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Thread: United North America - Amalgamation of Canada and the United States of America

  1. #11
    Senior Member Soten's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Americ View Post
    I would be in favor of it, but only if it was structure on the US as it was before the Civil War. More like the modern Swiss Confederation, where the current system was adopted in 1849 & based on the then existing model of the United States. Perhaps this Confederation could include Australia, New Zealand & Britian as a Anglosphere Confederation. But first we would have to sort out some domestic issues in the US, like the repatriaiton of the Latino population & maybe the resettlement of the US Negroes to the Caribbean or West Africa.


    Meaning what? Singapore & Hong Kong have no natural resources, other then location. They are very prosperous. A lot of Canada's natural rsources are already exported to the US. Are you suggesting that Canadians should not sell lumber, petroleum & metal ores to the US ?

    Yes, thanks to the votes of the non-Europid immigrant population. eyes:
    I agree that the structure of government would have to be quite different than what it is today and I do think the modern Swiss Confederation would make a great model. However, making an Anglo-sphere Confederation that also conjoined Australia, New Zealand, and Britain would certainly prove more difficult than any supposed merger with Canada and the US.

    I think that New Zealand and Australia merging would be a good idea (don't they already have something like this? Seems ridiculous if they don't). Britain, on the other hand, would be next to impossible from a British standpoint (they would decline such a proposition most likely) and probably would not gain much favour especially with Americans who although they don't harbor too much resentment towards Britain they would conjure up memories of the Revolution.

    Canada and the US seem to me like the most likely candidates (besides New Zealand and Australia together) to merge given the proper circumstances.

    As far as relocating the Mestizos and Negros goes I have always been partial to Thomas Jefferson's (was it him?) idea to relocate the Africans to the West Indies or Africa itself. I think the idea would have worked had it been carried out in his time. Nowadays that would definitely cause conflict...which is a different matter altogether.

    I think it's ridiculous to think that both the US and Canada wouldn't gain economically from such a merger...as already stated the two already export and import tons of goods back and forth.

    As far as Canadians thinking they are totally different from Americans I think that is mostly because when they say "Americans" they mean fat-cat, Wall Street, cut-throat businessmen with no care for anything but money or fat, lazy, Happy-meal-eating idiots. Which is obviously not even close to being the norm of the general populace.

  2. #12
    Senior Member Next World's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soten View Post
    I don't think that Americans (that I know of) have a very bad image of Canada at all. Sure Americans poke fun at Canadians but its light-hearted. I happen to know many people that love Canada. My mother, for instance, refuses to go anywhere outside the country unless its Canada or England. And lots of friends of mine used to say they were gonna leave and go live in Canada.
    Just the same, I know tons of people who would love for the United States to merge with Uganda, because it has such a "rich and fabulous" culture--that most Americans actually know nothing about. Americans dislike Canada for the same reason they like Cuba and Ethiopia--ignorance and cultural glances. We have a lot of Canadians around here, but they won't even defend themselves. People believe that Canada wants to "be like" America, that the people there want to "be like" Americans, and so on. It's an issue of ego. We're told that Canada sucks and that they don't have culture other than the things I mentioned before (hockey, beer, maple syrup, aye). We're told that the whole country is just one big block of ice with a few streets on it. We're told that the place doesn't really have a history. People give me the most confused looks when I talk about how many Canadians have died in various wars. Most Americans don't even realize that there are so many Asians in Canada. The greater majority of people I've talked to believe that all Canadians look like Avril Lavigne and a few other "celebs" from the country, just how 9/10 people I've spoken to don't believe that there are blacks in Europe, whites in Africa, or any other number of things. If the US had a merger with any Nation, there would be serious issues, as the majority of the population has been trained to have certain perceptions of the people. You might not, I might not, people you know might not, but the majority of people I've met from around the country do, especially in younger generations.

    As far as the culture of the South being different than New England culture--well duh. However, there are plenty of Southerners--I can hook you up with some if you'd like--who go apesh!t if you suggest that their state is part of the United States. Just the same, people in Quebec often don't want to be considered Canadians. If each Nation all ready has such huge cultural issues on a civil level, what's the point in adding more? I know I'm not a Canmerican. I never will be, either.

    Quote Originally Posted by Freydis View Post
    There are many differences, especially in legal systems and how municipalities are set up, et cetera. These would have to be sorted out. But I doubt there will be warm reception, despite supposed "cultural similiarities". All Canadians I've spoken with have seen themselves as completely and totally different from Americans. They hate being equated with them.
    That is the main issue I have. The legal system is radically different. I know ours is bogus, but it's a bogus I'm aware of. Imagine how ridiculous a Nation would be come if suddenly the people living within it had to learn and practice unfamiliar laws. How would you even combine the legal systems? I don't think it could be done easily. Just the same, most Americans don't want to be considered Canadians. Some of us have Canadian friends, some of us like to go to visit, some of us move there (mainly old people for the health care, and people involved in political/legal issues), but most of us view this as our Nation.

