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Thread: Is the Concept of a Monotheistic God Self-Contradictory?

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    To Sigurd, as I've said, I can't imagine a god with flaws, because then it's not a god, it's something else, inferior to a god. God is the supreme being by definition, there isn't anything else above him. The ones who come close to perfection, angels, saints, aren't gods.

    Odin, Tyr and the others are conceived by many Heathens as symbolic, not real supreme beings.

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    Sound methods Chlodovech's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ronan
    Ever meet a fallen angel yourself?
    I'm not quite sure, maybe I did, maybe I didn't. It's not crucial to my faith nor does my faith require me to meet a fallen angel in person. If one combines the stories of creation of virtually every culture on Earth, one does come across some creepy similarities - that give the individual stories, including the biblical one, some credibility. Perhaps the halfbreeds are among us.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronan
    How would you know how to recognize them outside of theological theorizing?
    I'll answer to this question at the end of my post.

    Have you ever known of a human who has interbred with one?
    Yes. Millions of Americans and Europeans claim to have been abducted by 'aliens' - which is a misindentification to me - and a fair share of these abductees state that offspring resulted from their 'interaction' with these 'aliens', without them having much of a choice in the matter.

    More than two millions of Americans can't be wrong, so I happen to believe these stories about abductions, there's something to it. Yet the mainstream media doesn't care. I can't help to admire Carl Gustav Jung who took the UFO-phenomenon very serious at a time when these things were almost happening off the radar screen of the society at large.

    'Alien abduction' is nothing new, in fact, it's ancient. Even 'the men in black' go way back to earlier myths. What has changed is how we categorize/label/name the phenomenon.

    I'd say the European royalty and banksters like the Rothschild family are halfbreds, or at least, they make these veiled claim themselves, by tracing their ancestry back to semi-mythical figures who made children with non-human entities, like Melusine, for instance.

    By your own x-tianized definition of evil, if I happen to commit a sin it is as a result of someone in my family’s history having relations with a fallen angel?
    Maybe we all carry the fallen angel DNA within us anyway, and maybe this creates within all of us a dualistic battlefield. But I do believe that there's more to it than that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronan
    What is the justification for this? I know the old saying “No Pain, No Gain” may apply in certain instances, but not to the extent that almost all of humanity is subjected to suffering. And we know full well that most of people have definitely not learned of morals, experienced personal growth, or put much faith in salvation, if at all. Pain only makes them behave worse. Mankind at odds with nature does enough of this already without humans pouring salt into their own wounds.
    I've never read in a Christian text that the majority of people would end up in heaven; getting there requires an act of mercy. When I read your post, Ronan, i saw that you're familiar with Nietzsche. I wondered why he spoke of 'the last battalion' that will bridge the gap between humans and superhumans. A Prussian battalion in Nietzsche's day consisted of 600 men. I think it's safe to assume that all other battalions were wiped out before they were to attain this goal of transcending their own humanity. If suffering is not intense, it's not suffering at all. It isn't a challenge, it's an annoyance.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronan
    A true religion, if that is possible, should never require its followers to receive or inflict pain.
    Christianity doesn't preach pain though, it acknowledges that it exists out there, and, since we're imperfect, we will be confronted by discomfort. It's simply what comes by existing in this body.

    What is the purpose behind the existence of pain? Washing away the dirt from the diamond, to obtain the diamond? I don't know. Some things appear as mysterious or incomprehensible just because of the size of our brain and the way we make use of it, yet I doubt we'll ever find the answer. Religion has not all the answers, in that regard it is just like science. Sometimes there are genuine mysteries.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronan
    “Largely absent”? How can you tell if god is there at all? My dad always responded to this much asked question (by me) with “I just know. I can feel him working within me.” Well I just wish that a x-tian can provide for me an answer without saying that we mortal humans have no right to understand the immortal.
    No matter what I would tell you, it would still be, in the end, a matter of belief. And I don't have the ambition to convert anyone. However, sometimes there's more belief to be found in honest doubt than in all creeds of faith combined.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronan
    Jews think they are gods chosen people. They see the success of thier subjugation of the Gentile as proof. And just look at who really controls both the American as well as the German goverments!

