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Thread: Which Countries Are Germanic?

  1. #271
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    Re: Which countries are Germanic?

    Quote Originally Posted by bulldog View Post
    Well as an American, we see people from each country in Europe as being different from one another, you can say that this country and that country are Germanic, but We don't see the connection as labeling them Germanic, the English to us are English, the German is German etc, we don't tie them into one group, they might have had something in common at one time, but that was a long time ago, each country has it's own language and culture, the english speak English, the French speak French etc.

    As an American I always felt closer to the English and always admired their historical history and accomplishments and feel that I would not be out of place in England.

    BTW! I am not of Anglo/Saxon heritage, but an American of Italian descent.
    Perhaps some Americans feel that way (and maybe even more than half), but certainly not all.

    To fail to see that the English and the Germans share something in common (beyond just language) that distinguishes them from the Russians on one side, the Spaniards and Italians on another side, and the Celts on another side seems kind of shortsighted to me.
    Last edited by Leofric; Wednesday, February 28th, 2007 at 02:20 AM. Reason: typo fixed

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    Re: Which countries are Germanic?

    Oops, I was just reminded I forgot the countries outside of Europe as well. My mistake ...

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    Re: Which countries are Germanic?

    - Netherlands
    -Flanders
    -Luxemburg
    -England
    -Faoer Islands
    -Germany
    -Denmark
    -Norway
    - Shetland Islands
    -Sweden
    -Austria
    -Lichtenstein
    -German-speaking area of Switzerland
    -Swedish-speaking areas of Finland
    -Iceland
    -Elsass-Lothringen
    -French-Flanders
    -Germanic areas of America and Canada
    -Germanic areas opf Australia and New Zealanmd
    -White populated areas of South-Africa and Namibia
    -Eupen-Sant Vith (Ost-Kantone) in Belgium (German speech)
    -German settlement in Romania, Poland, Siberia


    Lets not forget that there is a difference by a Germanic German, Flemish or Englishman who speak a Germanic language and a Romanized, Polonized or whatever Germanic, who is of Germanic roots but linguistic and cultural is not.

  4. #274
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leofric View Post
    Perhaps some Americans feel that way (and maybe even more than half), but certainly not all.

    To fail to see that the English and the Germans share something in common (beyond just language) that distinguishes them from the Russians on one side, the Spaniards and Italians on another side, and the Celts an another side seems kind of shortsighted to me.
    I don't think the average German and the average Englishmen today relate to one another as some sort of common bond, because of incidence that went on thousands of years ago, I think the German see's himself as German, and the englishmen see's himself as a englishmen, and neither identify themselves with the other, I think all Euro. countries see themselves as unique among themselves and don't have any historical kinship with one another.

    That's my observation of the European countries today

    Quote Originally Posted by Leofric View Post
    Perhaps some Americans feel that way (and maybe even more than half), but certainly not all.
    If you told the average American, that you were Germanic, he would just assume that you were German or German/American.

    I mean how much influence did the Germans and English have on one another, when their language and culture are so different from one another.

    I think {maybe I am wrong) that the Germans and Dutch are closely related then any of the other countries that are mentioned.

    In fact in Northern Italy their are towns where both German/Italian are still spoken today, but German is not spoken any where in England, France etc

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    Re: Which countries are Germanic?

    Quote Originally Posted by bulldog View Post
    I don't think the average German and the average Englishmen today relate to one another as some sort of common bond, because of incidence that went on thousands of years ago, I think the German see's himself as German, and the englishmen see's himself as a englishmen, and neither identify themselves with the other,
    I disagree The English see a "racial kinship" for want of a better word, with the Germans and Dutch. The English would see the Germans as distant cousins more so than Belgians, French, Italians. Russians and Finns would not be on the radar (obviously).

    Even for the historically uneducated this is constantly reinforced, because everyone has heard of Anglo-Saxons and everyone has heard of Saxony

  6. #276
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    Re: Which countries are Germanic?

    Quote Originally Posted by bulldog View Post
    I don't think the average German and the average Englishmen today relate to one another as some sort of common bond, because of incidence that went on thousands of years ago, I think the German see's himself as German, and the englishmen see's himself as a englishmen, and neither identify themselves with the other, I think all Euro. countries see themselves as unique among themselves and don't have any historical kinship with one another.

    That's my observation of the European countries today



    If you told the average American, that you were Germanic, he would just assume that you were German or German/American.

    I mean how much influence did the Germans and English have on one another, when their language and culture are so different from one another.

    I think {maybe I am wrong) that the Germans and Dutch are closely related then any of the other countries that are mentioned.

