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Thread: What does White mean?

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    Post What does White mean?

    I've seen this word thrown around in reference to people on a number of recent threads, and I'm not really sure what people mean by it. As Jennifer rightly pointed out in another thread:
    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer
    Arguing about a person's "whiteness" is irrelevant since it means different things to different people.
    So what does it mean to folks here on Skadi?

    I think of it as a skin color, although to be perfectly honest, I've only ever met one person in my life whose skin was genuinely white. My overall skin color ranges from a sort of reddish tan on my hands and face to a kind of reddish cream on my torso, legs, and feet (I always wear shirts, long pants, and shoes outdoors). I usually apply it to folks whose skin is this same kind of color, but there's a lot of strange border area that's hard to define.

    I've seen some people use it as though it were freely interchangeable with the term European. I find that odd: I went to Venice once and found that most of the locals were as dark as any Mexican mestizo, and almost all of them were darker than Vicente Fox. All Venetians are European, but in my eyes they were not all white. I found many Spaniards to be similar in that regard when I lived there for a few months.

    Some of the folks here seem to use white as though it were identical to nord-(pick a suffix). But I have a hard time seeing Alpinids as being less white than Nordids — there are a lot of Alpinids who are lighter than I am.

    A lot of folks use Europid/Europoid as a synonym for white. Yet when I go to the glossary at SNPA, I see a picture of a very dark Dravidian scowling at me classified as a Europid. And sure enough, his morphology is not unlike that of many Europeans. But I don't think anybody could rightly call him white.

    Some people like Caucasian or Caucasoid, but if I'm not wholly mistaken, the latter of those is a superset of the terms Europid/Europoid while the former has more or less strict reference to the people who live between the Black and Caspian Seas.

    It would be great if it referred solely and entirely to Germanic people, because we could then use it to distinguish between our own folk and the rest of the world. But it seems to get used pretty freely to refer to Slavs and Celts, and also rather freely to refer to Latins (despite the aforementioned obscurity of Venetians), Hellenes, and even Basques. So we can't use white synonymously with Germanic.

    What in the world does white mean? And if, as I tend to suspect, it has no precise meaning, shouldn't we stop using it? A word that means nothing is kind of pointless, after all. It seems that at least here on Skadi, where we try to keep our conversation on a fairly academic plane, we should kind of give up talking about people being white.

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    Post Re: What does white mean?

    White: Of Germanic or kindred European heritage.


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    Post Re: What does white mean?

    I posted this response in a thread....somewhere .... but I thought it was appropriate here:

    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer
    "White" means "go for it, she's acceptable." "White" means "it's okay to think she's hot." You know, the "WHITE IS RIGHT" mentality. Any woman who is hot must be "white." "White" refers to anything not brown, black, red, or yellow. Like the X-tian song... "Jesus loves the little children, all the children of the world, red and yellow, black and white, they are prescious in his sight. Jesus loves the little children of the world."

    White is white-- don't you know?

    Anyhow, joking aside. White is such an amibiguous term because if we were to go by the standards of the American government, then white = all people of european, middle eastern, and north african descent. The problem is that when the majority of people on these forums use the term, they mean it to refer ONLY to Europeans, and often not even to all Europeans. I have seen it used as specifically to refer ONLY to Germanics, as if no one other than a Germainc is white. These ever changing/ relative definitions are what makes it a vague term when referring to people (i.e. is he/she white? Am I white? Are you white?).

    The other problem is that this term is so widely used and accepted that many people have no clue what you are talking about if you don't use it. Because of this, I think if used in the generic term then it is okay, because you are not trying to make a specific distinction. For example, if we talk about (generically) the number of whites vs. blacks in your community-- then who cares what the specifics are that constitutes "whites" because the term is being used in a generic all encompassing way. Sure, this can cause variation, for example if discussing the percentage of Argentina that is "white." That variation is okay because in all stats a certain amount of variation is present. The problem is when you begin getting specific and using "white" is precise, specific ways (like aforementioned "Is he/she white?"). In specific cases, the variation in what constitutes "white" is too great and pointless to talk about. So, if using it generically to simply describe a large body of people without getting into specifics, then the term is fine.

    I hope I made sense on my views regarding this word. Can you imagine someone on the net asking if you are white (because they have not seen you), and you go into this entire speech about your sub-racial type, etc.? I bet their reaction would be funny. In cases like that-- just say "yes" and spare the details.

    (All "you's" in the above replay are gneralized forms of the word and not referring to any specific individual.)
    "I do not know what horrified me most at that time: the economic misery of my companions, their moral and ethical coarseness, or the low level of their intellectual development." Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf

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    Post Re: What does white mean?

    White means to belong to aboriginal european racial groups of a total complete caucazoid origin. which includes west mediteraneans, scando-nordics, atlanto mediteraneans, faelids, dinarics, UP, west alpines(complete caucazoid origin?) etc... I wouldn't include east or south mediteraneans, east alpines, ladogans(although aboriginal, not caucazoid) and any other strain showing pseudo mongoloid/arabic or negroid influence.

    You can then break down the europeans into north, south and central european. I don't see the point in using east and west references because if an eastern european has no mongoloid influence he should show similarity with his western counterpart of same type.

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    Post Re: What does white mean?

    Only the Irish are white.

