Results 1 to 8 of 8

Thread: The White Huns

  1. #1
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Last Online
    Thursday, May 10th, 2012 @ 02:10 AM
    Ethnicity
    Afrikaner
    Ancestry
    Slavic
    Country
    South Africa South Africa
    Gender
    Posts
    2,292
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    0
    Thanked in
    0 Posts



  2. #2
    Progressive Collectivist
    "Friend of Germanics"
    Skadi Funding Member

    Agrippa's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Last Online
    Monday, January 31st, 2011 @ 09:22 PM
    Ethnicity
    German
    Subrace
    Atlantid
    Location
    Asgard
    Gender
    Politics
    Progressive Collectivist
    Religion
    Catholic
    Posts
    6,969
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    9
    Thanked in
    9 Posts

    Post Re: The White Huns

    Nice pictures in your signature Vojvoda.
    Magna Europa est patria nostra
    STOP GATS! STOP LIBERALISM!

  3. #3
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Last Online
    Thursday, May 10th, 2012 @ 02:10 AM
    Ethnicity
    Afrikaner
    Ancestry
    Slavic
    Country
    South Africa South Africa
    Gender
    Posts
    2,292
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    0
    Thanked in
    0 Posts

    Post Re: The White Huns

    Quote Originally Posted by Agrippa
    Nice pictures in your signature Vojvoda.
    There are more here:

    http://www.wpmp3.ws/Seite/wpmp3/Them...inleitung.html



  4. #4
    Funding Member
    "Friend of Germanics"
    Skadi Funding Member


    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Last Online
    Friday, September 5th, 2008 @ 06:36 AM
    Subrace
    Nordid
    Country
    United States United States
    State
    California California
    Gender
    Family
    Married
    Posts
    4,095
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    17
    Thanked in
    16 Posts

    Post Re: The White Huns

    My understanding is that the Huns absorbed or destroyed (their choice) many East Germanic tribes living from the eastern Baltic to Asia Minor. Roman coins depict Atilla's grandson in relief. He was a tall, hawk-faced, long nosed, White-looking man. The chances are that some if not many Germans rode with Attilla.

  5. #5
    Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Last Online
    Thursday, October 28th, 2004 @ 10:04 PM
    Subrace
    Other
    Location
    Polska i Ossetia
    Gender
    Politics
    Socialism
    Religion
    "Arian Heretic"
    Posts
    208
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    0
    Thanked in
    0 Posts

    Post Re: The White Huns

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Solar Wolff
    My understanding is that the Huns absorbed or destroyed (their choice) many East Germanic tribes living from the eastern Baltic to Asia Minor. Roman coins depict Atilla's grandson in relief. He was a tall, hawk-faced, long nosed, White-looking man. The chances are that some if not many Germans rode with Attilla.

    The Huns of Bleda and Attila were never referred to as the White Huns.

    In case you don't know it, they were both Mongoloid.

  6. #6
    Member Razmig's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Last Online
    Friday, August 11th, 2006 @ 12:18 AM
    Country
    United States United States
    Gender
    Age
    38
    Posts
    1,165
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    1
    Thanked in
    1 Post

    Post Re: The White Huns

    The Germanics came from the East, from the Balt to Anatolia, and rode with Attila, like the Turks, Caucasians, Slavs, but since when does that make the Huns white? This is more "white" propoganda to expan the "white" borders. The Huns came from Mongolia, settlers from Anatolia sparked the intruige of the Huns to settle in fertile lands of the West. Again, Coffee with milk is not Milk, its still Coffee.

  7. #7
    You are not wrong, who deem / That my days have been a dream Johannes de León's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Last Online
    Sunday, April 15th, 2012 @ 11:03 AM
    Ethnicity
    Iberian
    Subrace
    Atlanto-Baskid
    Location
    Terra Firma
    Gender
    Politics
    Nationalism
    Posts
    1,477
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    1
    Thanked in
    1 Post

    Post Ephthalites (White Huns)

    From the 1911 edition of Encyclopædia Britannica:

    EPHTHALITES, or WHITE HUNS. This many-named and enigmatical tribe was of considerable importance in the history of India and Persia in the 5th and 6th centuries, and was known to the Byzantine writers, who call them E~OaXLrot, EOOaytroL, N4OaXiros. or A/3&XoL. The last of these is an independent attempt to render the original name, which was probably There were originally 77, but 5 have perished. Inter-tribal feuds during the period of the monarchy may underlie the events mentioned in 1 Kings xvi. 9 sq., 21 sq.; 2 Kings xv. IC. Ia.

    something like Aptal or Haptal, but the initial N of the third is believed to be a clerical error. They were also called Aeu,coi O~svo~ or Xoi3vot, White (that is fair-skinned) Huns. In Arabic and Persian they are known as Haital and in Armenian as Haithal, Idal or Hepthal. The Chinese name Yetha seems an attempt to represent the same sound. In India they were called Hnas. Ephthalite is the usual orthography, but Hephthalite is perhaps more correct.