    Mere mortals? Do you not agree that we Germans are the worlds best?
    Of course we are the best, mortal, but the best. Thank God we're mortal, otherwise we wouldn't know the catchy, beautiful phrase, 'dying like only Germans can die'.

    We're destined to rule in some form, and within the larger scheme of things - Steiner wrote a nice book on this subject called 'People's of Europe: the mission for the souls of the peoples in relationship to the Germanic-Nordic mythology'.

    It's a simple but telling fact; continental Germanics did rule the world, when our civilization was still religious - and Christian. To me it's no coincidence that our societies are undergoing a secularization process and are collapsing at the same time, these things go hand in hand. You see, there's nothing wrong with the Skadi atheist, a perfectly likeable chap or gal, but most atheists don't care to die for their beliefs nor, and to a lesser extent, for their country, for an abstract ideal. Without singling out Skadi's atheists, who I admire for their strength, their hardness - I'd say that atheism and pacifism make a better couple than religion and pacifism.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronan
    And should we, as the worlds best, take it upon ourselves to emulate “god” as best as possible? In essence, "becoming as gods". This is why the German race is doomed, because most Germans are convinced that they have no place playing god, while the jew, who is defeating us, has no problem whatever playing the role.
    I feel that the Germanic race can assume the role of the immortal much more authentically than any other. We are not perfect, which is true. But, I feel that we as a people have come the closest to achieving it. Would it not be too much to assume that the jew prevents us from doing this?
    I don't like the Nietzschean wording, 'becoming like gods' - we'll never be that awesome and that detached from our human selves (and one can wonder if it wouldn't lead to a dystopia instead of an utopia), but for all practical purposes, I agree. The betterment of our folk and the soul of our folk, in any conceivable way, is my concern too.

    Has his own secret agenda… just like the neo-con and jewish power players have thier own agenda and owe us nothing?
    It's not like anybody would understand God - we don't have the brain to understand - one might as well teach a one year old the basic principles of quantum superposition.

    Any intelligent, creative entity, including humans, has an own agenda. If we fail to understand the intentions of people around us, surely, we can't start to comprehend God's will in the most meaningful and profound way.

    I am sure you have been asked this numerous times already, but…how do you know all of this took place? Were you there?
    No, this is the first time (no kidding). Have you ever seen a big bang? One creature evolve into another one? A black hole? Do you really know how a television set operates?

    Me neither, but television works for me, and so does tradition.

    You are merely quoting passages out of a book that many x-tian scholars themselves feel is only a fourth of it’s original size due to countless edits throughout the centuries. All I ask is for a simple explanation that does not rely on "I just know”.
    Which book are you refering to?

    These myths, these enduring stories and their heroes are more real than you and I, in a way. Parsifal, Jesus, Beowulf, Count Dracula ... are having a bigger impact on reality than any real living person, and if you peel off the layers of mystification you will always find a core of truth.

    But you stated ealier on that fallen angels are responsible.
    That's what the bible says. But let's never underestimate the power of human stupidity on a grand scale. I'm not quite sure that I'm following here, which paradox do you preceive?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronan
    If you cant differentiate then how do you know what good or evil is in the meantime?
    Exactly. The problem with God is that you're never totally sure if it isn't a trick from the devil. That's where tradition and intuition kick in, in helping to establish the difference.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronan
    Is not the Germanic ideal of a good life a satisfactory enough definition?
    Are you refering to the heathen view of the good life? Or to a particular school of thought that is way more recent?

    I don't know why we're on Earth, but I'm quite sure it's not to amuse ourselves.

    Which god are you speaking of here? Yours or the jew?
    I'm talking of the master of the universe - regardless of what the jews think.