    On a more serious note; "Skin coloration in humans is adaptive and labile. Skin pigmentation levels have changed more than once in human evolution. Because of this, skin coloration is of no value in determining phylogenetic relationships among modern human groups."

    http://www.calacademy.org/research/a...skin_evol.html

    Also read the full article on "the evolution of human skin coloration":

    http://www.bgsu.edu/departments/chem...color_2000.pdf
    Last edited by Glenlivet; Wednesday, October 19th, 2005 at 11:34 PM.

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    Post Re: What does white mean?

    Quote Originally Posted by nordic_canadian_male
    White means to belong to aboriginal european racial groups of a total complete caucazoid origin. which includes west mediteraneans, scando-nordics, atlanto mediteraneans, faelids, dinarics, UP, west alpines(complete caucazoid origin?)
    Obviously.

    etc... I wouldn't include east or south mediteraneans, east alpines, ladogans(although aboriginal, not caucazoid) and any other strain showing pseudo mongoloid/arabic or negroid influence.
    You can then break down the europeans into north, south and central european. I don't see the point in using east and west references because if an eastern european has no mongoloid influence he should show similarity with his western counterpart of same type.
    I'm afraid your understanding of evolution is somewhat flawed.

    This is the Ilmen-Dnieper type of Eastern Europe. How common is this type in Western Europe? Moreover, how Mongoloid is it?



    Eastern Europeans are commonly high-skulled. Gorids are a high-skulled variant of West Alpinids. Eastern Cro-Magnids are commonly higher-skulled than their western counterparts. Morphological differences also exist.

    In other words: you're implying that the divergent evolution of Caucasoids in (Western and Estern) Europe in the last 20,000 years accounted for nothing.

    And it's not like Western Europeans could be a benchmark for true-blue "Caucasoidness" either. Last time I checked, they weren't completely devoid of non-Caucasoid influence, even though it's very low (probably less than 1% on the average).
    Last edited by Triglav; Thursday, October 20th, 2005 at 03:07 AM.
    "slavic" languages are absolutely arteficial (Read "slawenlegende"). The "glagolica", invented by a bunch of monks, is nothing but an ancient esperanto, creating new words, definitions and alphabet out of regional slangs.

    The craddle of European Civilization comes from the North. All blond people originate from the north. So if you see a blond-blue eyed Slovene, Russian, Czech, Polak ect., you can be 100% sure that his ancient ancestors originated from "Germanics" (Germanic = Nordic).
    "slovenja" was the settelment of the Langobards = Germanics/Teutons. "Poland" of the Goths and East-Vandals ect. ect. What do "slavs" tell us about their origin?
    Some silly story that they originate from some swamps in the east and popped out of no where into history.

    So you see my dear "Gorostan" [=Triglav], you are in reality a "Germanic" indoctrinated with panslav propaganda and historic fantasy stories. ~Dr. Brandt, former TNP and Skadi member

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    Post Re: What does white mean?

    White is a term which British/West European colonials began to use in the colonies to differ their multitude of European ethnicites from the (often) colored aboriginal populations. That's: "white" as defining factor to differ the colonizing ethnicities from the aboriginal.

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    Post Re: What does white mean?

    Quote Originally Posted by Deling
    White is a term which British/West European colonials began to use in the colonies to differ their multitude of European ethnicites from the (often) colored aboriginal populations. That's: "white" as defining factor to differ the colonizing ethnicities from the aboriginal.
    Yah.

    It's also an everchanging and politicized word.

    For instance,

    If something isn't done about Mestizos and Turks in 50 years they will be considered, "White". "White" just means accepted; Southern Italians are not White (or even light) skinned but if you called them non-White they'd throw a meatball at you.

    "White" is also BS even in the colonial sense (it's origin) because it wasn't "the White man" conquering land, it was different European ethnicities literally battling eachother and using savages as pawns against one another. This is true from America to South Africa, there was never "White Unity" we were just universally despised as "White men" by primitives.

    By calling ourselves "White" we use the terminology of the beasts as the color coded reference denotes the existence of non-Whites.
    Last edited by Cole Nidray; Thursday, October 20th, 2005 at 03:22 AM.

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    Post Re: What does white mean?

    White is a pseudo racial concept based on skin colour and which is absolutly of no use in real life when confronting a big black chocolate man.

    That said, I use "White" for "European", so how's it to be a non-white you Americans? But it's true, I'm a "laxist" racialist; indeed, I accept Spaniards, Italians and Greeks as Europeans...

    Personally, I find "White" to be easier to use than "Europid" in real life. "Europid" is just an unknown word outside. Who's a clue about Anthropology in real life? ... All that "white question" is a web-epiphenomenon. Nothing more. Racial reality, you live it everyday in streets and not in anthropologic books or on the net. Theorize as mush as you want, you don't need a racial classification to find your kins and allies in confrontation. Nature always gets over concepts.
    Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscripti catapultas habebunt.

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    -But why neo? »

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    Post Re: What does white mean?

    This is such a good thread. It is a prime example of how ambiguous the term "white" is! White is only Germanic, White is only Irish, White is only European, White is....blah blah blah.

    Why don't we just admit it-- NO ONE IS WHITE! We are all various shades of taupe, peach, ivory, beige, pink, ecru, etc. Try it sometime, say "I'm not white, I'm ecru." Who wants to be ecru with me?

    http://www.shuttershop.co.uk/images/...s/015_ecru.jpg

    http://www.paperaddict.com/Merchant2...00001/bv26.jpg
    "I do not know what horrified me most at that time: the economic misery of my companions, their moral and ethical coarseness, or the low level of their intellectual development." Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf

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