    Our earliest information about the Ephthalites comes from the Chinese chronicles, in which it is stated that they were originally a tribe of the great Yue-Chi (q.v.), living to the north of the Great Wall, and in subjection to the Jwen-Jwen, as were also the Turks at one time. Their original name was Hoa or Hoa-tun; subsequently they styled themselves Ye-tha-i-li-to after the name of their royal family, or more briefly Ye-tha. Before the 5th century A.D. they began to move westwards, for about 420 we find them in Transoxiana, and for the next 130 years they were a menace to Persia, which they continually and successfully invaded, though they never held it as a conquest. The Sassanid king, Bahram V., fought several campaigns with them and succeeded in keeping them at bay, but they defeated and killed Peroz (Firuz), A.D. 484. His son Kavadh I. (Kobad), I being driven out of Persia, took refuge with the Ephthalites, and recovered his throne with the assistance of their khan, whose daughter he had married, but subsequently he engaged in prolonged hostilities with them. The Persians were not quit of the Ephthalites until 557 when Chosroes Anushirwan destroyed their power with the assistance of the Turks, who now make their first appearance in western Asia.

    The Huns who invaded India appear to have belonged to the same stock as those who molested Persia. The headquarters of the horde were at Bamian and at Balkh, and from these points they raided south-east and south-west. Skandagupta repelled an invasion in 455, but the defeat of the Persians in 484 probably stimulated their activity, and at the end of the 5th century their chief Toromana penetrated to Malwa in central India and succeeded in holding it for some time. His son Mihiragula (c. 51o54o) made Sakala in the Punjab hisIndian capital, but the cruelty of his rule provoked the Indian princes to form a confederation and revolt against him about 528. He was not, however, killed, but took refuge in Kashmir, where after a few years he seized the throne and then attacked the neighboring kingdom of Gandhara, perpetrating terrible massacres. About a year after this he died (c. 540), and shortly afterwards the Ephthalites collapsed under the attacks of the Turks. They do not appear to have mpved on to another sphere, as these nomadic tribes often did when defeated, and were probably gradually absorbed in the surrounding populations. Their political power perhaps continued in the Gurjara empire, which at one time extended to Bengal in the east and the Nerbudda in the south, and continued in a diminished form until A.D. 1040. These Gurjaras appear to have entered India in connection with the Hunnish invasions.

    Our knowledge of the Indian Hunas is chiefly derived from coins, from a few inscriptions distributed from the Punjab to, central India, and from the account of the Chinese pilgrim Hsan Tsang, who visited the country just a century after the death of Mihiragula. The Greek monk Cosmas Indic~pleustes, who visited India about 530, describes the ruler of the country, whom he calls Gollas, as a White Hun king, who exacted an oppressive tribute with the help of a large army of cavalry and war elephants. Gollas no doubt represents the last part of the name Mihiragula or Mihirakula.

    The accounts of the Ephthalites, especially those of the Indian Himnas, dwell on their ferocity and cruelty. They are represented as delighting in massacres and torture, and it is said that popular tradition in India still retains the story that Mihiragula used to amuse himself by rolling elephants down a precipice and watching their agonies. Their invasions shook Indian society and institutions to the foundations, but, unlike the earlier Kushans, they do not seem to have introduced new ideas into India or have acted as other than a destructive force, although they may perhaps have kept up some communication between India and Persia. The first part of Mihiragula seems to be the name of the Persian deity Mithra, but his patron deity was Siva, and he left behind him the reputation of a ferocious persecutor of Buddhism. Many of his coins bear the Nandi bull (Sivas emblem), and the kings name is preceded by the title iahi (shah), which had previously been used by the Kushan dynasty. Toramanas coins are found plentifully in Kashmir, which, therefore, probably formed part of the Hna dominions before Mihiragulas time, so that when he fled there after his defeat he was taking refuge, if not with his own subjects, at least with a kindred clan.

