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Thread: The Racial Makeup of Northern Italy

  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by ForwardEyes View Post



    You mean conquering them?
    The conquering came from the East as well as the West.

    Austrian History, Slavs+Bavarians+Rhaeto Romanic (not Padanian, yeesh):

    During the Migration Period, the Slavs migrated into the Alps in the wake of the expansion of their Avar overlords during the 7th century, mixed with the Celto-Romanic population, and established the realm of Carantania, which covered much of eastern and central Austrian territory. In the meantime, the Germanic tribe of the Bavarians had developed in the 5th and 6th century in the west of the country and in Bavaria, while what is today Vorarlberg had been settled by the Alemans. Those groups mixed with the Rhaeto-Romanic population and pushed it up into the mountains.

    Carantania, under pressure of the Avars, lost its independence to Bavaria in 745 and became a margraviate. During the following centuries, Bavarian settlers went down the Danube and up the Alps, a process through which Austria was to become the mostly German-speaking country it is today.

    ....

    After the defeat of the Magyars by Emperor Otto the Great in the Battle of Lechfeld (955), new Marches were established in what is today Austria. The one known as the marchia orientalis was to become the core territory of Austria and was given to Leopold of Babenberg in 976 after the revolt of Henry II, Duke of Bavaria.

    Under The Holy Roman Empire, the Germanies were divided in to reichskreis:

    Aust Austrian Circle EL Council of Electors, the exclusive elite formally electing the Holy Roman Emperor

    Bav Bavarian Circle EC Spiritual Bench of the Council of Princes (individual voice)

    Burg Burgundian Circle PR Secular Bench of the Council of Princes (individual voice)

    El Rhin Electoral Rhenish Circle RP Rhenish prelates (Council of Princes)

    Franc Franconian Circle SP Swabian prelates (Council of Princes)

    Low Rhen Lower Rhenish-Westphalian Circle FC Franconian counts (Council of Princes)

    Low Sax Lower Saxon Circle SC Swabian counts (Council of Princes)

    Upp Rhin Upper Rhenish Circle WE Westphalian counts (Council of Princes)

    Upp Sax Upper Saxon Circle WT Wetterau counts (Council of Princes)

    Swab Swabian Circle RH Rhenish Bench of the Council of Imperial Cities
    None "Circle-free"

  2. #102
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    I agree with OEN and Soldier of Wodann.

    Northern Italy is not Germanic, but I don't see any problem affirming that it has a marked influence. Is it a sin to show their blond people? No.

    No one says that there aren't fair Italians in the South and swarthy Italians in the North, but you cannot deny that there is a more accentuated Germanic influence on the North, and I can tell you that for sure, because I know many Italians and I descend from blond Central-Northern (Tuscany) and swarthy Southern (Calabria) Italians and no, it's not an inferiority complex. Facts talk for themselves and there's nothing wrong with that, North is fairier and South is swarthier. I don't see any Nordicist in that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fallen Angel View Post
    A lot of these Nordicists are non-Nordids with inferiority complexes themselves. It's often that they're of mixed ancestry (3-4 ethnicities involved at least) so they can't identify with a single nation, or they come from mixed countries like Argentina for instance.
    Obviously you've never been to Argentina. We are very proud of our Southern Italian legacy, as well as the Northern one. Also with the Spanish, Swiss, French, German, Portuguese, Scottish or Welsh legacy just to give an example.

    I'm not saying there are no Nordicists, but it has nothing to do with our mixed heritage.

    We are mixed, so? I don't see why that should make us feel "inferior" and why it should make you feel jealous.
    "Cuando la Patria está en peligro, todo está permitido excepto no defenderla"
    José de San Martín

  3. #103
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    Tuscans=Etrurians, Fafner. The racial composition is heavily influenced by Neolithic settlement, specifically from the Balkans. In racial terms, this produces other types than in Pure White Padania. In Pure White Padania, Alpinid Skinheads (read: "Balding Teenagers") beat down the local Neolithic Dinaric Meds, cursing their ancestors for bringing farming to Padania. They are simply jealous of thicker, fuller hair.

  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Siebenbürgerin View Post

    However the person you posted, Egon Krenz looks suspiciously non-European in race. He was a part of one of my classification threads and I always wondered if he wasn't of Jewish ancestry. I heard his family was originally from the nowadays occupied areas of Poland, so maybe he had Polish Jews in the family tree.
    I don't know of any Jewish ancestry, he was an ethnic German from Poland (Volksdeutscher). He doesn't look so odd as a young person.




  5. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kreis AnnA View Post
    Tuscans=Etrurians, Fafner. The racial composition is heavily influenced by Neolithic settlement, specifically from the Balkans. In racial terms, this produces other types than in Pure White Padania. In Pure White Padania, Alpinid Skinheads (read: "Balding Teenagers") beat down the local Neolithic Dinaric Meds, cursing their ancestors for bringing farming to Padania. They are simply jealous of thicker, fuller hair.
    I forgot to say that altough my ancestors were Tuscans, they came from Lombardy

    About those "Alpinid Skinheads", I don't approve that. They don't love neither their nation nor their country, but not all Northern Italians are like that. That is a minority, as well as those "mixed countries Nordicists" that I wrote above.
    "Cuando la Patria está en peligro, todo está permitido excepto no defenderla"
    José de San Martín

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    Quote Originally Posted by Absolut Svensk View Post
    My post was about italians with some germanic traits or partial germanic traits. In my opinion, De Rossi looks a few similar to swedish actor Peter Stormare, who is half southern italian(mother) and half swedish(father).

