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Thread: The Indo-European and Possibly Germanic Origins of the Picts

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    The idea that they were Iberian makes sense to me. Also interesting is the description of the Pict homes as underground. Didn't the inhabitants of the Oakneys and Faeroe Islands build undergound houses or houses partially sunk into the earth and lined with rock?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Solar Wolff
    The idea that they were Iberian makes sense to me.
    If you mean from Iberia, or North Africa, then its certain that in the Mesolithic and later there was migration into Britain from the Western Mediterranean, however if youre referring to the Iberian language then nobody knows what Iberians spoke either. Theres no Basque substratum in Spanish, so Iberian wouldnt seem to be related to Basque. Its another mysterious language.

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    Here is a chapter on the Picts I just scanned for people's viewing pleasure from the book "Languages of the British Isles" by W.B Lockwood, if anyone is interested.

    The files sizes are a little large averaging at 250kb, but I kept it that way for legibility...

    Apparently it was referred to as "Iron Speech" so it must have sounded quite harsh. They were there since forever, had a matriarchal system, worshipped Serpents, etc, all rather non IE features, so why academic consensus finds it so difficult to draw the dots and conclude pictish was non IE I can't understand he Australian Aboriginies are all related racially (duh), yet IIRC there were many different language families present amongst the hundreds of different aboriginal languages despite their racial affiliation.

    I often wonder about the pre-germanic words in the germanic languages, I'd love to have seen what the original language was like before IE swept it out of NE.

    But I'll stop rambling.

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    Post

    Typically had to be one too many to all fit into the one post....

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    Good post Surt.

    Try this link:

    The Picts and the Martyrs
    Did Vikings kill the native population of Orkney and Shetland?
    A paper by Brian Smith

    http://www.orkneyjar.com/history/vik...ace/index.html

    It's worth following the links forward. There's plenty of good debate.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sigel
    It's worth following the links forward. There's plenty of good debate.
    The Picts were culturally distinct from the natives of the Orkneys. The natives of the Orkneys are the ones who built the brochs and its recorded that the Pictish king recieved "hostages" from Orkney.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cumbrian
    If you mean from Iberia, or North Africa, then its certain that in the Mesolithic and later there was migration into Britain from the Western Mediterranean, however if youre referring to the Iberian language then nobody knows what Iberians spoke either. Theres no Basque substratum in Spanish, so Iberian wouldnt seem to be related to Basque. Its another mysterious language.
    Wales was colonized by people using implements of the Ahrenburger Culture, which means that there was either a migration wave of Southerners who for some reason prefered a tool kit of North European fabric, or this population really departed from the Netherlands, Jutland and North Germany to Britain using the landbridge which now rest under the Channel.

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    More about the Picts...

    If you're interested in Picts you might also find this one interesting:

    Elizabeth Sutherland: In Search of the Picts

    I don't know if it's available as a net version though... :

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    Quote Originally Posted by Helith
    If you're interested in Picts you might also find this one interesting:

    Elizabeth Sutherland: In Search of the Picts

    I don't know if it's available as a net version though... :
    HAHA I bought the hardcover copy of that when it first came out, I was that desperate I couldn't wait for the cheaper paperback edition. There is an interesting chapter in Pictish carvings actually being a written "pictogram" language, though intriguing as the idea is, I have my doubts about it. I might scan the chapter in question as well if I'm feeling bold

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    The Pictii are indeed an interesting subject. My take on them from my readings is that they were the native Celtic or Celticized descendants of the Caledonian tribes described by Tacitus in Agricola. I believe it's been postulated that they spoke a now-defunct Brythonic Celtic language similar in nature to that spoken by the Britons. The theory is that the 'Pictish' culture and language were replaced by that of the Gaelic Scotti invaders from Ireland that eventually expanded from their kingdom of Dal Riata to take over Pictland as well, founding what's now Scotland in the 10th century, or so I seem to remember from reading.

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