    Greek writers give a more flattering account of the Ephthalites, which may perhaps be due to the fact that they were useful to the East Roman empire as enemies of Persia and also not dangerously near. Procopius says that they were far more civilized than the Huns of Attila, and the Turkish ambassador who was received by Justin is said to have described them as cicrTLKoL, which may merely mean that they lived in the cities which they conquered. The Chinese writers say that their customs were like those of the Turks; that they had no cities, lived in felt tents, were ignorant of writing and practised polyandry. Nothing whatever is known of their language, but some scholars explain the names Toramana and Jauvla as Turkish.

    For the possible connection between the Ephthalites and the European Huns see HUNS. The Chinese statement that the ba or Ye-tha were a section of the great Yue-Chi, and that their customs resembled those of the Turks (Tu-Kiue),is probably correct, but does not amount to much, for the relationship did not prevent them from fighting with the Yue-Chi and Turks, and means little more than that they belonged to the warlike and energetic section of central Asian nomads, which is in any case certain. They appear to have been more ferocious and less assimilative than the other conquering tribes. This may, however, be due to the fact that their contact with civilization was so short; the Yue-Chi and Turks had had some commerce with more advanced races before they played any part in political history, but the Ephthalites appear as raw barbarians, and were annihilated as a nation in little more than a hundred years. Like the Yue-Chi they have probably contributed to form some of the physical types of the Indian population, and it is noticeable that polyandry is a recognized institution among many Himalayan tribes, and is also said to be practised secretly by the Jats and other races of the plains.

    Among original authorities maybe consulted Procopius, Menander Protector, Cosmas Indicopleustes (trans. McCrindle, Hakluyt Society, 1897), the Kashmir chronicle Rajalarangint (trans. Stein, 1900, and Yuan Chwang). See also A. Stein, White Huns and Kindred Tribes (1905); 0. Franke, Beitrage aus chinesischen Quellen zur Kenntnis der Trkvlker und Skythen (1904); Ujfalvy, Mmoire sur les Huns Blancs (1898); Drouin, Mmoire sur les Huns Ephthalites (1895); and various articles by Vincent Smith, Specht, Drouin, and E. H. Parker in the Journal of the Royal Asiatic Society, Journal asiatique, Revue numismatique, Asiatic Quarterly, &c. (C. EL.)
    .

  8. #8
    You are not wrong, who deem / That my days have been a dream Johannes de León's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Last Online
    Sunday, April 15th, 2012 @ 11:03 AM
    Ethnicity
    Iberian
    Subrace
    Atlanto-Baskid
    Location
    Terra Firma
    Gender
    Politics
    Nationalism
    Posts
    1,477
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    1
    Thanked in
    1 Post

    Post Re: Ephthalites (White Huns)

    From other encyclopedia:

    The term Hephthalite derives from Greek, supposedly a rendering of "Hayathelite", the name used by Persian writers to refer to a 6th century empire on the northern and eastern periphery of their land. In China they were known as ?? or ?? (py Yanda) also written Ye-ti-i-li-do/Yeda/Yoptal but are documented as having called themselves Hua or Huer (?), chroniclers recognising that the Chinese Yoptal terms came actually from the name of the Hua leaders. Peoples with similar Heberite ethnicons had been present in Central Eurasia for centuries. The chinese classic ? ??? describes them as of the same origin as the Hua Country (??) in China. Yanda has been given various latinised renderings, such as "Yeda", although the Korean pronunciation "Yoptal" (??) is much more recognisable and is certainly a much more archaic fossilisation. Their later name Hephthal (which some sources indicate were originally one of the 5 Yuezhi or ?? families from Kushan) is supposed to have been a name drived from their ruling elite.

    Throughout the 5th century, it was the Huer who managed to succeed to the Central Eurasian Hun heritage in a campaign which spread from Tienshan to Carpathy. After the failure of Xiong's Zhou County (352CE) the influence of the Huer dragon tribe started to expand. The influence of the northern deer-people (Elunchun) retreated north up the Yenisei as the Huer chased a western portion of the Choni into Uzbekistan (Late 4thC Alchoni) while the eastern branch founded the Xiong's last eastern dynasty Xia (407-431). By 460 the Huer had taken over much of Central Eurasia from Xinjiang to the Volga though very little is known about the area for the late 5th early 6th centuries.