    In Hebrew “satan” translates into “enemy”
    In standard hebrew it means 'the accuser'.

    Chlodovech, I am having a difficult time understanding why you follow a jewish religion, one that was designed specifically to destroy the Gentile!

    Ann Coulter, (whom I do not admire, by the way), said that x-tians are “perfected jews”. Do you consider yourself one?
    A perfected Jew? God forbid. Christianity is not an ordinary Abrahamic offshoot, Catholicism even less, and the bible is not the Talmud. My village priest is against multiculturalism, even preaches against it (and in the portal of the Church there are posters promoting the radical nationalist organisation Voorpost, which is pro-national socialist and pro-Dutch and pro-German), destroying the gentile is not part of Catholicism. I don't know any catholic myself who would want to be mistaken for a jew. Why God would send his son to be born in the midst of what I consider the most sinful people on Earth, is a mystery to me - yet I have my assumptions.

    That the destruction of the Germanic peoples is on God's to do list would be some überzionist's take on things, not mine. I've nothing to do with zionism, in fact, the nazis and the Poles were quite right when they thought about giving the Jews a piece of land in Argentina or Madagascar.

    I'm a monotheist first, and than a Catholic. And I'm a traditionalist: the legitimacy and credibility of what I believe/accept comes from the existence of the tradition itself - 1500 years of tradition, of knowledge passing down from generation to generation - of people expanding on earlier traditions, slowly but surely. Tradition is the result of collective knowledge, and it's good for you, because its components have been proven to work for our ancestors.
    “Individuals trapped in a dying culture live in a twilight world. They embrace death through infertility, concupiscence, and war. A dog will crawl into a hole to die. The members of sick cultures do not do anything quite so dramatic, but they cease to have children, dull their senses with alcohol and drugs, become despondent, and too frequently do away with themselves. Or they make war on the perceived source of their humiliation.”
    — David P. Goldman, as quoted by Jack Donovan in The Way of Men.

  3. #23
    Senior Member Wulfram's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chlodovech View Post
    I'm not quite sure, maybe I did, maybe I didn't. It's not crucial to my faith nor does my faith require me to meet a fallen angel in person. If one combines the stories of creation of virtually every culture on Earth, one does come across some creepy similarities - that give the individual stories, including the biblical one, some credibility. Perhaps the halfbreeds are among us.
    Know thine enemy. To conquer those who rule you must become well acquainted, even to the point of assimilation. But that would be the jew blending in with gentiles, correct? Is this not how they have defeated us? We are their version of fallen angels.
    Once again, jewish indoctrination “not requiring” x-tians to delve deep into the matter at hand. Just sit back and let jesus worry about that.
    I would think that as a x-tian soidier that it would be the most important requirement to recognize then vanquish the demons.

    Yes. Millions of Americans and Europeans claim to have been abducted by 'aliens' - which is a misindentification to me - and a fair share of these abductees state that offspring resulted from their 'interaction' with these 'aliens', without them having much of a choice in the matter.

    More than two millions of Americans can't be wrong, so I happen to believe these stories about abductions, there's something to it.
    The Vatican/inquisition burned Giordano Bruno at the stake for basically saying this very thing in 1600. The catholic church is still unable to acknowledge such metaphysical matters because it undermines the whole point of monotheistic belief. If UFO‘s exist, it stands to reason that the catholic god must not be the only one out there. This is the very foundation of catholicism. Yes I have heard of the occasional rogue priest that will admit to such things, but until the pope himself actually broadcasts this possibility to his millions I feel that the x-tian world at large will remain ignorant of it, and this ignorance is entirely in the church’s interest.

    The following are quotes from an article in Florida Today,
    dated August 17, 1997.


