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Thread: Genetic Status Quo

  1. #1
    Senior Member cosmocreator's Avatar
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    Post Genetic Status Quo

    Perhaps others well-read in genetics can comment on this.


    "Genes that form part of a cell nucleus possess an internal equilibrium as a group, just as do the members of social institutions. Genes in a population are in equilibrium if the population is living a healthy life as a corporate entity. Racial intermixture can upset the genetic as well as the social equilibrium of a group, and so, newly introduced genes tend to disappear or be reduced to a minimum percentage unless they possess a selective advantage over their local counterparts."

    Coon states the above for neither political or social purpose but merely to show that "were it not for the mechanism cited above, men would not be black, white, yellow or brown. We would all be light khaki, for there has been enough gene flow over the clinal regions of the world during the last half million years to homogenize us all had that been the evolutionary scheme of things."

    Hybrids tend to return to one of their parental stocks.

    Each subspecies has a "status quo" that include not only variances in bones and teeth but also skin, hair, lips, ears and also differences seen only with a microscope.


    I've thought for some time now that subspecies, when mixed, will revert back to a parental stock. It may take a thousand years or more but it will occur. This has just been an idea for me and I've had nothing to back it up.

    If it is true, then those ill-willed proponents of race-mixing have no intention of creating a mixed, yet homogenized, utopia but instead want to create genetic and social chaos. I believe here in Canada and the US the result will break the countries apart. And I think that is their intention.

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    Hmm...the term "Genetic Staus Quo" is an oxymoron. There can never be such a thing due to the very nature of genes.

    And no, I don't think that race mixing will result in a return to some kind of a primitive human form. That's because genes are never lost unless those who carry them do not breed.

    So even in a mixed world European genes will survive, though they will certainly be much less noticeable, and we might need some genetic engineering to see a classic Nordic 1000 years from now.

    Nevertheless, Europe will no longer be Europe if it is not inhabited by Europeans. I think if such a thing ever happens, and it may, that would be a great shame.

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    Senior Member cosmocreator's Avatar
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    Wish I knew more about genetics but there seems to be something wrong with what you say. They say we have something like 98% the same genes as the chimp. Where did the different 2% come from? Did it appear out of nowhere? Or did it already exist but was waiting for the right moment to be realized? Or did some genes mutate to create Homo sapiens? If they mutated, which is the only plausible explanation I can currently think of, then some genes are not carried forever. If a mixed race people were to return to one of its parental subspecies, some of its genes would in fact just disappear. I think, as Coon thought, that the subspecies of man has been exchanging genes for the last half million years. Some of these genes just disappear and wouldn't show up in genetic analyses.


    And btw, if you are unregistered, how did you post here?

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    Senior Member cosmocreator's Avatar
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    Ok, I've thought a bit more about this.

    We know the Spanish mixed with the Indians in Latin America. Thus, these Indians must show some genetic correlation to the Spanish -- even if they don't show it physically. If there is a genetic correlation, then we know it takes more than 300 years for genes to disappear. If no correlation is indicated then 300 years is sufficient for genes to disappear.

    Likewise, we know from archaeology and skeletal remains that a Mediterranean people, related to the Palestinians, settled in North and East Africa and mixed to some degree with the Negroes found there. Thus, there should be a genetic correlation between Palestians and the Negroes of North and East Africa. If not, then it takes less than 10,000 years for genes to disappear.

    Also, like I said above, genes must have mutated for Homo sapiens to come into existence. To mutate means to mutate from another state. This mutation gives the appearance of genes disappearing of the former state.

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    Account Inactive Polak's Avatar
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    Well chimps are not our ancestors. We only share a common ancestor with chimps.

    The reason we share 98% instead of 100% with chimps is because we became adapted to different lives.

    The genes that enabled this adaptation came from mutations. The mutations that proved successful stuck around, while the genes that did the same job, but weren't as successful, disappeared through natural selection.

    And this is the only way genes can be lost - if they become redundant and do not fit their enviornment. Those who carry them do not reproduce for one reason or another, and the genes are not passed on.

