Northern Tradition, White Rebellion, part 1 Posted on: 2004-07-17
06:19:58
An Interview With Paul Fromm
by Kevin Alfred Strom
American Dissident Voices broadcast of July 17, 2004 listen to the
broadcast
(mp3) <http://www.natvan.com/internet-radio/ts/071704.pls >
Indefatigable Canadian free speech and pro-White activist Mr. Paul
Fromm is
shown here speaking before the audience at one of his recent protests.
Fired
for his political views in 1997 after a 25-year career as a teacher,
Mr.
Fromm has since that time devoted himself full-time to the defense of
his
people and his native land, becoming one of the leading patriots in
Canada.
This week you'll hear his story and his insights on American Dissident
Voices.
_____
TODAY WE'RE PLEASED to welcome to the American Dissident Voices
microphones
one of the leading advocates for European people in Canada, Mr. Paul
Fromm.
Mr. Fromm is one of the most active campaigners for the preservation of
our
cultural and genetic heritage in that country, and he is also an
outstanding
activist for the free speech rights of Canadians threatened by Jewish
supremacist and Politically Correct censors. He is the head of the
Canada
First Immigration Reform Committee, Citizens for Foreign Aid Reform
(C-FAR),
and the Canadian Association for Free Expression (CAFE).
KAS: Welcome to the program, Paul.
PF: It's very good to be on your program, Kevin.
KAS: I remember meeting you for the first time ten years ago at a
private
memorial service for the late Revilo P. Oliver in Urbana, Illinois.
There
were some consequences for you for participating at that service,
weren't
there?
PF: Yes. I must be somewhat unique in recent history: I was fired a
couple
of years later, in part for having attended a funeral, actually in this
case
a memorial for Professor Revilo Oliver. This was held up as one of my
great
'crimes,' falling under the accusation of 'showing persistent contempt
for
multiculturalism and ethnocultural equity,' which apparently are 'core
values' of my former employer, the Peel Board of Education.
KAS: One can't show contempt for multiculturalism?
PF: No -- readin' and writin' and 'rithmetic, they're not so important.
But
multiculturalism and 'ethnocultural equity,' that's serious stuff.
(laughter)
KAS: (laughter) Unbelievable. With your publications, your public
protests,
your Internet bulletins -- with all your work on behalf of traditional
Canada and real Canadians and their free speech rights -- you sound
like a
one-man dynamo. How many online and print publications do you issue?
PF: We have three regular newsletters; one on foreign aid and
government
affairs generally, called the C-FAR Newsletter, which comes out
monthly; we
have the Canadian Immigration Hotline, which comes out ten times a year
and
is larger, and which deals exclusively with immigration issues; and
then we
have the Free Speech Monitor, which is also a newsletter that comes out
ten
times a year, and which deals with attacks on free speech in Canada.
And I
do have two online email lists, one dealing with immigration and one
with
free speech. So altogether I have five. I'm lucky to have several
people
who
help me, two of them on a full time basis. This work in Canada is
clearly
beyond the abilities of one person; our problem is we need a lot more
people
involved.
KAS: Very good. Even in 1994, when I first met you, your career as a
free
speech and patriotic activist was already well established, wasn't it?
PF: I have been politically active, in terms of organization, since the
late
1970s. So you're right, I was already something of an activist. Now
when
the
Peel Board of Education fired me in 1997, I became almost a full-time
activist, except for some work on the side -- I still have to pay the
bills.
So I've been very active for quite a while.
KAS: Can you tell us a bit about your history, and how you came to be
active
for your race and nation?
PF: It goes back quite a long way. I was always interested in politics,
even
before I became a teenager. I did a lot of reading, reading about World
War
II, and in those days I became quite a strong anti-Communist. During
the
Vietnam War the left here, as I suppose the left in the United States
and
elsewhere, were very much against the war. So I formed a group along
with a
number of other anti-Communists called the Edmund Burke Society, and we
were
active in protesting in favor of the Vietnam War in those days, and
against
various other Communist initiatives. We had a broad range of beliefs,
not
simply anti-Communism, but we were pro-free enterprise and so on. What
we
did that was somewhat unusual was that we were able to span the age
barriers: Most of our leadership were young, in their late teens and
twenties and early thirties, but we also had a fair number of older
people.
A lot of groups elsewhere tended to be composed of just the older set,
or
maybe just young people. We were actually quite successful. For me it
was a
real training ground. Now the reasons behind the Edmund Burke Society
eventually fell apart, but it was a very useful training ground.
I must say that, if I'd had the knowledge I have today, I would
probably
have been against the war in Vietnam -- but obviously for very
different
reasons than those of the Communist agitators who were making such a
noise
back then.
When the 70s came along, I got involved in a number of other groups.