    Religious leaders are alarmed about a growing train of thought that "wants us to reject traditional Judeo-Christian ideas about God" in favor of benign "Space Brothers" who will save humanity from itself…

    …this new belief is a set-up for apocalyptic deceptions predicted in the Bible's Book of Revelation. Magazine articles, books and even evangelists are engaging in Bible-based speculations about the nature and intention of entities that allegedly kidnap, paralyze, physically abuse and sometimes sexually molest victims -- many of whom come to believe the experience was worthwhile…

    …The similarity between the abduction experience and demonic possession is very, very close…

    …this whole thing is spiritual warfare. And the method the enemy's using is deception. Strong deception…

    …there are three verifiable cases in which apparent abduction experiences were halted by believers who called on the name of jesu…It makes you wonder: If these beings are extraterrestrial at all, why would they respond to that name?" Jordan asks. "We think we found the answer in the Bible, in Mark 16:17 where Jesus said, 'In my name, they shall cast out demons…

    …Suddenly, the religious press is full of articles about UFOs…

    …"Both the seemingly benign and the hostile entities will play an increasing role in preparing a segment of humanity for the reception of the Antichrist…
    Do these statements resemble your own belief system?

    I can't help to admire Carl Gustav Jung who took the UFO-phenomenon very serious at a time when these things were almost happening off the radar screen of the society at large.
    Jung said:

    “ It is more desirable for people to believe UFOs exist than to believe they don't exist.”

    Could this same theory be applied to religion? Jung was fascinated by UFOs because he was desperate to find something, anything that might prove god exists.
    Atheists are often closet-believers in UFO’s. From personal experience, I have known quite a few of them over the years who were never really comfortable with their disbelief.

    Jung also said:

    “…modern man projected his inner state into the heavens. In this sense, the UFOs became modern symbols for the ancient gods which came to man's assistance in time of need.”

    Is this why you believe in the possibilty of UFOs yourself?

    Most people who are fascinated by UFOs because it gives them some spark of hope that there is something out there after all.
    I want very badly to believe in UFO’s, Bigfoot, the Loch Ness monster myself, and I always keep an open mind to the possibilty, never closing it, even when I am disillusioned.
    But what keeps my interest is thier potential mystery, and X-tianity holds none of this potential for me.

    'Alien abduction' is nothing new, in fact, it's ancient. Even 'the men in black' go way back to earlier myths. What has changed is how we categorize/label/name the phenomenon.
    The nephilim, which is basically what the bible would call “aliens”, are hybrids that are the result of sexual relations between fallen angels and female humans.
    The following is a quote from an author whose name I did not write down and therefore cannot source. My apologies:
    “One of the evil objectives of the sexual union of fallen angels and women as we move toward the end-times, could be to create a non-human society on earth which would be impossible to be redeemed by Christ during the tribulation described in the book of Revelation.”
    Does this not sound like what the jew is intending to do with Germanics? To assimilate and destroy?
    The only way the jew could ever fool us was to take on the persona of god. They achieved this. And now that they have achieved this there is no longer the need to maintain the x-tian charade. I would say that the jew is nowadays very open and boastful of their rule over us. This is the reason why x-tianity has fallen on hard times, because its inventors no longer need it to direct us down the path to destruction. We are there now as we speak.

    I've never read in a Christian text that the majority of people would end up in heaven; getting there requires an act of mercy.
    True mercy would be to either end this “test” from god we are all supposed to take and come down from the heavens and tell us if we have passed already. Either that or just put us all out of our misery. At the very least god could give the reigns of power back to those who should have never let go of it in the first place, the Gentile. more specifically, we Germans.

