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Thread: The Amish & Pennsylvania Dutch/Germans

  1. #131
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    Linguistics study

    There was an interesting linguistics study done on the Pennsylvania Dutch some years ago. It was noticed that they were speaking English with a sound shift or accent. They studied them over many years and found that the elder females or Matriarchs of the family were the first to start the sound shift. A short time later the younger females picked up the sound shift. A few years later the younger men picked it up. The last ones to pick it up were the older men. So the Matriarchs of the family may be responsible for starting new dialects that finally morph into new languages.

  2. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by Urglaawer View Post
    Ich kann Deitsch schwetze. Un der Urglaawe benutzt beed Deitsch un Englisch.

    http://www.urglaawe.org
    http://www.deitscherei.org
    http://micronation-deitscherei.blogspot.com

    Die Deitsch Schprooch iss noch am Lewe.
    I'm still in a rather neutral position to Urglaawe, as I am too all religion, it's not really my thing. But I think it encourages the one way that Deitsch can continue; building up groupings and enclaves of fancy Dutch speakers. I mean it would be more difficult in these economic times, but if our people could move into our areas and towns where we could form the majority again and teach the language to our children and ethnic Dutch, and then go from there. But that'd only really be possible if we had a centralized group, as there seems to be a few (very small) groups trying to preserve the culture in some form.

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    If I recall the Penn germans are from the Rhineland Pflaz

    A similar thing happened to the German settles in ST Louis. They were from the Rhineland mostly but called the "South Side Dutch" Becuase the mainly settled around the south side of St Louis (making it the beer capital of the world Becuase they called themselves Deutsch the inhabitints of the city thought they were saying Dutch
    Where now the horse and the rider? Where is the horn that was blowing?
    Where is the helm and the hauberk, and the bright hair flowing?
    Where is the hand on the harp-string, and the red fire glowing?
    They have passed like rain on the mountain, like a wind in the meadow;
    The days have gone down in the West behind the hills into shadow.

  4. #134
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    THE AMISH SHOW US WHAT THE WEST COULD’VE BEEN



    Three months ago, as I was walking by soccer fields in my local sports complex, I saw something that amazed me: two fields were being used by high-school aged Amish and Dutch Mennonite communities that were on a rare trip to the outside world.

    Admirably, the young women played on one field while the young men played on the other. Here, there was no sign of an egalitarian, co-ed, genderless safe space. Gender differences were acknowledged and respected.

    Even in the scorching summer heat, the girls wore modest squirts, that extended beyond their knees (in the same vein, the young men wore properly-fitting pants and shirts). The young girls also were healthy and fit. They had no tattoos, no piercings, no dyed, half shaven hair. There were no outward signs of brokenness. They were playing with a cordial innocence, the kind you’d expect from teenaged girls who haven’t been tarnished and soiled by consumerism, social media, and postmodern filth. They were beautiful, happy, and innocent.

    On the adjacent field, the young men were playing an old-fashioned, no-nonsense game of footy. No whining and certainly no bitching. Every player was getting on with their task with gravitas and determination. The young men were playing with an incredible intensity. They were determined to score, and to win. All forms of masculine virtues were on display.

    These scenes were bittersweet

    As a first-generation immigrant to the West, I had never witnessed anything like this. Sure, I’ve watched many soccer games. I’ve seen genders segregated. I’ve encountered groups of young men and women, who had not been physically marked by the degenerate ‘edgy’ fads of SJW culture. I’ve even seen modestly dressed women playing sports. But this was the first time I’ve seen all of the above displayed by Canadians of European ancestry.

    These scenes were bittersweet. Bitter, because it made me lament and yearn for a day and age when I too can take part in a society with such rich tradition and values. A society where men are not scorned or demeaned, but respected and esteemed. A society where women are not placed on an altar demanding to be worshiped. Here, there was an unerring feeling that these young women admired and even adored these young men.

    In a few years short years, these young men will marry these virgin, pure, and chaste young women. Left to the pastoral, traditional setting, where no liberal welfare state exists to pacify the masculine instincts, these men will protect these young women, provide for them, and in return, the women will cherish them and love them for it. The lack of a welfare state also means that these women will seek masculine virtues in their men. In the absence of a ‘generous’ and ‘stable’ state, they will seek a generous and stable husband.

    A violent diatribe against the modern West

    It was sweet, because this was an enormous vindication. These scenes were a visually violent diatribe against the degenerate, failing, and weak West. Here was a social group that was purposely stuck in time.