    There is no way a mixed human population will revert back to a primitive humanoid because of these selective pressures. The genes that made the primitive humans no longer exist, because they were...too primitive. They can't be ressurected out of nothing.

    And there will always be selection for more successful, better genes and mutations, in one way or another. So even if the human species mixes, the biological mechanisms will be the same - the smartest, strongest will keep on going...

    ...IN THEORY...

    The problem here is that it seems that the smartest people no longer breed that much. It's the others who have 8 to 12 kids for one reason or another.

    So the scenario I see for Europe is migrants coming in from the third world and replacing the natives.

    The problem is that the native Europeans are too affluent to breed. And even the mixed Euro/migrant populations will eventually become too affluent to breed as well.

    So even if European genes are in some way more suited to Europe, advances in living conditions, like heating, will prevent natural selection. In effect, I can see European genes disappearing for good from Europe and the rest of the world.

    But maybe I am being too pragmatic?

    In any case, it seems that with the way things are going the human species will stay at about the same point in terms of evolution. Or it may move ahead because maybe there will be some selective pressures in different parts of the world.

    In regards to the European genes in Latin America and Northeast Africa, yes, they are still there. They are especially clearly visible in Ethiopia and thereabouts. It doesn't seem they're going anywhere.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cosmocreator
    Ok, I've thought a bit more about this.

    We know the Spanish mixed with the Indians in Latin America. Thus, these Indians must show some genetic correlation to the Spanish -- even if they don't show it physically. If there is a genetic correlation, then we know it takes more than 300 years for genes to disappear. If no correlation is indicated then 300 years is sufficient for genes to disappear.
    I just thought I'd chime in a little on this point in particular. I just read an article explaining a genetic study performed here in the US. Included in this study was an investigation about the paternal and maternal contributions to the "Hispanic" population in the States.

    In short, the paternal Y-chromosome markers were very much European in origin (Spanish) and the maternal mtDNA markers were very much native/American Indian. So, 300-400 years isn't likley to be enough time for genes (at least non-recombing ones) to be 'swamped'. This is really just the blink of an eye in evolutionary time.

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    Senior Member cosmocreator's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Polak
    So even if European genes are in some way more suited to Europe, advances in living conditions, like heating, will prevent natural selection. In effect, I can see European genes disappearing for good from Europe and the rest of the world.

    I have so much to learn about genetics I shouldn't even talk about it. But I have to question whether the 3rd worlders will be able to live in Europe without us. We have created heating and food production and distribution and other modern things which make it easy for them to survive. I doubt they'll be able to maintain it when we're gone. Already I see western societies falling apart. The medical system is overburdened as is the schooling system. Homelessness is continuing to increase. The number of people with mental problems is increasing.

    The most intelligent are not breeding and the least intelligent are breeding in great numbers.

    I don't think Europeans races will be bred out of existence though. There will be some violent changes coming and we will separate ourselves from them. It will be natural pressures.

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    Hmm...the term "Genetic Staus Quo" is an oxymoron. There can never be such a thing due to the very nature of genes.

    And no, I don't think that race mixing will result in a return to some kind of a primitive human form. That's because genes are never lost unless those who carry them do not breed.

    So even in a mixed world European genes will survive, though they will certainly be much less noticeable, and we might need some genetic engineering to see a classic Nordic 1000 years from now.

    Nevertheless, Europe will no longer be Europe if it is not inhabited by Europeans. I think if such a thing ever happens, and it may, that would be a great shame.
    Combined with his inability to relate race to historical achievement I don't think this Munchkin has ever heard of Mendel, nor has he a grasp of any thing more than pride in an immediate nation that will become stagnant in several billion years when the sun burns out, its a shame most men cannot grasp the idea of building for eternity.

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    Senior Member Stríbog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prospero
    Combined with his inability to relate race to historical achievement I don't think this Munchkin has ever heard of Mendel, nor has he a grasp of any thing more than pride in an immediate nation that will become stagnant in several billion years when the sun burns out, its a shame most men cannot grasp the idea of building for eternity.
    Actually the sun will become a red giant before it collapses, thus incinerating Earth and all its inhabitants...

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