    When I read your post, Ronan, i saw that you're familiar with Nietzsche. I wondered why he spoke of 'the last battalion' that will bridge the gap between humans and superhumans. A Prussian battalion in Nietzsche's day consisted of 600 men. I think it's safe to assume that all other battalions were wiped out before they were to attain this goal of transcending their own humanity.
    I am probably way off mark here, but I have my own interpretation of the superhuman.
    The human mind has been compared to that of a computer. What we expect of ourselves, as far as finding the answers to questions or simply the need to create, depends on the various data we enter. The more data we input the wider ranging our built-in search engines become, gathering influences quicker and with more adeptness, learning to sift through the excess, allowing us to concentrate with an ever clearer mind on the more refined things in life. This in turn allows us to contribute ideas of our own to help refine that search process even further for future generations to use and grow and contribute themselves, and so on and so on. Ultimately, would it not be possible that we humans will reach a stage when refinement is no longer needed? That to gain admittance to the heavens we must first become gods in order to assimilate? I think this is what he meant by superhuman. I could be wrong.

    Christianity doesn't preach pain though...
    It shames us with the crucifixion, and without his pain on the cross, x-tianity would have become just another wayside religion.

    And I don't have the ambition to convert anyone.
    Our x-tian ancestors certainly did. One could say that we now have the luxury to believe or disbelieve because of the blood-curdling ruthlessness in which they dealt with those who refused to convert/repent. Would these same ancestors have accepted your passive stance to not convert?

    However, sometimes there's more belief to be found in honest doubt than in all creeds of faith combined.
    Please explain

    It's not like anybody would understand God - we don't have the brain to understand.
    Similar to what I stated above, what if god created our brains in order to understand him? Doesn’t science say that we have only tapped into 3% of our brains power? What is the rest lying around for? Would it not be conceivable that this untapped potential is precisely to understand the more complex nature of god that transcends theology? Is it possible that this "forbidden knowledge" just might be the very information that helps us pass on to heaven?

    If we fail to understand the intentions of people around us, surely, we can't start to comprehend God's will in the most meaningful and profound way.
    You stated earlier on that your religion does not require you to meet a fallen angel. How do you expect to understand the plotting of our enemy?
    Most gentiles havent a clue how their world is ruled, and if they had even a hint they would simply turn their eyes away from the horror show that awaits them in the future, which is to exterminate Germanics.

    Have you ever seen a big bang? One creature evolve into another one? A black hole? Do you really know how a television set operates?
    The ancient word 'TELE' is Ninth to fifteenth century in origin. This modern day pre-fix meant to our ancestors : evil speaking, calumny, blasphemy, to deceive, entrap...
    I think I have a pretty good idea how a television operates.

    Which book are you refering to?
    I meant that the bible has been so over-translated and force-fed on so many levels it is near to impossible to tell how those early christians interpreted it. How do we know what form of it they passed along to succeeding generations? Each succesive generation, in turn, must have multiplied its interpretations to a point that all forms of its earliest manifestation have become nothing more than a watered down version of the original.

    The following is a quote from a book by a writer named Jim Goad. I am no fan of this man, but the passage he wrote is a good example of how a story becomes confusing if overedited:

    Let me get this straight---your religion preaches that two thousand years ago, a middle eastern virgin was impregnated by a ghost. And the spawn of this ethereal sperm grew up to walk on water an multiply bread loaves and heal the sick and raise the dead and cast our literal demons. And this Love Child wasn’t just any ordinary spud, it was god incarnate who willingly submitted to a bloody s&m crucifixion to pay for OUR sins, when it would have been much easier if he’d merely made us sin proof in the first place. And this miracle baby, son of a (cough) virgin, rose from the dead after three days and now gets very upset when heavy-metal musicians slander his name. and moses parted the red sea, noah had an ark, god rained frogs on Egypt, and Joshua made the sun stand still. And even though adam and eve only gave birth to t ___ boys (one of whom killed the other), the human race somehow fruitfully multiplied while avoiding the sin of incest. And remote polynesain islanders will boil in molten lava eternally if they don’t embrace the gospel, even if they’ve never had a chance to hear the gospel.

    That is not The Greatest Story Ever Told, it’s the craziest.
    Goad calls it crazy, but I will say that it is as the result of bad editing.

    ...and the bible is not the Talmud.
    The following site will explain this a little better than myself what the bible may be.

    http://www.666blacksun.com/Bible_Conspiracy.html

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