    I'm an American. A United States Citizen, even. I'm not ashamed of that, and if someone thinks it's so horrible, they can kiss it.

    As I said, the only thing I'd want to do with Canada is either get a path up to Alaska added to our territory (which would look ridiculous), or to give them Alaska. What I'd like to do with America, on the otherhand... is seemingly endless.


    It's kind of like how people shouldn't get married when they're both going through serious changes and issues. Both Canada and the US have enough domestic issues that they really shouldn't be considering tying the knot.
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  3. #13
    Senior Member SwordOfTheVistula's Avatar
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    Both countries are pretty similar (with the exception of Quebec). Graduates of law schools in some states are allowed to practice in Canada and vice versa. I wouldn't support a union in the current circumstances though because it would tilt the political balance well to the left of what the US currently is.

    As mentioned by others, a decentralized federation of states/provinces would work I think.

    Also there is the possibility of just reordering Anglo-America entirely if Quebec secedes from Canada, seeing as how parts of the US have more in common culturally with neighboring Canadian provinces than the rest of the US.

    Possible matchups:

    Northern New England+Maritime Provinces

    Northern California, Washington, Oregon, and British Columbia.

    Alberta/Manitoba+middle America
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    It is often remarked that Calgary has more in common with Dallas than do either one have with their own eastern cities. This is definately true of the West Coast. I am for breaking all of North America up into 8 or so countries.

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    Senior Member Soten's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Solar Wolff View Post
    It is often remarked that Calgary has more in common with Dallas than do either one have with their own eastern cities. This is definately true of the West Coast. I am for breaking all of North America up into 8 or so countries.

    And although I will most likely disagree, what 8 countries would yours be?

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    Senior Member SwordOfTheVistula's Avatar
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    If I had to divide them up, it would be thus:

    Quebec
    Northern New England+Maritime Provinces, including parts of north/western MA
    Northern California, Washington, Oregon, and British Columbia
    Former Confederacy+Kentucky, Oklahoma, and southern Missouri
    Southern California+Vegas&possibly New Mexico
    Eastern Seaboard (DC through Boston metro areas)+South/East Florida
    Ontario (at least the Eastern/Southern parts)
    Everything else, including western PA,/NY/MD, eastern Washington&Oregon, possibly the north/west parts of Texas and Ontario

    Some parts of the southern US states may end up being ceded to Mexico
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    Quote Originally Posted by SwordOfTheVistula View Post
    Quebec
    Northern New England+Maritime Provinces, including parts of north/western MA
    Northern California, Washington, Oregon, and British Columbia
    Former Confederacy+Kentucky, Oklahoma, and southern Missouri
    Southern California+Vegas&possibly New Mexico
    Eastern Seaboard (DC through Boston metro areas)+South/East Florida
    Ontario (at least the Eastern/Southern parts)
    Everything else, including western PA,/NY/MD, eastern Washington&Oregon, possibly the north/west parts of Texas and Ontario

    Some parts of the southern US states may end up being ceded to Mexico


    Interesting. Very interesting.....i think a geographical separation would be a an excellent occasion to separate racial groups (although i fear blacks would attempt toemigrate where Whites settle. Because where Whites are...there is richness. They unfortunately need us.).

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    There was a book published in the early 80s which theorized the the US & Canada were really 9 nations, economically & culturally.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soten View Post
    And although I will most likely disagree, what 8 countries would yours be?

    1. Christian Fundamentalist (somewhere in central USA)

    2. Secular/Rationalist (West Coast)

    3. Mex-America (New Mexico, parts of Arizona and California)

    4. Indian America (Probably upper mid-west USA and parts of Canada)

    5. Eastern USA, most of New England minus NYC

    6. Southern White USA

    7. Southern Black USA (borders of 6 and 7 to be worked out)

    8. Jewish USA (New York City, Miami, Washington D.C.)

    9. Open Cities (all large urban areas of mixed racial composition)

    Blacks, Whites, Religious and Secular groups would all return to their homelands. Mexicans would be kept in theirs as they cannot be differentiated from their Mexican countrymen. Jews would be forced into their areas (as they will refuse to go otherwise) and will inherit all rights, duties, responsibilities and obligations of the old United States of America. The rest of us will make a clean, clear break. Everyone will be happy except, of course, the Jews who need non-Jewish victims to be happy.

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    Senior Member SwordOfTheVistula's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Americ View Post
    There was a book published in the early 80s which theorized the the US & Canada were really 9 nations, economically & culturally.
    Yeah, that's a pretty good map. Since the 1980s though there have been a couple changes, one of which is the collapse of the American industrial base, and the rise of a commercial megapolis along the I-95 corridor from the southern suburbs of DC in northern Virginia up to the northern suburbs of Boston in southern New Hampshire. So you'd have to disband 'Foundry' and divide it up amongst the neighboring areas, and create a new 'megapolis' or 'jewish america' as Dr. SW would call it.
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