    After all, for many complex reasons, the Amish and Mennonite communities chose to be insular and rarely change their mode of traditional, pastoral living. Yet while they remain technologically “limited”, their social and group dynamics are superior to those of our modern Western Civilization.

    Drawing this into stark perspective, was the third field, that was occupied by a co-ed (i.e. non-segregated) Canadian group of young men and women playing soccer. The women were fat, obnoxious, and foul mouthed. They sported aggressive, masculine tattoos. Meanwhile, the men were weak and effeminate house-pets, almost subjugated and controlled by these vile women. The women were barking orders, and the men would do as they were told, without batting an eye-lash. Such are the rotten fruits that feminism has produced.

    The Amish however, rejected influences of the enlightenment, and by extension, all the false doctrines that came after it – Marxism, feminism, postmodernism. And because of that, they can bear the fruits of a superior existence. They are not afflicted by counter-intuitive ideologies that seek to disrupt the natural order of humanity, and create a deep-seated resentment, and fatal division. Instead, they are guided by Christian beliefs that not only bestow on them an abundance of virtue, but also social and group unity and cohesion. Men, women and children know their place in society.

    The Amish, an image of the West’s former self

    While we can always compare the modern West to pictures and movies of the its past self, why create hypotheticals and possible ‘straw-societies’? We can avoid speculation and introduce certainty into our analysis by drawing comparisons with communities like the Amish and Mennonites that are quite literally stuck in time.

    It is true that pastoral Germanic and Dutch traditions of the Amish are not wholly representative of an ever-cosmopolitanizing impulse throughout Europe at the time. However, rural farming communities were still a dominant part of the landscape. These societies strongly resemble the post-reformation, pre-enlightenment state of Western Civilization. They are an incredible snapshot into this bygone era. By extension then, the Amish and Mennonites are an image of the West’s former self.

    For these reasons, the Amish and Mennonite societies can be the control group when observing the Western experiment. The modern West, the test-tube that has been relentlessly inculcated with feminism, Marxism and postmodernism, is a decrepit and dying society, that just cannot wait to be conquered and subdued by virile foreign hordes. The control test-tube that has avoided these ideologies, the Amish and Mennonite society, has remained strong, self-sufficient and continues to yield an abundance of life-energy. Its people are self-assured and more alive. They are more human.

    The Amish are culturally superior

    How do we know the west has socially degenerated beyond recognition? Because it is far inferior to the cultural image of its former self. The Amish are far superior. They’re youth are alive and happy. Our youth are confused, sad and anxious. Their young men are brooding with confidence, testosterone, and masculinity. Ours are doubtful and weak. Their young women are feminine and willing to be led. Ours are aggressive and lack virtue. They’re posterity will inherit great riches, born about by tradition, patriarchy and God-fearing. Ours will inherit doubt and depravity.

    Far after the degenerating West collapses into a matriarchal, egalitarian third-world basket-case, barbarian hordes will marvel at Amish and Mennonite communities as outposts of a once-great civilization.
    http://www.returnofkings.com/126591/...t-couldve-been

  5. #135
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    Here another article about the Amish which explains away some of the stereotypes about their approach toward technology. I bold some of the essential parts:

    The Amish: America’s most sophisticated users of technology

    The Amish are better known for their rejection of modern technology than their large families (though the latter follows from the former, if you catch my drift). What’s less understood is why they choose to live without cars, televisions and many of the other things that we take for granted. It’s not out of a fundamentalist belief that things invented after a certain date are sinful. Nor is it because the Amish are simple-minded hicks unable to cope with new-fangled gadgetry. In fact, the opposite is true – the Amish are among the most sophisticated users of technology on the planet.

    It’s a point that becomes apparent in Michael J Coren’s interview with Jameson Wetmore for Quartz:

    “…the Amish [do not] view technology as inherently evil. No rules prohibit them from using new inventions. But they carefully consider how each one will change their culture before embracing it. And the best clue as to what will happen comes from watching their neighbors.

    “‘The Amish use us as an experiment,’ says Jameson Wetmore, an engineer turned social researcher at the Arizona State University’s School for the Future of Innovation in Society. ‘They watch what happens when we adopt new technology, and then they decide whether that’s something they want to adopt themselves.’”

