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Thread: How Germanic Are the Netherlands?

  1. #21
    Senior Member The Black Prince's Avatar
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    Re: Are the Netherlands Germanic? [split]

    Quote Originally Posted by Somerled
    Would you consider this a typical constellation for the subracial composition of the Netherlands? And would you consider this a typically Germanic constellation? I’d appreciate your input - thanks!
    Made a little research done, I once started.

    My neighbourhood: 35 males, 24 females, all are ranging in age between 21 and 70.

    a hundred times this number would be better, but this is the best I can do.

    It contains 21 families: 17 are farmer, 4 not.

    Males

    skincolor of all is pale/pinkish.

    Haircolor

    Redblond = 6%
    Red = 6%
    Redbrown = 6%

    Lightblond = 11%
    Blond = 17 %

    D.blond/L.brown = 12 %
    Brown = 31 %
    Darkbrown = 6 %

    Black = 6 %

    Eyecolor

    Blue = 66 %
    Grey = 0 %
    Green = 20 %
    Brown = 14 %

    Length

    Older(est. 40+) are treated to be 5 cm shorter as the younger.

    -- small < 180cm - medium - 190cm < tall --

    Small = 6 %
    Medium = 71 %
    Tall = 23 %

    Females

    skincolor of all is pale/pinkish.

    Haircolor

    Redblond = 4 %
    Red = 4 %
    Redbrown = 8 %

    Lightblond = 17 %
    Blond = 29 %

    D.blond/L.brown = 12 %
    Brown = 17 %
    Darkbrown = 13 %

    Black = 4 %

    Eyecolor

    Blue = 71 %
    Grey = 4 %
    Green = 13 %
    Brown = 13 %

    Length

    Older(est. 40+) are treated to be 5 cm shorter as the youngers avgerage.

    -- small < 170cm. - medium - 180cm. < tall --

    Small = 0%
    Medium = 96 %
    Tall = 4 %

    Overall appearance

    Mixed qua eye color and haircolor, e.g. blond with dark eyes, darkbrown with lightblue eyes, others do have blue eyes with blonde hair, ..etc.

    Mostly blended Nordid + UP(Faelid/Borreby), about the half shows some atlantid admixture as well.

    Only one male and one female was black haired and brown eyed at the same time.
    This man btw. is also the largest (over the 2 mtrs.)

  2. #22
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    Re: Are the Netherlands Germanic? [split]

    Thanks for joining this thread, Siegfried. The next best thing to genetic studies is the input of people familiar with local conditions/circumstances If I may ask, how exactly is Zeeland different from Noord Holland? Do you agree that Dutch males from Noord Holland seem more Nordid than Dutch females? If so, why do you think this might be the case? Thanks!

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    Re: Are the Netherlands Germanic? [split]

    I just saw your post, Somerled. What an effort ... I really appreciate it. Thanks so much!

    Regards

  4. #24
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    Re: Are the Netherlands Germanic? [split]

    Quote Originally Posted by WestPrussian
    If I may ask, how exactly is Zeeland different from Noord Holland?
    Zeeland is darker and more brachycephalic than the rest of the Netherlands.

    Do you agree that Dutch males from Noord Holland seem more Nordid than Dutch females? If so, why do you think this might be the case?
    I never noticed anything like this, but then again, I rarely visit Noord Holland.

    Attached is a map of the Netherlands, showing the provinces, for those who are interested in this discussion but have no clue as to what and where Zeeland and Noord Holland are
    Attached Images Attached Images  

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    Re: Are the Netherlands Germanic? [split]

    Somerled, I have a few more questions. You stated that Frisian townies may mostly be descendents of people from Randstad ... do you still adhere to this opinion? Or would you now say that Frisians are Frisians, no matter whether they are from the town or countryside In any case, please do not let Austrians corrupt your judgment

    Regards

  6. #26
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    Re: Are the Netherlands Germanic? [split]

    Somerled, I have a few more questions. You stated that Frisian townies may mostly be descendents of people from Randstad ... do you still adhere to this opinion? Or would you now say that Frisians are Frisians, no matter whether they are from the town or countryside In any case, please do not let Austrians corrupt your judgment

    Regards

  7. #27
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    Re: Are the Netherlands Germanic? [split]

    Quote Originally Posted by Siegfried
    I think of Germanic as an ethnic designation and Nordid as a phenotypical one. It is true that the early Germanic tribes were highly Nordid - probably more so than the current Germanic nations, I think.
    I think the old germanics were mainly Nordids and blended Nordid/UP in phenotype.

    Like Thiuda last said: ''It was the red hair Tacitus spoke about" (Faelid?)

    Quote Originally Posted by Siegfried
    Not every Nordid is Germanic though, and not every Germanic person is Nordid.
    I agree, especially when you look at the genetical distances between all the Dutch (or NW-Europeans), although much varying in phenotype.

    Quote Originally Posted by Siegfried
    Not exactly typical, but it's not uncommon either. It also depends on where you are a bit; Zeeland is quite different from Noord-Holland, and both these regions differ from Friesland. We're a small nation, but there is a bit of regional variation. I think the "Keltic" Nordid type is more common than the actual Norid though.
    Never seen Norid here . But you can't compare the large cities as Amsterdam with the countryside of the provinces.
    Most of the nowadays Dutch cities, used to function as seaports throughout the ages (some still nowadays) therefore also attracting immigrants/ foreign sailors/..etc. It must have changed the common phenotypes somewhat.

    Thats btw. my general idea: The northern provinces are the most Nordid/UP in type, while globally to the south getting more atlantid/slight alpinid mixed.

    Because a lot of people nowadays move all the time. This transition will become less and less noticeable.*

    * = this will be true probably for most modern western countries.

  8. #28
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    Re: Are the Netherlands Germanic? [split]

    Somerled,

    you have been making a distinction between people from random Frisian towns [supposedly with Randstad ancestry] and true Frisians such as yourself. I really find this very interesting, especially in light of the supposed connection between the Frisians and the English as reported by Weale et al. Would you care to expand? Thanks!

  9. #29
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    Re: Are the Netherlands Germanic? [split]

    Quote Originally Posted by WestPrussian
    Somerled, I have a few more questions. You stated that Frisian townies may mostly be descendents of people from Randstad ... do you still adhere to this opinion? Or would you now say that Frisians are Frisians, no matter whether they are from the town or countryside In any case, please do not let Austrians corrupt your judgment

    Regards

    One who lives in Friesland, is Frisian of course (for the government ),

    And about all townies being Dutch descended, no.
    Probably a quarter would be full Frisian (father and mother)
    the half partially (father or mother is Frisian) and another quarter would be Dutch.

    The villages still contain the most Frisians that still speak Frisian on the streets.
    Although indeed more and more 'import'(non-Frisians) decides to live here.

    Wich I can't blame them since its a beautifull province

    If you see this thread: http://forums.skadi.net/showthread.php?t=45439

    Here is stated that in 1994: 54 % had Frisian as first language.

    On one exception (she was really interessted in languages) most people I know of partially Frisian descendancy don't speak Frisian at home but Dutch.

    So, you could say that about 50% of nowadays (2006) Frisians are for the most Frisian. the rest is partially or not.

    Hope this answers your question

  10. #30
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    Re: Are the Netherlands Germanic? [split]

    Do keep in mind however that the large 'import' is mostly of the last 50 yrs. and than the most the last 25 yrs. or so

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