    In fact in Northern Italy their are towns where both German/Italian are still spoken today, but German is not spoken any where in England, France etc
    First of all, I think maybe you should find out just what in the Hell Germanic means, before you join an online community that seeks to preserve all things Germanic. Your ignorance doesn't make Germanicness false, it means that you are ignorant. It is clear, when you say things like
    " I don't think the average German and the average Englishmen today relate to one another as some sort of common bond, because of incidence that went on thousands of years ago" that you have a poor, no, non-existant understanding of the Germanic past.
    If you told the average American, that you were Germanic, he would just assume that you were German or German/American.
    Once again, ignorance does not constitute a valid refutation.

    I mean how much influence did the Germans and English have on one another, when their language and culture are so different from one another...but German is not spoken any where in England, France etc
    Again, you have shown your self to be completely oblivious to the truth. If you had an education you would at least be aware of the facts that a.) English and German are related languages, sharing a common origin that not only separates them from other language families, such as the Romance languages (e.g. Italian and French), but they are even more closely related than either one is to the North-Germanic languages (in other words German is closer to English, than it is to Danish). The English/Anglo-Saxons came from what is now Germany, the Netherlands, Denmark, and southern Sweden; and b.) You would know what Germanic means. Whether German is spoken in a country is not an indicator of its Germanicness.

    When you have read up on the relevant information, come back and we can discuss which countries are Germanic and which countries are not.
    -Hyge sceal še heardre, heorte še cénre, mód sceal še mįre, žż śre męgen lytlaž. -The Battle of Maldon
    -I love the great despisers, because they are the great adorers, and arrows of longing for the other shore. -Thus Spake Zarathustra

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    Re: Which countries are Germanic?

    Quote Originally Posted by OneEnglishNorman View Post
    I disagree The English see a "racial kinship" for want of a better word, with the Germans and Dutch. The English would see the Germans as distant cousins more so than Belgians, French, Italians. Russians and Finns would not be on the radar (obviously).

    Even for the historically uneducated this is constantly reinforced, because everyone has heard of Anglo-Saxons and everyone has heard of Saxony
    I think the English may reluctantly look to Germans as Kin, due to negative association since the World Wars. I personally think the English look more to Scotland, Wales and Ireland for a sense of Brotherhood, but are notably rejected. I think the most obvious nations of kin to our own, are Australia and New Zealand first and foremost.
    Tired

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    Re: Which countries are Germanic?

    Quote Originally Posted by Theudiskaz View Post
    First of all, I think maybe you should find out just what in the Hell Germanic means, before you join an online community that seeks to preserve all things Germanic. Your ignorance doesn't make Germanicness false, it means that you are ignorant. It is clear, when you say things like
    " I don't think the average German and the average Englishmen today relate to one another as some sort of common bond, because of incidence that went on thousands of years ago" that you have a poor, no, non-existant understanding of the Germanic past.
    Once again, ignorance does not constitute a valid refutation.

    Again, you have shown your self to be completely oblivious to the truth. If you had an education you would at least be aware of the facts that a.) English and German are related languages, sharing a common origin that not only separates them from other language families, such as the Romance languages (e.g. Italian and French), but they are even more closely related than either one is to the North-Germanic languages (in other words German is closer to English, than it is to Danish). The English/Anglo-Saxons came from what is now Germany, the Netherlands, Denmark, and southern Sweden; and b.) You would know what Germanic means. Whether German is spoken in a country is not an indicator of its Germanicness.

    When you have read up on the relevant information, come back and we can discuss which countries are Germanic and which countries are not.
    You're sounding a harsh, not to say vulgar, for a moderator, may I add. Stop telling the guy he's an ignorant. He posted a message you're free to discuss, and being rude only make your answer less pleasant to read.

    I think bulldog has a point when he says that the average englishman sees himself first and foremost English (or British) way before he'll refer to himself as a Germanic or North-Germanic or Germanic-speaking folk. We, people passioned by history, genealogy, linguistics and al., see a clear link between, for example, English language and German language, and we know the story of the Anglo-Saxons coming from Low Germany to invade Britain. But the core of the folks doesn't necessarily know, or simply care, about it. That fact is probably even more accurate in the New World, where only few people consider themselves culturally Europeans.

    Germanicness is both cultural and genetic. The genetic link between Germanic peoples lives and subsists by itself, but culture, or cultural consciousness, can be lost. We should work on that preservation too, not only the complain on the "racially incorrect couples". I find way less worrying to see some simple-minded young gals going on with negroes than to see european peoples forget their history.