Citizens for Foreign Aid Reform was founded in 1979 to try to counter
the
guilt-mongering of the churches and others who suggested that we had to
spend far more on foreign aid and that somehow the Third World was
entitled
to it because we'd ripped them off. We thought that this was just a
complete
lot of nonsense and an utter bill of goods.
And from that, we began to get more and more into the immigration area.
I'd
become concerned about immigration back in 1972, when the Canadian
government allowed in thousands of Ugandan Asians after Idi Amin
expelled
them. And I thought that was wrong. But the really pernicious effects
of
massive Third World immigration to Canada didn't become obvious until
the
late 70s. So about that time we began to publish material on
immigration.
And as the years have gone on, that's become more and more of a focus
of a
lot of our activities here.
In 1982, the Canadian government adopted a document something like your
Bill
of Rights, called the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, which is a really
impressive-sounding thing, guaranteeing all sorts of wonderful rights
like
freedom of speech, freedom of the press, freedom of assembly, freedom
of
belief... blah blah blah. And I welcomed it at the time. But I also was
aware, as were a number of others at the time, of certain people we
used to
run into in the late 60s and early 70s, known as the Maoists -- or,
officially, the Communist Party of Canada, Marxist-Leninist. They were
a
little bit like your SDS; they were very violent. They would break up
right
wing meetings and protest against right wing professors. And their
slogan
was 'Racists and fascists have no right to speak or organize.' I began
to
notice, though, that we were hearing very very similar ideas from those
in
the upper reaches of government and from policy people who were charged
with
developing what would soon be called 'anti-racist' policies and
legislation.
So we felt there was a real necessity for a group that would try and
stick
up for the free speech and free expression provisions of the new
Charter of
Rights and Freedoms. So the Canadian Association for Free Expression
was
born.
We now have over 20 years under our belt with this Charter, and we find
that
it is in many ways meaningless. The free speech protections have been
gutted
by the judiciary. You could drive an absolute Mack truck through them.
So
we
really find ourselves fighting two parallel battles. One is the battle
for
free speech. And the other is the battle to maintain Canada as a
European
country.
KAS: Yes. Speaking of foreign aid, the whole idea seems absurd to me,
as an
American observer looking at Canada. Here you have, physically, one of
the
largest countries on Earth, with a fairly small but highly educated
population. No country on this planet is more in need of development of
its
natural resources than Canada. It seems ridiculous for you to give
money
for
Third World nations to develop theirs.
PF: Yes. And if it were just a matter of giving them money to develop
theirs, it mightn't be so bad. But in fact, what foreign aid generally
is
is
a transfer of wealth from the working people of a developed country
like
Canada or the United States to corrupt elite of some Third World
country.
We
have proven again and again that most foreign aid doesn't even go to
the
intended recipients.
KAS: Indeed.
PF: It's just an utter waste for the most part.
KAS: Why should Canadians, and people of European descent worldwide, be
concerned about their future?
PF: There are two things going on simultaneously. One, we have this
massive
Third World immigration that started out in the late 1960s in both our
countries, rapidly accelerated in the 70s and 80s, and by the 1990s
became
a
flood -- or I would say an invasion. So we have our population changing
through this government-planned and government-sanctioned invasion. At
the
same time we have a very low birthrate. I know a US demographer by the
name
of Leon Bouvier has estimated that sometime around 2050 your country
will
no
longer be a majority European or White country. And I was able to
obtain
from Statistics Canada exactly the same admission: They said that
somewhere
around 2050, people of European descent will no longer be a majority in
Canada.
One reason that we're declining more rapidly is that we have almost
twice
the immigration per capita that you do. You started in a somewhat worse
position -- some 11 per cent. of your population was Black, and you
then
added heavy Third World immigration -- and we started with virtually no
non-Whites other than a small Native Indian population. For instance,
in
1961, the city I grew up in, Toronto, had only one per cent. non-White
population. A couple of years ago the New York Times reported it was 60
per
cent.! So in about 40 years we've gone from one to 60 per cent. We
essentially lost our city.
KAS: That's more like a tidal wave.
PF: Yes, it's a tidal wave. If people are concerned about their
children
and
their grandchildren, even if not for themselves, they should seriously
consider that by 2050 , if something doesn't change -- either the rate
of
immigration or the White birthrate -- this will no longer be a European
country. I would like to think that most people would find that a
matter of
some concern.
And it's not just racial; it's cultural. It's what these people bring
to
the
table in terms of values. I saw a really interesting story in one of
the
weekend papers here in Canada, moaning and groaning about the refugees
in
Pakistan who've come from Afghanistan, saying 'Oh the world doesn't
seem to
care about them,' et cetera et cetera. And the reporter noticed that
one of
the refugee families that was on its way back to Afghanistan had had,
among
other things, a roll of deodorant confiscated by the Pakistani
authorities
because they thought it was a sex toy.
