such as Ayahuasca which has healing properties etc.

    Chemical concoctions such as crack or heroin on the other hand will be done away with.

    Generally I am against smoking, because people are always doing it in front of others, especially children, as if it were the most normal thing in the world. I dont want to have to breathe it in all the time when I open the window I get the neighbors smoke, or go out in the füßgänger zone and walk into a cloud of disgusting smoke from the smokers on the sidewalk ahead of me. However, smoking could be acceptable if they would only do it occasionally in private or outside away from public areas without exposing me or others.

    The key to everything is moderation.

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Freydis View Post
    Because weak people who can't handle drugs don't always keep to themselves, Dagna. Drugs would be legal if they didn't cause people to harm others as well.

    To call all drugaddicts "weak" is fallacious, as well as calling all drugaddicts criminals. Yet we will still do it.

    With freedom comes responsibility. Responsibility meaning the ability to account for one's actions and do what is considered to be proper. As in, not taking drugs that will make one a burden on everyone. Do normal people want to turn mentally disabled or something?

    If we want to say why the government shouldn't ban drugs because some weak people can't handle it, how about the government decriminalising rape because some weak people can't handle it? Or how about decriminalising theft, because it shows Germanic initiative to take what one wants?

    Freedom does not mean doing what one wants, unless one is an anarchist.
    Rape and theft are different things, Freydis. Rape and theft are wrong in all instances because they affect others by default. Drugs don't, I believe they can only affect the person who is taking them. I believe that if weak people can buy drugs at a normal price from the pharmacy, like people said here, they won't need to steal. I believe that if the state offers help to treat their addiction, they won't commit crimes to find the money to get high. Driving cars causes people to harm others, and going by the same logic, judging by the big number of car accidents in so many countries, driving should be banned (except for public transportation perhaps) because of the weak people who cannot handle it. Guns should be banned too, because there are weak people who cannot handle them and harm others with them. Computers should be banned, because there are people who use them for hacking, child porn, cyber romances leading to sexual assault and other disgusting crimes.

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dagna View Post
    Rape and theft are different things, Freydis. Rape and theft are wrong in all instances because they affect others by default. Drugs don't, I believe they can only affect the person who is taking them. I believe that if weak people can buy drugs at a normal price from the pharmacy, like people said here, they won't need to steal. I believe that if the state offers help to treat their addiction, they won't commit crimes to find the money to get high.
    Drugs cause emotional strain in families and friends of the addict. They don't only affect the person who is taking it, to say so is, in my opinion, narrow-minded.

    But what is a "normal" price? I know someone who can't afford asthma medication at a "normal" price and even a discounted price. If they spend all their money on this drug, they will eventually need to find a way to get more money... just because it is legal doesn't mean it is free.

    The state already offers help to treat addiction. Sure, it works sometimes, but again, it's a "burden" on the taxpayer to help them cure their addiction. For the government to have these drugs legal would only put more pressure on this system. Anyways, it's contradictory to advocate the legalisation of drugs then go on to assert the state should have a program that helps people get over their addiction.

    Driving cars causes people to harm others, and going by the same logic, judging by the big number of car accidents in so many countries, driving should be banned (except for public transportation perhaps) because of the weak people who cannot handle it. Guns should be banned too, because there are weak people who cannot handle them and harm others with them. Computers should be banned, because there are people who use them for hacking, child porn, cyber romances leading to sexual assault and other disgusting crimes.
    I do not believe in a "nanny" state, but I do believe many people are incapable of making good decisions for themselves and these decisions affect others. These things are incomparable with drugs anyways, in my opinion.

    Anyways, to respond to this statement, I believe that public transit is the best option for everyone ("personal" auto-equipment for people who have an actual purpose, such as farming), I don't think that guns are really very good either because of all the idiots running around with them . Computers, well, I build them, I fix them, I know all about them.

    But all of these things that you mentioned (well perhaps excepting guns) have another use that benefits society. Automobiles allow people to move rapidly around, guns allow people a sense of "security" (still disagree with them..), and computers allow people to connect with others worldwide and to make processes more efficient.

    Drugs only allow the person to hallucinate or be momentarily "happy" or to do stupid things. It does not benefit society at all.

    Reducto ad absurdum failed. ^^
    People turn to poison as quick as lager turns to piss

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