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Thread: Which Countries Are Germanic?

  1. #281
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    Re: Which countries are Germanic?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kurtz View Post
    But the core of the folks doesn't necessarily know, or simply care, about it. That fact is probably even more accurate in the New World, where only few people consider themselves culturally Europeans.
    This is true. Even my mother, who is Afrikaans, did not (until I did some explaining) view herself as Germanic, but rather as exclusively Afrikaans (this was not helped by the fact that the Boerevolk were for some years vehemently anti-German and -British). Most people have little to no interest in history and such, so the entire notion of a germanic culture is lost upon most. In the New World the situation can either be better (as some people will seek out their heritage) or worse (as is the case that you mentioned). Belonging to a cultural group, after all, consists both in wanting to be part of it as well as being accepted by it. As you say, it's important to make people aware of cultural links first, then of racial facts.

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    Re: Which countries are Germanic?

    Quote Originally Posted by Theudiskaz View Post
    However...you are also saying things like this, I dont know how else to interpret this other than an attempt to show that England and France are not Germanic because Germanic isn't spoken there. If this is not what you are suggesting, then what is the meaning of this?
    What I am saying, in the countries where parts of that countrie, people who speak German and most likely still practice the German culture are aware of their German heritage, where those that no longer speak the language and generally also do not practice the German culture are oblivious to their ties to Germans, and are not conscious of it.

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    Re: Which countries are Germanic?

    What I am saying, in the countries where parts of that countrie, people who speak German and most likely still practice the German culture are aware of their German heritage, where those that no longer speak the language and generally also do not practice the German culture are oblivious to their ties to Germans, and are not conscious of it
    Here we go again. It's not an issue of whether German is spoken in a country. Maybe, before I have to explain what Germanic means, I should ask you what you think it means.
    -Hyge sceal še heardre, heorte še cénre, mód sceal še mįre, žż śre męgen lytlaž. -The Battle of Maldon
    -I love the great despisers, because they are the great adorers, and arrows of longing for the other shore. -Thus Spake Zarathustra

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    Re: Which countries are Germanic?

    The countries/regions I see as Germanic are those where German, Dutch and Scandinavian languages are spoken.

    Culturally (including character), phenotypically and in the way they speak I find them distinctively similar to one another (but less so in southern areas of German and Dutch speech).

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    Re: Which countries are Germanic?

    Come on Rydderch! Give it up. I suppose that if you met a Nordic Englishman named Thurston Rawlinson from Skelmersdale, or Osmund Hardinge from East Bergholt, who could trace his family back to before the Norman conquest and whose Y chromsome DNA might as well have come from Bergen or Leeuwarden, whose native dialect would be largely intelligible to a Norwegian or Frisian, you would still deny them their Germanicness.

    As an interesting anecdote. One of my history professors, a Frisian, his parents visited England once. The father was a high school English teacher. The mother had never learned any English. She got by the whole time speaking Frisian to English-speakers.
    -Hyge sceal še heardre, heorte še cénre, mód sceal še mįre, žż śre męgen lytlaž. -The Battle of Maldon
    -I love the great despisers, because they are the great adorers, and arrows of longing for the other shore. -Thus Spake Zarathustra

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    Re: Which countries are Germanic?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rhydderch View Post
    The countries/regions I see as Germanic are those where German, Dutch and Scandinavian languages are spoken.

    Culturally (including character), phenotypically and in the way they speak I find them distinctively similar to one another (but less so in southern areas of German and Dutch speech).
    so you can tell what we are beside germanic in flanders?

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    Re: Which countries are Germanic?

    Quote Originally Posted by Theudiskaz
    Come on Rydderch! Give it up. I suppose that if you met a Nordic Englishman named Thurston Rawlinson from Skelmersdale, or Osmund Hardinge from East Bergholt, who could trace his family back to before the Norman conquest and whose Y chromsome DNA might as well have come from Bergen or Leeuwarden, whose native dialect would be largely intelligible to a Norwegian or Frisian, you would still deny them their Germanicness.
    Hehe, well if we're talking about England as a whole, I'm sorry to say but I simply don't see that distinctive Germanic character in them (or in English culture), which the Dutch, Germans and Scandinavians have in common with each other.

    I'll grant though that there are probably people in certain parts of England, the majority of whose ancestors were Viking and/or Saxon invaders (the same is possibly true in parts of Ireland, in terms of Vikings at least). That in itself doesn't justify the whole country being included as Germanic though.

    She got by the whole time speaking Frisian to English-speakers.
    Well I'm not sure how accurate that is, but it wouldn't affect my point anyway, since I've never suggested that the English language isn't Germanic.

    By the way, is your suggestion that I leave Skadi due to this view of mine about the English?

    so you can tell what we are beside germanic in flanders?
    I'm saying I get the impression that what makes Germany, Holland and Scandinavia distinctive is perhaps less pronounced in southern areas (which would include Austria, Switzerland and Flanders). I'd still include them as part of that Germanic world though, it's just that they are smaller areas on the edge.

    As for what else you are, I suppose Celtic and pre-Celtic. Then again, I'd say that Germanic culture itself (almost by definition really) is inherently somewhat Celtic.

    To state it more clearly, I think that the Corded people are probably responsible for the non-Celtic core of the Germanic language and culture, but that the latter as we know it from the beginning of recorded history onwards, is the result of a superimposition of Celtic-speakers onto Corded groups; they subsequently merged, but with the former being essentially absorbed, though at the same time making their mark as an component element in what would become the Germanic people.
    Last edited by Rhydderch; Tuesday, February 27th, 2007 at 01:22 PM. Reason: Addition

  8. #288
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    Re: Which countries are Germanic?

    Quote Originally Posted by Theudiskaz View Post
    Here we go again. It's not an issue of whether German is spoken in a country. Maybe, before I have to explain what Germanic means, I should ask you what you think it means.
    Iwill let the dictionary explain it to you!

    Germanic=relating to, orcharacteristic of Germany, its people, or their language.

    or relating to Germanic or Germanic speaking peoples

    A group of languages of common origin including English, German, Dutch, and the Scandinavian languages.

    now what I was saying is that with some of the Germanic countries you mentioned including England, I do not beleive they identify with the German culture and are independent and absorb their own identify and culture.

    The Scandinavians and Dutch are more conscious of their German roots, not so much the others.

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    Re: Which countries are Germanic?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hedwig View Post
    The adjective "Germanic" should not be restricted to all things German, because the Germans are a subgroup of Germanics and Germanics are the bigger group.
    One can tell the difference more clearly in German. There are two different words for "Germanic" and "German", "germanisch" and "deutsch". "Germanisch" refers to the Germanic tribes (die Germanen), while "deutsch" refers to the German ethnic/national identity; die Deutschen are the German people. The Scandinavians, English, etc. are Germanic, but not German. So Theudiskaz is correct, in that it's not a matter of whether German is spoken in these countries.
    I did not say that to be Germanic a countrie must have to speak German. I said that most of these countries today do not identify their German connection and see themselves as French, Englishmen etc, the Germans going back to Ancient times connected with many European countries, during the Roman days their tribes were in Rome, in Northern Italy the Lombards settled there, then in Sicily you had the normans(vikings) there for over 100 years, the point is that European history shows that Europeans intermingled with one another, but after the boundaries were set, they all went on their own way, and each created their own language and culture.

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    Re: Which countries are Germanic?

    Quote Originally Posted by bulldog View Post
    I did not say that to be Germanic a countrie must have to speak German. I said that most of these countries today do not identify their German connection
    But being germanic is not about a German connection. I think Theudiskaz and Raven have both explained this well by now.

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