KAS: Ha!
PF: And the reporter, who was a female, was on several occasions
chastised
by one of the Afghan males for trying to talk to his wife, who was of
course
wrapped up in a bag, or burka. He said the neighbors wouldn't think
well of
them if she was seen talking to a Western woman who might be trying to
corrupt her with Western ways. Now imagine bringing people like that to
Canada. People whose attitude is such that they fear that a roll-on
deodorant might be a sex toy, and who have so much contempt for our
culture
and our way of life that they're afraid that their women will be
'corrupted.' Now I would say that they're certainly entitled to their
view
of the world, but to bring people like that into a modern First World
country is to create a clash of cultures that isn't any good for us.
And to
further hobble us, our government has adopted this insane policy of
multiculturalism, which says that all cultures are equal and no culture
is
any better than any other. And it says that we're not supposed to
impose
our
ways on others -- that's 'cultural imperialism,' et cetera et cetera.
Well,
if you bring large numbers of people who have values like those of
these
Afghanis into our country, it's absolutely a prescription for chaos.
KAS: One of the most memorable descriptions of modern, Politically
Correct
Canada I've heard is the name you gave it: Absurdistan. What did you
mean
by
that?
PF: (laughter) Well, it's sort of a subtle reminder to a lot of
Canadians
that we have a very large number of people from the Indian subcontinent
here. So it's a play on that, but also a reminder that what we have
created
here is an absurdity. We had a healthy mix of European people that had
built
a really fantastic country here. And, for reasons that still need to be
fully explored, sometime in the mid-1960s powerful forces in our
country
decided to change it -- essentially to throw it all away. We had a
really
vibrant mix of European peoples: the original settler founding peoples,
the
French, English, Scots, and Irish; supplemented by a lot of European
immigration in the latter part of the 19th century and the first half
of
the
20th century from the Ukraine, Germany, Italy, Iceland, and so on. We
had
developed what was essentially a wilderness into a really vibrant
country.
Canada, with a population of a little over 12 million people, had the
fourth
largest navy in the Second World War. We had made our mark, small as we
were, on the world. And we were, with the coming of this technological
age,
really about to come into our own. But that began to be frittered away
as a
result of this immigration and population policy.
KAS: Well, I would call it absurd if I didn't see it as criminal and
immoral.
When I was a boy, our family lived in Alaska. And we traveled most
years
from Alaska to Minnesota and back through Canada for summer vacations.
We
also visited Quebec for Expo 67. So I have many memories of the natural
beauty of Canada and the qualities of her people -- I remember them as
friendly, optimistic, hard-working, handsome, and the possessors of a
great
culture. I could sense that, even at that young age, looking at the
great
buildings and monuments of your land. They inspired me. It seems such a
crime to throw away that heritage for a Third World mélange -- for
nothing,
really.
PF: You read it exactly right. Expo 67 was the 100th anniversary of the
founding of Canada. It was our centennial. The spirit of optimism that
was
alive during Expo 67 -- the World's Fair that was held in Montreal --
was
absolutely electric. I was 18 in 1967 when I went up there. There was a
real
spirit in the air of optimism -- that we had built a lot and that we
were
just on the verge of even greater things in the future. Unfortunately,
that
was really the last hurrah.
Most people didn't realize that decisions had already been made to
change
the makeup of the country. Our immigration law changed in 1965, which
is
ironically or coincidentally exactly the same year your country turned
its
back on its European heritage.
KAS: Isn't that an interesting coincidence?
PF: I was just sufficiently politically aware then to know that the
streets
weren't filled with people demonstrating and saying 'We're sick of
being a
European country; we want to make Canada look like the antechamber of
the
United Nations.' There was no popular agitation or demand for this.
This
was
entirely an elitist decision from the top. I do find it an interesting
coincidence that both our countries changed at exactly the same time.
KAS: The same sort of anti-White bias came into existence in Europe
around
the same time; the British Commonwealth began importing its non-Whites
into
tiny Britain around the same time. So it's very difficult for me to
view
that as a coincidence. It seems to me like a coordinated plan.
PF: Yes, I agree with you.
KAS: Another thing I remember from our trips across Canada was the red
ensign flag of Canada, flying everywhere; the flag with the Canadian
shield
in the main red section, and the British Union Jack in the upper left.
That
flag symbolized a connection, a common heritage of our two countries,
the
Anglo-Saxon heritage which is still commemorated in Hawaii's flag and
which
was also used in the American 'Grand Union' flag as well. Now that red
ensign has been replaced by the maple leaf flag in Canada, yet you, at
your
protests and at your meetings, still use the red ensign. What's the
reason
for that? Can you explain the symbolism of that flag?
