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Thread: Padre Pio: Words of Wisdom

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    Senior Member Phlegethon's Avatar
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    Post Padre Pio: Words of Wisdom


    "Where there is no obedience, there is no virtue; where there is no virtue, there is no good. Where good is wanting, there is no love; where there is no love, God is absent; where God is absent, there is no heaven."

    - Padre Pio
    Last edited by Phlegethon; Friday, August 22nd, 2003 at 09:53 PM.
    And all my youth passed by sad-hearted,
    the joy of Spring was never mine;
    Autumn blows through me dread of parting,
    and my heart dreams and longs to die.

    - Nikolaus Lenau (1802-1850)

    Real misanthropes are not found in solitude, but in the world; since it is experience of life, and not philosophy, which produces real hatred of mankind.

    - Giacomo Leopardi (1798-1837)

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    From what I have heard of him, he seemed a good man.
    He's not been canonised yet, only beatified is that right?

    The Jews are enemies of God and foes of our holy religion. ~ Padre Pio

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    He had stigmata didn't he? or was that another man, i really think it was him... In fairness he certainly seems to be an interesting character from what little i've read of him.

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    Senior Member Phlegethon's Avatar
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    This is Therese Neumann, a German visionary who also was stigmatized:






    Therese Neumann's stigmatisation started on March 4, 1926, first with a wound near her heart. In the following Friday-sufferings during Lent 1926, not only the range of her vision enlarged, but with each suffering more bleeding Stigmata appeared. Pastor Joseph Naber from Konnersreuth reported about Therese's condition on Good Friday 1926: " When I, together with another Priest, visited her [Therese] on Good Friday after lunch, [we] found her lying in great torture, the eyes clogged with blood, two streamlets of blood running down her cheeks, pale like a dying person. Until 3 o'clock, the Hour of Death of the Saviour, she struggled in terrible agony of death. ... During this death agony on Good Friday, she had viewed all the sufferings of the Saviour, beginning on the Mount of Olives down to Calvary, and had shared it in a very intense way, even his abandonment on the Cross. At that time, she had felt severe pain on the upper side of her hands and feet. Now, both hands and feet show kind of round, open wounds, out of them runs pure blood. Already several weeks before Easter, suddenly a longish wound broke open in the area of her heart. At times, a lot of pure blood came out of this wound. The Medical Doctor had scrutinized all these wounds" (Gerlich, p. 114, Waldsassener Grenzzeitung, April 21, 1926).

    Following Good Friday in 1926, the five wounds remained open for the next 14 days. They were always wet, but the amount of bleeding varied. Her parents thought, that these suddenly new developed wounds had to be cured, and tried to achieve some improvement with household remedies. Since these did not show any result, they called the physician, Dr. Seidl, from Waldsassen. The form of the wounds surprised Dr. Seidl, especially the extend of the wound of the side, 3,5 cm long and 1 cm wide [1.38 x O.4 inch]. He prescribed an ointment. The treatment caused a severe swelling of the wounds of her hands, feet and side. Therese was seized by an almost unbearable pain, she hardly could endure it. Because of this, the parents finally removed the bandages with the ointment and as a result, the pain subsided rapidly and, eventually, disappeared. Dr. Seidl was astonished about the peculiarity of the wounds, which - as long as they were left alone - neither got infected nor purulent. "Henceforth, he refrained from all treatment, but wrapped the wounds with a bandage only" (Gerlich, p.107). Following this advice, Therese always was wearing a head-scarf and gloves with cut-off fingers to protect the scaps of the wounds of her hands. Never again occurred an infection or festering of the wounds.

    The Stigmata never healed. For the rest of her life the wounds were clearly visible in the palm and on the back of her hands, and on the sole and the upper side (instep) of her feet. Until her death in 1962, the painful bleeding of the Stigmata connected with the Friday-sufferings occurred 780 times, whereas the wounds of scourging and her head wounds started to bleed during the time of Passion only.

    Bishop Buchberger of Regensburg had asked Therese to stay home on Fridays, so visitors could witness her sufferings and be strengthened in their faith. Thousands of visitors witnessed her sufferings. In addition, movies confirm the visions and the bleeding Stigmata.

