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Thread: Ancient Germans weren't so fair

  1. #31
    Senior Member Jute's Avatar
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    Didn't some of the preserved ancient bodies that have been found in the bogs of Germanic Europe, have red hair?

    And,
    Shouldn't this article be named "Ancient Germans Weren't So Red-Headed"?

  2. #32
    Senior Member Kreis AnnA's Avatar
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    The Finnish show much less diversity than other lands where blondness, fairness is common, so selection is higher for these characteristics. Their gene pool is a bit shallow to the point that there are incidences of genetic disorders peculiar to Finns alone:

    http://www.vaestoliitto.fi/in_english/genetics/rare_diseases/finnish_disease_heritage/

    The Finnish disease heritage (FDH) consists of almost forty rare hereditary diseases that are clearly more prevalent in Finland than elsewhere in the world. These all are particularly rare diseases: the FDH does not include so-called common diseases that are also caused by genes, though only partly (for example cardiovascular diseases). On the other hand, the concept of Finnish disease heritage reversed means that there are many diseases lacking in Finland that are common elsewhere in the world.

    A further description is given here:

    http://www.findis.org/main.php?action=disease

    The demographic history of Finland is typical of many isolates. A small number of original founders, subsequent isolation, rapid expansion and major bottlenecks have allowed genetic drift to mould the gene pool. The vast majority of Finns descend from two immigration waves occurring about 4,000 and 2,000 years ago. The earlier wave involved eastern Uralic speakers, and the later wave, Indo-European speakers from the south. Both Y-chromosomal haplotypes and mitochondrial sequences show the low genetic diversity among Finns compared with other European populations and confirm the long-standing isolation of Finland.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChaosLord View Post
    . Tanning easily could be because ancient Europeans were outdoors more in the warmer and sunnier months foraging, hunting, growing foods, and travelling rather than sitting inside their houses like we do nowadays.
    What an insightful observation. The Chaoslord couch potato retro-pigmentation hypothesis. I like it!


    .Scear

  4. #34
    Senior Member Crabby Badger's Avatar
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    Human Populations Becoming More Divergent

    I read an interesting article a couple of months ago on worldwide genetic trends. The general picture is over time was that human populations were quite different, then some major culling of the gene pool and then again now where we are in a major diversifying of the gene pool again. Meaning specifically that all human populations spread out over the world are becoming more divergent and that the different geographical groups are moving in different directions. Examples of this are the spread of partial resistance to malaria in Africa and the increasing rates of blonds and blue eyes in European populations - yes, blonds are not going extinct apparently but redheads are in trouble.

    May I recommend the Science Daily Website - always has a fair number or random and obscure studies that never make most websites or news programs.

  5. #35
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    Blond hair is something I really do not understand. I've seen half Chinese half White adults having light brown and rarely blonde hair.
    Even Palin's children (1/8 Eskimoe) have fairly light hair

  6. #36
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    I would attribute dipigmentation initially to nutritional matters. I have heard all types of theories, such as natural breeding selection, or the geographical matters, but that would not make sense.

    The Sami, who mostly tend towards being of fairly dark pigment, inhabited and still inhabit a similar, if not colder and more northerly climate. And the "blond belt" is at a height which should guarantee most Siberians to be blonde, too, something that does not ring true. And what about the Eskimoes?

    I would link it to a insufficiency of Vitamin D for a long time. Fish is an integral part of the Eskimo and Sami diet, but has never been much of a traditional food in most Germanic countries, and there where they have been, such as England, we're talking about 1500 years and other circumstances being less harsh.

    I could well believe that this insufficiency in Vitamin D could be balanced by depigmentation, which influences melanine, because less of this vitamin was then needed to survive in the Ice Age.

    Or something along the lines. It would also explain the occurence of blonde and red hair with the Australian Aborigine populations - who aren't exactly renowned for a traditionally savoury diet...
    -In kalte Schatten versunken... /Germaniens Volk erstarrt / Gefroren von Lügen / In denen die Welt verharrt-
    -Die alte Seele trauernd und verlassen / Verblassend in einer erklärbaren Welt / Schwebend in einem Dunst der Wehmut / Ein Schrei der nur unmerklich gellt-
    -Auch ich verspüre Demut / Vor dem alten Geiste der Ahnen / Wird es mir vergönnt sein / Gen Walhalla aufzufahren?-

    (Heimdalls Wacht, In kalte Schatten versunken, stanzas 4-6)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sigurd View Post
    I would attribute dipigmentation initially to nutritional matters. I have heard all types of theories, such as natural breeding selection, or the geographical matters, but that would not make sense.
    [..]
    I would link it to a insufficiency of Vitamin D for a long time.
    There is a distinction between skin pigmentation and hair pigmentation.
    There seems to be no real mechanism that makes the hair automatically lighter if the skin is lighter, light hair also has no involvement in Vitamin D production. Therefor many attribute skin pigmentation to a Vitamin D based natural selection, and hair pigmentation to sexual selection.

    Actually, I think light hair is still a little mystery, maybe it simply stems from the fact that we are the children of the son god.
    "Nothing is more disgusting than the majority: because it consists of a few powerful predecessors, of rogues who adapt themselves, of weak who assimilate themselves, and the masses who imitate without knowing at all what they want." (Johann Wolfgang Goethe)

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