    Peter Stormare
    Thats interesting, I never heard if him being half Italian or rather specifically Southern Italian. Do you have a citation of fact concerning his heritage or you just dont like his look or cause he played an Italian character in "The Brothers Grimm" movie or something to that effect?

    Cant really see whats Armenoid about him, I think Hans Christian Anderson has a much more interesting look..is he part Italian too?!



    Moreover, Lundman noted so-called Armenoids reaching the Nordic Countries:

    http://dienekes.50webs.com/blog/archives/000069.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dagna View Post
    You have said it yourself, his nose is Armenoid. I would never confuse him for a Scandinavian or a German. He is the perfect example why I believe Germanics should not mix with non-Germanics.

    It is not an "attack" on the racial identity of Northern Italians, it is a realistic view, that Northern Italians are subracially diverse, unlike what Padanian Nordicists like to claim. They only post these pictures of Padanians which advantage them.

    Furthermore, Austria and Padania are not alike. The South Tyrolean land was stolen from Germany, so it is nothing Padanian in origin.
    You spoke some truths before. However you do not need an Italian to create such a phenotype in Germanic lands, they're perfectly capable of creating such examples all on their own. Having said that, not sure why your so negative over his phenotype/ look for, just because someone said he's supposedly part Italian.

    The reality is each nation is sub-racially(or more accurately Phenotypical) diverse, same with Germany or Southern Germany or even the Tyrol. No European people are a race of clones or have a monopoly on certain traits. Most of the time it has to do with micro-evolution and shared neolithic/paleolithic migration history rather than outside relatively recent historical reasons.

    Case in point:

    Extent of Germanic Admixture in Iberia and Italy


    http://dienekes.ifreepages.com/blog/...es/000576.html


    Here are some brief Phenotype Plates from various European ethnicities:

    Germany

















    Basques:








    Italians


























    French:












    Austrian:





    Tyrolese:





    Swiss:








    Irish








    Welsh




    Scottish:





    Cornwall:



    English:







    ______________

    As far as Egon goes, I dont see whats so un-German about him, not all Germans lived in Germany which was only created in 1871. Partve the reason Hitler invaded Poland was to take back ethnic Germans and parts of Germany which were separated after WW1. Hitler also specifically stated that the Southern Tyrol belonged to Italy, as even knew that the germans present there were a small irrelevant minority .

    The Goths themselves were pretty diverse.


    One of the floor mosaics excavated at the Great Palace of Constantinople and dated to the reign of Justinian I. It is presumed to represent a conquered Gothic king.

    Its possible some wouldve had some Iranian influence as some claimed descent from Iranians or as they were known, Scythians & Sarmatians. Same with Charlemagne and his Franks.

  8. #108
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    Northern Italy became very rich after the middle ages, the reason is that they defied the church, and the rulers of the various states were only concerned with making money. Even though Italy could grow little food (because of the mountainous terrain) the Northern Italians managed to become filthy rich. Making clothing, (the materials came from farther north) shipping, and an extremely effective postal system. Although it is part of Italy's history, the Nordic/Germanic invaders are probably not behind Northern Italy's higher standard of living and IQ the real reason is much more complicated and involves a great deal of politics, economics, and the status of the rest of the continent.

  9. #109
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    N. Italy isn't germanic although some germanic influences are detected.
    on an other hand I did notice some sneaky attempts of germanizing or trying to pass as partly germanic people who actually aren't like Ladins and Swiss Romansh. I guess that's because the Ladins are indigenous of South Tyrol and labelling them as Italians or peripherally Italians (something along the line of Sardinians or Sicilians) would be an evidence against the idea that South Tyrol is 100% non italian.
    if you look close at their language:

    ladin = ciasa
    italian = casa
    german = hause

    ladin = vancansa
    italian = vacanza
    german = erholung

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    Culture is learned behavior (e.g. pure-blooded Japanese born & raised in Brazil act more like Brazilians than Japan-born Japanese) language is learned behavior, but bloodlines are eternal. I think this question of 'Who is Germanic?' depends on how you rank in importance the following factors: a.) bloodlines, b.) culture, and c.) language. For me bloodlines reign supreme, then comes culture, and lastly language.

    The American culture children are raised in and manifest today is probably less Germanic than the contemporary culture in Italy, but most here wouldn't call a German-American child non-Germanic just because he or she happens to be born into this mixed up anti-civilization we are today ruled by. So on the same note, if someone in Northern Italy traces their roots to the Germanic tribes, their phenotype shows that connection, but that person speaks Italian, should they be excluded from Germandom because their ancestors were linguistically Romanized?

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