    Several attempts were made to explain the Stigmata and the visions scientifically. Some tried to find the cause in an overexcited imagination or in a hypnosis, or declared the phenomenon to be a result of autosuggestion and hysteria. Confronted by someone with such a theory, Therese answered quite sternly: "Imagine, you would be an ox, would you grow horns as a result?" (Gerlich, p.323). Several Medical Doctors and Psychologists confirmed, that Therese showed no kind of any symptoms of mental abnormality (Klosa, p.70ff, p.129ff).

    At first, Therese felt very uneasy about these Stigmata, in her dialect she said: "I knew nothing about Stigmata and was hoping, all this would disappear" (Gerlich, p.106). Later, after she was certain that these Stigmata were supernatural and not curable, she accepted the physical pain and - in view of mockings - the mental pain also as an sacrificial suffering.
    And all my youth passed by sad-hearted,
    the joy of Spring was never mine;
    Autumn blows through me dread of parting,
    and my heart dreams and longs to die.

    - Nikolaus Lenau (1802-1850)

    Real misanthropes are not found in solitude, but in the world; since it is experience of life, and not philosophy, which produces real hatred of mankind.

    - Giacomo Leopardi (1798-1837)

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    that is fascinating, i dont know where i stand on stigmata but it really is interesting to read about..

    Milesian, as a good upstanding Catholic do you believe in the stigmata as it affects people like the above? Are all Catholics really expected to?

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    Senior Member Phlegethon's Avatar
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    You did not ask me, but my maternal grandmother's grandmother - of old pious Westphalian stock - was stigmatized, too. She bore similar marks every Good Friday for a few cnsecutive years, then they vanished. There are several medical theories for it, like self-induced hysteria or something like that, but she was not a zealot. Nor did she have any visions that could be used as propaganda. It is certainly a mystery we will never fully be able to explain - or understand.
    And all my youth passed by sad-hearted,
    the joy of Spring was never mine;
    Autumn blows through me dread of parting,
    and my heart dreams and longs to die.

    - Nikolaus Lenau (1802-1850)

    Real misanthropes are not found in solitude, but in the world; since it is experience of life, and not philosophy, which produces real hatred of mankind.

    - Giacomo Leopardi (1798-1837)

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    Good upstanding Catholic.....yes, but with a chequred past lol!

    I believe that in some cases , Stigmata is real.
    I recently watched a program about possessions and saw wounds actually open up on a woman in front of my eyes.
    The Sceptic offered many explanations but glaringly ignored the whole issue of the stigmata which was difficult to refute.
    If it was a trick then it was some special effect!

    In general, Catholics are not bound to believe in these events.
    Nothing is binding on the conscience of a Catholic unless it is de fide or has been proclaimed as dogma.

    However, in cases where the stigmataic has become a saint, then it's probably expected of the Catholic to believe although I don't think it is absolutely binding.

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    Phlegethon - that is very interesting!
    Do you know what your great, great grandmother's personal opinion of it was?

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    Senior Member Phlegethon's Avatar
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    I was told that she felt extremely uncomfortable and tried to keep it secret, probably because she thought there was something wrong with her and feared sensationalism. She confided it to her priest but unlike the Therese Neumann case he kept it confidential. And after a few years the stigmata disappeared. This was back in the 1870s, so there were no pictures taken and fortunately there was neither radio nor television in those days.
    And all my youth passed by sad-hearted,
    the joy of Spring was never mine;
    Autumn blows through me dread of parting,
    and my heart dreams and longs to die.

    - Nikolaus Lenau (1802-1850)

    Real misanthropes are not found in solitude, but in the world; since it is experience of life, and not philosophy, which produces real hatred of mankind.

    - Giacomo Leopardi (1798-1837)

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    From a Catholic perspective, it seems to me that stigmata is akin to possesion in that it's often a way for God to increase faith and awareness in not only the afflcted but also the person witnessing these events. Many saints suffered from stigmata as well.
    Your ancestor was in some good company!

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