PF: That flag, as far as we are concerned, is the flag of the real
Canada.
And as a technical point, it was never actually delisted as Canada's
flag.
They added the maple leaf flag, and most people consider that the new
flag
of Canada, but the old red ensign was never decommissioned or delisted
--
so
it is also an official flag. This change was made in 1965 -- isn't that
coincidental? -- the year they changed the immigration policy.
My analysis of that is that when you're about to utterly change a
country,
you don't want the old symbols around, because the symbols will clash
with
the new order you're trying to create. Their criticism of the old red
ensign
was that it stressed our European heritage -- you've got the Union Jack
in
the top left, which correctly emphasized the fact that our legal system
and
our political system derives from Britain. Of course, multiculturalism
is
very uncomfortable with that: We're supposed to believe that everybody
contributed equally; the natives of the Congo, the denizens of Samoa,
all
contributed every bit as much to Canada as the founding European
people. So
the old symbolism was inconvenient.
Also the crest was filled with reminders of our European heritage -- it
contained the crests of the French, the Irish, and the Scots; and then
the
three maple leaves joined together at the bottom of the crest, which
were
originally green maple leaves, symbolized the founding European
peoples.
This can be read a number of ways, but the founding European peoples --
the
French, the English, and then the others who came later, all united to
create the one.
It was a very powerful and very dramatic flag. I believe that the real
reason it was changed in favor of the new one was not to have a
reminder
there of what Canada was.
KAS: Does the red ensign still fly anywhere in Canada?
PF: Oh, yes. We fly it at all our protests, we fly it at meetings, and
a
lot
of our members wear it as a cap badge or a jacket badge. We've got a
lot of
young people, and it's become the symbol you'll see from coast to
coast.
And
other young people who look at it know what it means. And it's
interesting
that it is most popular among people who were born long after it had
stopped
being used as Canada's flag.
KAS: So, in a way, it's a symbol of both tradition and rebellion.
PF: Yes, exactly. A symbol of tradition and rebellion. A little bit
like
the
battle flag of the Confederacy is in your country.
KAS: And some people say the same thing about the Betsy Ross flag in
the
United States, the thirteen-stars-in-a-circle flag...
PF: Right.
KAS: Paul, you've been very active in protesting the outrageous
treatment
of
Canada's most famous, and obviously and unquestionably innocent,
political
prisoner: Ernst Zundel. We've interviewed official Zundel spokesman
Mark
Weber many times on this program, so our listeners are probably
familiar
with the case, but they may not be familiar with your role in
organizing on
Mr. Zundel's behalf. What have you and your supporters been doing
recently?
PF: I have kind of a mixed role. I was his first legal representative.
When
he was deported to Canada and faced an immigration hearing, he had not
yet
been able to secure a lawyer, so I represented him. I'm not a lawyer,
but
I've had a fair deal of legal experience. Since then, the Canadian
Association for Free Expression has been helping to line up witnesses,
and
making sure that there's always a good contingent of supporters in the
courtroom. Every time he makes an appearance, we fill the court with
supporters as silent witnesses to the injustices that are being done.
I've
been involved in raising money for him, and of course we've also put on
protests. We've had demonstrations outside the prison on a fairly
frequent
basis. In fact, another one is coming up on the 25th of July. Those
spread
among supporters to some other cities: We've had protests outside the
office
of the minister in charge of security in Edmonton on several occasions
this
past spring and winter.
A lot of my work is to try and inform supporters across Canada and also
in
the United States about the case, in person. It's one thing to read
about
it
and quite another to have someone explain it to you live and be able to
answer your questions. I've made by my count six appearances in the
first
six months of this year, 2004, in the US, and possibly three dozen
talks
across Canada in that period of time on this topic. I see myself as an
information source for people who are interested in -- and may be
likely to
support -- Mr. Zundel.
KAS: How can people find out more about your efforts, and also about
this
protest coming up on the 25th of July?
PF: They can visit our Web page, which is
http://www.canadianfreespeech.com
<http://www.canadianfreespeech.com/ > , or they can contact me
personally
at
paul@paulfromm.com
KAS: What about people who don't have access to the Internet?
PF: For people who want to contact us by mail, it's:
Box 332
Rexdale
Ontario
M9W 5L3
Canada
Donations to Ernst Zundel's defense may be sent to the same address.
_____
Be sure to be listening next week to the conclusion of this interview
with
Paul Fromm, in which Paul and I will be discussing the tragic effects
of
non-White immigration, the attacks on freedom of speech and freedom of
thought in Canada, and the precedent-shattering 'Hands Off the
Internet'
protest which Paul organized and which took place outside a synagogue.
That's all next week, on American Dissident Voices.
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