    Within the Amish community, there are different sub-denominations of various degrees of strictness. Then there are ‘para-Amish’ groups, like the Mennonites, who come from the same Anabaptist tradition as the Amish, but are more accommodating of modernity. And, of course, when the Amish ride their horse-and-buggies into town, they share the same spaces as ordinary Americans.

    Therefore, they can observe a wide range of lifestyles from that of the Swartzentrubers (the most conservative of the Amish) all the way through to the completely secular.

    It’s a broad spectrum, but not one without clear dividing lines between Amish and non-Amish:

    “It’s interesting that the Amish have different districts, and each district has different rules about what’s allowed and what’s not allowed. Yet it’s very clear there are two technologies that, as soon as the community accepts them, they are no longer Amish. Those technologies are the television and the automobile.”

    Many of the Amish do use telephones, but they ban them from the home – confining them to phone shanties at the edge of the community. (Mobile phones, however, have confused matters somewhat.)

    The Amish relationship with technology, therefore, is negotiable – but, crucially, they have developed (retained?) the ability to make the big decisions at a community level – i.e. collectively and locally:

    “For the Amish, there are no rules prohibiting new technologies. So typically what will happen is one member of the community will say, ‘You know, I’m fed up with axes. I’m using the chainsaw.’

    “So maybe he goes out and begins to use a chainsaw. You might get some stern looks from neighbors, but officially it’s not prohibited. Every six months, the [Amish district councils] sit down and discuss. People are beginning to use chainsaws in our communities: Is this what we want? And then they have a conversation about it.”

    In the ‘English’ (i.e. non-Amish) world, we make decisions about technology at the level of the individual and, in some cases, the family. In practice, however, our autonomy is limited. New technology, and the social change that comes with it, is something that just happens to us.

    Wetmore mentions the social impact of the motorcar. Streets used to be for people – a playground for children, a meeting place for adults. With the coming of the car, that changed – children were literally driven out, and adults have to watch their step. It was a profound alteration to the everyday life of our communities, but how many of them ever made a deliberate decision whether to accept it or not?

    Wetmore quotes the motto of 1933 Chicago World Fair: “Science finds. Industry applies. Man conforms.”

    In Amish society, however, man doesn’t conform.

    The rest of us need to become technological non-conformists too. The implications of advances in artificial intelligence, robotics and genetic engineering are too big for us to continue as passive recipients of change.

    In the end this is not about our machines; it’s about us.

    The Amish make conscious decisions about which technologies enable them to remain Amish. Before long, we will need to decide which technologies allow us to remain human.
    The source

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  7. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by Siebenbürgerin View Post
    Here another article about the Amish which explains away some of the stereotypes about their approach toward technology. I bold some of the essential parts:
    The source
    I know Amish or Mennonites have different approaches to technology. The stereotype is simple clad family that refuses to use automobile, electricity, telecommunication devices, etc. What I however see is a clever approach to avoid devices one can not build or maintain with relatively simple hand tools. That way they'll always can sustain the capital they use without having to rely on outside help. In practice this means, you or a neighbor can fix your stuff without having to expend larger amounts of money to some outside source. He could always use his own labor to maintain the technology he uses in his daily life.

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    I happen to like watching For Richer Or Poorer and Witness films. I really enjoy Amish food, mostly pickled eggs and gherkins. I drive by a little store every day for work, but never have time to stop over and check it out. As for Amish romance novels... LOL

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodskarl Dubhgall View Post
    I happen to like watching For Richer Or Poorer and Witness films. I really enjoy Amish food, mostly pickled eggs and gherkins. I drive by a little store every day for work, but never have time to stop over and check it out. As for Amish romance novels... LOL
    The weird thing about the term: Pennsylvania Dutch is that it is a catch all.

    So all Amish are Pennsylvania Dutch, but not all Germans in Pennsylvania are Amish.

    A lot of late 19th century and early 20th century German immigrants that happened to end up in Pennsylvania, became "Pennsylvania Dutch" to explain away why they talked so funny.

    Speaking for me, my grandmother was always described as " Pennsylvania Dutch", to any Americans, but in reality, she was just a descendant from German immigrants, and ended up in Pennsylvania.

    Lots of German hatred in middle 20th century America, it was on the TV all the time.

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    I know that Amish vs fancy Dutch basically are Radical vs Evangelical and Reformed. Amish are a plain folk.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodskarl Dubhgall View Post
    I know that Amish vs fancy Dutch basically are Radical vs Evangelical and Reformed. Amish are a plain folk.
    Not sure you understand, religion has little to do with it.

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