    With that being said, I would not be ready to call the average American of, let's say, mixed German and British background, a full and noble member of Germanic people if he acts like a monkey or is completely ignorant.
    "The heavenly motions... are nothing but a continuous song for several voices, perceived not by the ear but by the intellect,
    a figured music which sets landmarks
    in the immeasurable flow of time."

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    Re: Which countries are Germanic?

    Quote Originally Posted by Theudiskaz View Post
    First of all, I think maybe you should find out just what in the Hell Germanic means, before you join an online community that seeks to preserve all things Germanic
    No one is saying that you should not preserve all things Germanic, what I am saying that in this moderen world today that these countries do not see that kinship by the present day population.




    Your ignorance doesn't make Germanicness false, it means that you are ignorant. It is clear, when you say things like
    " I don't think the average German and the average Englishmen today relate to one another as some sort of common bond, because of incidence that went on thousands of years ago" that you have a poor, no, non-existant understanding of the Germanic past.
    Once again, ignorance does not constitute a valid refutation.
    You can call people ignorant just because they have an opinion that does not suite yours, is being ignorant.

    I know about the past, but I don't think it is relevant today in these countries.

    I mean this is a discussion board is it not, can't people have their own opinions, or does every one have to fall into step.



    When you have read up on the relevant information, come back and we can discuss which countries are Germanic and which countries are not.
    Your missing the point, I am not saying those countries are not Germanic, I am saying that today that is irrelevant to these people, and I would say it is irrelevant to the German people of Germany.

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    Re: Which countries are Germanic?

    No one is saying that you should not preserve all things Germanic, what I am saying that in this moderen world today that these countries do not see that kinship by the present day population.
    I pointed out in my last post, clearly, that you don't know what Germanic means. You showed that clearly enough when you said that German is not spoken in England or France (It is spoken in parts of what is now Eastern France, in a way that suggested that this was a refutation of their Germanicness. Now if you don't know what Germanic means, how can you continue to use the word Germanic, and expect others to understand what you mean? In order to discuss an issue (in this case which countries are Germanic) the discussers must first have a common understanding of and definition of the terms being used in the discussion (in this case, the meaning of the term 'Germanic'). Agreement on terminology, semantic consensus is the first step in productive discourse.

    You can call people ignorant just because they have an opinion that does not suite yours, is being ignorant.
    No I am calling you ignorant becuase you do not know what you are talking about. Going back to semantics, you have shown that you are literally ignorant (lit. unaquainted with, unknowing), in the plainest sense of the word, of the meaning of Germanicness and and the History and Anthropology which substantiates the Germanicness common to the English and Germans. This is shown in statements of yours like the ones below.
    I don't think the average German and the average Englishmen today relate to one another as some sort of common bond, because of incidence that went on thousands of years ago
    This sentence suggests that you believe that incidents or events happened thousands of years ago which the ancestors of both the English and Germans experienced. Saying that incidents happened is hardly an accurate appraisal of the linguistic, cultural, and racial blood heitage which has bound these people since the time before they first became discernable as separate entities. Common origins, not historical incidents.
    I mean how much influence did the Germans and English have on one another, when their language and culture are so different from one another.
    Once again, you seem to have some serious misconceptions or lack of knowledge of how the English and Germans are related. It is not an issue of the two influencing on another. What they have in common is not borrowed, but inherited by both from an ancient common Proto-Germanic heritage.

    I know about the past, but I don't think it is relevant today in these countries.

    I mean this is a discussion board is it not, can't people have their own opinions, or does every one have to fall into step.
    Of course I can't stop you from having your own ideas, but I will correct those which are factually incorrect to the best of my ability. Sometimes people are wrong.
    Your missing the point, I am not saying those countries are not Germanic, I am saying that today that is irrelevant to these people, and I would say it is irrelevant to the German people of Germany.
    I realize you are saying that it is irrelevant to these people. And you are correct, in that they don't think it is relevant to them. (This is a product of their ignorance of their own heritage.) However...you are also saying things like this,
    In fact in Northern Italy their are towns where both German/Italian are still spoken today, but German is not spoken any where in England, France etc
    I dont know how else to interpret this other than an attempt to show that England and France are not Germanic because German isn't spoken there. If this is not what you are suggesting, then what is the meaning of this?
    -Hyge sceal še heardre, heorte še cénre, mód sceal še mįre, žż śre męgen lytlaž. -The Battle of Maldon
    -I love the great despisers, because they are the great adorers, and arrows of longing for the other shore. -Thus Spake Zarathustra

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