    Some sources (!?refs?!) indicate that one branch of the Juan Juan was called Uar or Var(?) (!?Characters?!), and they were placed at the head of the Uighurs after Juan Juan subjugation in 460. Are the "Uar" people in question the same ?? If so they must have joined the Juan Juan in 460CE after pushing the Choni into Uzbekistan and taken over Uighuristan, then heading for Europe left the Juan Juan controlled area to Hephthalites sovereignty before the 541-545 powershift.

    Chinese sources mention a "King" called Ye-Tai-Yi-Li-Tuo (!?Characters?!) (perhaps rather the name of the dynasty than a sngle man) from 507CE indicating the Hephthal family had come to rule them in Xinjiang by this time. Sometime during Ye-Tai-Yi-Li-Tuo's reign (507-531) those Huer & Alchoni tribes who had become one unit under his direct rule sought to userp control in Xinjiang from the Juan Juan. From this time on they came to be called Hephthalites but meanwhile the rest of the Huer & Alchoni under Sarosios's father strengthened their position in Khwarezmia to conquer the dregs of Attila's Hunnic empire in the west.

    The Eastern Huer or Hephthalite control of Uighuristan was achieved between 541 & 545 during the reign of Ye-Tai-Yi-Li-Tuo's successor Toramana 2 which is why some scholars say Avar rule began in the area from this time. After Toramana 2, the Hephthalite seat of power was relocated to India.

    References to eastern "Avars" in control of Uighuristan from 541-565CE concern them. This was during the reign of the Hephthal Toramana 2 though they had a presence in Xinjiang under his predecessor Ye-dai-yi-li-tuo (507-531) even during the Juan Juan rule there (460-545). It was apparently during the reign of Ye-dai-yi-li-tuo that there was a split resulting in the western portions of Huer & Alchoni relocating their interests in the Volga region of Europe as the Avars.

    India knew the Hephthalites by the sanskrit name 'Huna' (perhaps used originally to refer to the Xiyonites?). Procopius called them "White Huns" while Simokattes calls them Uar (reminicient of their own self designation) and identifies them as the "real" Avars of the east and the true political force behind what he calls the "pseudo" Avars who eventually settled down in Transylvania. It has been said that their legendary ancestor was Afrasiabus in whose name we can perhaps see some kind of connection to the Avar ethnicon. Armenian sources also mention a White Hun origin for the Parthian Arsac. According to Simokattes, Alchoni were also a part of their composition having united under the Yoptal with the "vulturous" Uar around 460.

    White supremacists have argued that Procopius only described their Yoptal elite who were "Aryan" Caucasoids when he referred to White Huns, and much that has been written about them has been influenced by such ideas. Various theories concerning the origin of the name Yoptal include references to the number Seven and the biblical Patriarch Japheth. However, according to many authors (for example Dr. David Nicolle, Osprey) they were of Turko-Mongoloid stock.



    Variations

    Different in spellings include "Ephthalite", "Epthalite", "Ephtalite", "Eptalite", "Hepthalite", "Hephtalite", and "Heptalite". It has been suggested that Oghur & Oghuz from which derives the Russian Yugur mean White Huns (Ak-Gunz or Aq-Guzz).


    Origin Theories

    K. Enoki believed them to be an Iranian group while some of their practices remind us of Khwarezmia in which case they may have been slightly mongolian looking Indo-europeans like many of the modern Tadjiks. There were various theories about their origins documented by contemporary Chinese chroniclers as with Procopius.


    • They were related in some way to the Visha (Indo-Europeans known to the Chinese as the "Yueh Chih"),
    • They were a branch of the Kao-ch`e,
    • They were descendants of the general Pahua,
    • They were descendants of Kang Chu
    • Their origins cannot be made clear at all.
    .

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 10
    Last Post: Friday, November 3rd, 2017, 11:39 PM
  2. Replies: 3
    Last Post: Sunday, June 18th, 2017, 04:00 AM
  3. The Huns
    By Karpaten Befreier in forum Germanic & Indo-Germanic Origins
    Replies: 63
    Last Post: Thursday, March 15th, 2012, 06:34 PM
  4. Replies: 2
    Last Post: Saturday, December 24th, 2005, 12:47 PM
  5. The Volsung Saga and the Huns
    By Imperator X in forum Germanic Heathenry
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: Friday, July 29th, 2005, 05:46 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •