View Poll Results: What should the orientation of Skadi Forum be?

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80. This poll is closed
  • Germanic preservation.

    51 63.75%
  • Germanic and Anglo-Saxon preservation.

    14 17.50%
  • Celto-Germanic preservation (Germanic and Celtic preservation).

    17 21.25%
  • I'm indifferent. / Sounds all good. / I don't care. / I don't know.

    12 15.00%
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Thread: Skadi Forum Orientation?

  1. #31
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    AW: Re: Skadi Forum Orientation?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Black Prince
    One could always include a little line beneath the Germanic preservation banner which mentions something like: Anglo-Saxons, Teutons and Vikings (alphabetically ordened).
    Does anyone know why the the English use terms like "Teutons" for Germans like, for example, in "Teutonic Order"?
    Tolerance is a proof of distrust in one's own ideals. Friedrich Nietzsche


  2. #32
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    AW: Re: Skadi Forum Orientation?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyklop
    Does anyone know why the the English use terms like "Teutons" for Germans like, for example, in "Teutonic Order"?
    In the particular case of the Teutonic Order that comes without doubt from its Latin name Ordo Teutonicus. In medieval Latin, Teutonici, Teutones etc. was the standard ethnic designation for the Germans (besides designations like Germani or Alemanni). It came up in the whole era around 1000 A.D., when indeed a common German folk identity emerged, as neo-classical national name of the Germans because of its similar sound to the Germans' own lingual and ethnic designation deutsch (or diutisk etc., as the early forms of deutsch were) and replaced the less elegant theodiscus which had existed as Latinisation of deutsch for some time before.

    The actually correct English translation of Ordo Teutonicus would be indeed "German Order", as it is called Deutscher Orden in German and as Teutonicus of medieval Latin sources is of course always deutsch in German medieval sources ...

    As far as I know the English still used "Dutch" and "Dutchland" as their actual word deutsch for all Germans and Germany in early modern times, until it was limited to the Netherlanders, when they finally formed themselves out as a seperated national entity from the Germans. The Germans got then in English the Latin designation "German" as ersatz name.

    The use of "Germanic" and "Teutonic" in English looks for me anyway a bit arbitrary, and I see both used for the (modern) Germans as well as for all (modern) Germanic peoples or the ancient Germanic tribes. (At least in older English texts, e.g. in the books of Madison Grant, I see "Teutonic" often used for "Germanic".) So if Skadi uses "Germanic" as all-inclusive term for Germans, Anglo-Saxons and the others and "Teutonic" one stage below for Germans and Netherlanders, an Anglo-Saxon might protest that he uses to think that only the Germans were "Germanic", but the Anglo-Saxons were "Teutons" ...

    The German usage here is much clearer, with the Germans being Deutsche, the whole of the ancient and modern Germanic peoples Germanen, and Teutonen being called the specific ancient Germanic tribe of the Teutoni in Jütland who moved southwards and were defeated at Aquae Sextiae by the Romans. Though, of course, also here Germanen and Teutonen is sometimes used in a rather unserious-journalistic way as a synonym for the nowerday Germans (e. g. Teutonengrill for the German mass vacationer regions at the Adriatic coast).
    Man ſei Held oder Heiliger. In der Mitte liegt nicht die Weisheit, ſondern die Alltäglichkeit.

    SPENGLER

  3. #33
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    Sv: Skadi Forum Orientation?

    The Romans of classical times actually used "Germanici" for all Germans. Tacitus writes about the name in the beginning of Germania:

    "The Germans themselves I should regard as aboriginal, and not mixed at all with other races through immigration or intercourse. For, in former times it was not by land but on shipboard that those who sought to emigrate would arrive; and the boundless and, so to speak, hostile ocean beyond us, is seldom entered by a sail from our world. And, beside the perils of rough and unknown seas, who would leave Asia, or Africa for Italy for Germany, with its wild country, its inclement skies, its sullen manners and aspect, unless indeed it were his home? In their ancient songs, their only way of remembering or recording the past they celebrate an earth-born god Tuisco, and his son Mannus, as the origin of their race, as their founders. To Mannus they assign three sons, from whose names, they say, the coast tribes are called Ingaevones; those of the interior, Herminones; all the rest, Istaevones. Some, with the freedom of conjecture permitted by antiquity, assert that the god had several descendants, and the nation several appellations, as Marsi, Gambrivii, Suevi, Vandilij, and that these are nine old names. The name Germany, on the other hand, they say is modern and newly introduced, from the fact that the tribes which first crossed the Rhine and drove out the Gauls, and are now called Tungrians, were then called Germans. Thus what was the name of a tribe, and not of a race, gradually prevailed, till all called themselves by this self-invented name of Germans, which the conquerors had first employed to inspire terror."

    http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/source/tacitus1.html

    (Similarly the Hellenes came to be called "Greek" by the Romans, "Ionic" by the Persians, from the tribes of their respective first encounters.)

  4. #34
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    Cool Re: AW: Re: Skadi Forum Orientation?

    .
    Quote Originally Posted by Zyklop
    Does anyone know why the the English use terms like "Teutons" for Germans like, for example, in "Teutonic Order"?
    Teutonic may probably be derivated from an old name of the Tir, Tiwass, Tiur cult that has ancient traditions in Tyrol, Southern Germany and what is Austria today.

    Of course Tirol are of the same source.


    I may be wrong, and will not dispute on that. To recite a delicate female french spy from TV...

    " I say this only once..."
    Last edited by Hoarsewhisper; Wednesday, April 5th, 2006 at 08:56 PM.

  5. #35
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    Thumbs Up Re: Skadi Forum Orientation?

    I voted Celto-Germanic because I am.

  6. #36
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    Re: Skadi Forum Orientation?

    Quote Originally Posted by Monkshood
    I voted Celto-Germanic because I am.
    So am I, but I don't see the need to bend the forum around us lot. And it'd be good for the English to get more to grips with the Germanic side of ourselves anyway - it's been woefully neglected for a few decades.

  7. #37
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    Re: Skadi Forum Orientation?

    I agree. I'm picking up a bit of German actually.

  8. #38
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    AW: Skadi Forum Orientation?

    I voted for "Germanic preservation." There´s a quite large majority who thinks "Skadi shouldnt change", and so do I.

    "Judge of your natural character by what you do in your dreams" - Ralph Waldo Emerson

  9. #39
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    Re: Skadi Forum Orientation?

    Germanic preservation includes Anglo-Saxon preservation, so I voted for no change. All the same I intend to start an Anglo-Saxon forum to cater to all the English speaking peoples. This is not intended as competition for Skadi. We need to promote and defend our heritage and another forum can only help in that regard. Oswiu mentioned wanting to overcome the insular attitude of the English. On the contrary, it is my earnest desire that England re-discover it's proud insular nature. My forum will be called www.anglecynn.com. This is an OE word meaning the English people, and by it I mean all the English people around the world, including those in America, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Rhodesia, Kenya and South Africa. All Anglophiles will also be welcome to join. Anglophobes will not.
    Don't let Europe Rule Britannia!

    "If we reunited, then we would be an economic and military powerhouse without peer for centuries to come."-Leofric

  10. #40
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    Re: Skadi Forum Orientation?

    If Skadi is a Germanic forum, then this includes Anglo-Saxons as much as any other German tribes. If modern Anglo-Saxon stumble across Skadi and don't instantly realize it includes them, our question to ourselves is: do we really want this person as a member and what can he or she possibly bring to the discussion if they don't even know their own basic history.

    But, we could translated the Skadi logo and definition of Skadi, the "Gottin der Unabhaenigkeit" into English, Dutch, Swedish, and all the other living Germanic languages. This might make people feel more welcome and restate in an in-your-face way the cultural unity of the Germanics.

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