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Thread: Genetic Similarities between Arabs and Iranians

  1. #31
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    Re: Arabs and Iranians

    Aye, I've read lots of discussions of European mythology where reference has been made to Aryan parallels.
    Quote Originally Posted by Aupmanyav View Post
    Yes, my information is based on B. G. Tilak's 'Arctic Homes in Vedas', which is available on the internet at http://www.vaidilute.com/books/tilak...-contents.html in its entirity, thanks to a teen-aged Lithuanian girl, Gabriella, in Eugene, Oregon. Do not dismiss astronomical references, because for some things, they could be the only references available.
    Thanks, but this Tilak is clearly a Believer in this Arctic theory, so I don't know if I can thrust him.
    Can you not find the relevant lines that provoked this theory in an objective source, so that I can evaluate them myself, before seeing how the likes of Tilak have done this?

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    Re: Arabs and Iranians

    20,000 yrs and an Ice age?, I dont believe a coherant myth/tribal history would be able to survive with such accurate detail, even when sanskrit was present for the tales to be written down, thousands of years would have passed since the important ethnographic and migratory events took place, the dream time of the aborigines in australia is the closest thing that comes to mind, but with such a spanse of time, decyphering physical realities from stories supposedly that old is next to impossible, in 4 thousand years a new ethnicity can be born while its ancestor groups fade into obscurity or take refuge in isolated areas, to expect to get clear and coherantly handed down facts from mythology that predates written language is a big leap of faith to put it lightly, from this point anthropological artifacts are the prime material for deducing facts about culture and race. One can be a learned scholar reading the most aincent myths captured in written form, and take a good guess as to the influences that were present to be passed down through word of mouth before that, but going back millenia from that point already, and expecting factual physical historyis too much for me to swallow.

    I know Hindi and Celtic Cultures are sibling to one another, same goes for the whole IE IA family tree, when Ice expanses were covering the earth during the ice age, I do not think anything but Paleolithic forms of Eurasian tribes lived on the part of the earth in question, in prototype Asian and europid realms perhaps, but nowhere near the point to have proto IE culture, the society these tribes had were the foundations to all Eurasian societies, its just too early or far back to deduce a specific root culture in the mythology of a specific society today,

  3. #33
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    Re: Arabs and Iranians

    Quote Originally Posted by Oswiu View Post
    Thanks, but this Tilak is clearly a Believer in this Arctic theory, so I don't know if I can thrust him.
    Bal Gangadhar Tilak was an truly exceptional person, among the ones who introduced Gandhi in Indian politics, a fearless freedom fighter, Sanskrit scholar and philosopher, and a votary of truth. We do not have likes of him in India today. He was the first to declare during his court trial by the British that 'Freedom is my birth-right, and I will not rest untill I get it.' If you know what I am pointing at, he was one person who would not speak a lie even if it saved his theory from being demolished. I am sure, you also had people like that in your country in olden days, very up-right.

    I will surely give you the best references from his book so that it saves time for you, but I would need time to choose from the hundreds, literally hundreds, that are there in his book.

    Bioblitzkrieg: Vedas are no different from the dream time songs of Australian aboriginals, Same, or Red Indian songs (or for that matter the songs of any other people of great antiquity), and they were composed by paleolithic people. They don't have any mention of iron, or bronze, all solid material was just Ayas (from which the word iron is derived), even the stones. As I said previously, all four-legged animals were Gawah (from which the word cow is derived). I wonder at the coincidence when 21st century people term a female elephant as a cow.

    These paleolithic people, living under open skies, must have been geat visualizers (that is why we call wise people as Seers), at least in Indian Aryans they created beautiful and meaningful poetry, some thing which many others also must have done, if those would have survived (like the Edda). The questions that keep our philosophers busy are nothing new. Even five thousand year ago, the Indian Aryans were debating on the creation of universe and the origin of Gods in the 'Nasadeeya Sukta' (I, with whatever knowledge of science in this 21st century cannot think of changing even one word of it). And, of course, we should remember that the Neanderthals knew the secret of everlasting life because they covered their dead with red ochre (what I would like to say is that the philosophy of life was being discussed even before the arrival of Sapien Sapiens). Not knowing how to write was never a problem with these people, they worked hard to preserve their heritage, among the priestly class youth was earmarked for this purpose only (as the brahmins in India do even today, learning the Vedas by heart, with the correct stresses on words and sounds, even after we have known writing for many millenia).
    Last edited by Aupmanyav; Tuesday, December 12th, 2006 at 11:26 AM.

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    AW: Arabs and Iranians

    @pacific

    Cyrus the Great certainly had a tribal identity. But that does not make any difference. Cyrus the Great was not an anthropologist. Today's discussions are about entirely different questions. Aryan is noble or not has nothing to do with language or bone structure.
    Persians used another word for noble, Darius once said how noble the Achaemenids were and did not use Arya. His son Xerxes on the other hand listed his ancestors and said at the last point that he is an Aryan of Aryan linage. He meant that Aryans were some kind of ancient/mythic people which formed the Persians. In the Avesta Aryans were also People.

    Persians didn’t resemble very much the classical middle-eastern at that time. They were not only significantly taller they also had other traits like the long skull with high forehead which were at that time seldom amongst non-IE people. Thus it can be said Persians knew that there were different people from a different place now ruling the middle east, that’s why they always stressed that they were of Aryan origin.
    636 A.D Rostam Eran-Sepahbod:

    "Lineage and skill will garner no respect,
    Men will be mutual thieves and have no shame,
    What's hidden will be worse than what is known,
    and stony-hearted kings will seize the throne.
    A misbegotten slave will rule the earth,
    Greatness and lineage will have no worth,
    No one will keep his word…

    Then Persians will live together side by side
    with Turks and Arabs, mixed far and wide...
    The three will blur, as if they were the same..."

  5. #35
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    Re: AW: Arabs and Iranians

    Quote Originally Posted by Skyht View Post
    @pacific



    Persians used another word for noble, Darius once said how noble the Achaemenids were and did not use Arya. His son Xerxes on the other hand listed his ancestors and said at the last point that he is an Aryan of Aryan linage. He meant that Aryans were some kind of ancient/mythic people which formed the Persians. In the Avesta Aryans were also People.

    Persians didn’t resemble very much the classical middle-eastern at that time. They were not only significantly taller they also had other traits like the long skull with high forehead which were at that time seldom amongst non-IE people. Thus it can be said Persians knew that there were different people from a different place now ruling the middle east, that’s why they always stressed that they were of Aryan origin.
    Those Kings were not anthropologist and the discussion is not about Avesta. Aryan migration theory is about the modern theories in anthropology. Some people are mixing up these two entirely different subjects.

    Of course Aryans were a different ethnic group from the natives of Middle East. No question about that. But the point is we are discussing a different area. It is anthroplogy and not mythodology.

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