Results 1 to 7 of 7

Thread: Atman and Anatman in the Indic Traditions

  1. #1
    Senior Member
    Imperator X's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Last Online
    Saturday, April 4th, 2009 @ 01:47 AM
    Ethnicity
    Celto-Germanic
    Subrace
    Nordid/Atlantid.
    Country
    United States United States
    State
    Massachusetts Massachusetts
    Location
    Boston
    Gender
    Age
    35
    Family
    Single, looking
    Occupation
    Looking
    Politics
    Constitutionalist
    Religion
    Hindu - Shakta
    Posts
    792
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    7
    Thanked in
    7 Posts

    Lightbulb Atman and Anatman in the Indic Traditions

    I'd say the main point where the Hindu and Buddhist traditions diverge is on the concept of the atman, the self or soul. (translated from the Sanskrit as "body" but does not refer solely to the physical body, as the physical body is subject to death and decay whereas the atman is immortal and all-pervading.) In Hinduism, the atman resides in everything from natural elements to the senses, and is contained in the real and veiled even in the unreal. The atman is all there is and all else is maya, or illusion.

    In Buddhism everything is maya including the atman as Buddhism puts forth the concept of anatman or "not-self/soul". I was once asked by a friend what is the ultimate difference between Hinduism and Buddhism. My reply was that "Hinduism believes that all is essentially one whereas Buddhism believes that all is essentially none." This sounded funny at the time and generated much laughter. I am inclined to believe Hinduism's stance on the atman. You can split the atom a million times, yet you just get down to more sub-atomic particles ad infinitum.There is no such thing as nothing.
    SVMDEVSSVMCAESARSVMCAELVMETINFERNVM

  2. #2
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Last Online
    Friday, April 3rd, 2009 @ 09:10 PM
    Status
    Available
    Ethnicity
    Norwegian
    Ancestry
    Maternal: Norway, Paternal: Massachusetts
    Subrace
    I don't know Lundman's taxonomy.
    Country
    United States United States
    State
    Connecticut Connecticut
    Location
    South Glastonbury, Connecticut
    Gender
    Age
    90
    Family
    Single, not looking
    Occupation
    Nothing (retired)
    Politics
    monarchist
    Religion
    agnostic
    Posts
    1,698
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    25
    Thanked in
    25 Posts

    Post Re: Atman and Anatman in the Indic traditions.

    In the advaita vedanta, the atman is identical with Brahman, the reality which underlies all appearance. Brahman (or the atman) is the only real persistent entity. In Buddhist anatman, there is NO persistent entity. However, though anatman is a fundamental principle of Buddhism, so is reincarnation. Unless there be a persistent entity, what is there to reincarnate ? I asked this question of a Buddhist once and was told that it is the vital energy which is reincarnated. Then I asked him "This vital energy, is it individualized ?" When he said that it is, I asked him "How , then, does it differ from the atman ?" "Oh, they are not at all alike. They are entirely different." was his reply. I never could get any explanation of how they differ. It seens to me that anatman and reincarnation are completely incompatible.

  3. #3
    Account Inactive

    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Last Online
    Sunday, January 24th, 2010 @ 10:00 PM
    Subrace
    Other
    Gender
    Politics
    Spenglarian
    Posts
    334
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    2
    Thanked in
    2 Posts

    Post Re: Atman and Anatman in the Indic traditions.

    Buddhism and Vedanta are best described by Oswald Spengler. Their differences can be understood thus by reading what he says.

  4. #4
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Last Online
    Tuesday, March 13th, 2018 @ 09:14 AM
    Status
    Prolonged Absence
    Ethnicity
    Dutch
    Gender
    Posts
    2,668
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    16
    Thanked in
    15 Posts

    Post Re: Atman and Anatman in the Indic traditions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rahul
    Buddhism and Vedanta are best described by Oswald Spengler. Their differences can be understood thus by reading what he says.
    Are you referring to passages from The Decline of the West or has he treated them in some of his other works as well? I'm interested in both Vedanta and Buddhism.

  5. #5
    Account Inactive

    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Last Online
    Sunday, January 24th, 2010 @ 10:00 PM
    Subrace
    Other
    Gender
    Politics
    Spenglarian
    Posts
    334
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    2
    Thanked in
    2 Posts

    Post Re: Atman and Anatman in the Indic traditions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Siegfried
    Are you referring to passages from The Decline of the West or has he treated them in some of his other works as well? I'm interested in both Vedanta and Buddhism.
    Well, I refer to both-The Decline of the West & The Hour of Decision. His chapter on Stoicism and Buddhism, where he also explained the interregnum in the Indian Culture, which has stopped moving towards growth, in truth it is suffering neither decay nor any growth, but a mere interregnum, it has no life-feeling in the present, it is frozen.

    There is another quote which comes off as a word to word translation of the Geeta. It is from the hour of decision. We have discussed it before, I reckon.

    There is a Nordic world-feeling, reaching from England to Japan, which is full of joy just because of the burden of human destiny. One challenges it for the sake of conquering it, and one goes under proudly should it prove stronger than one's own will. This was the attribute depicted in the old, genuine parts of the Mahabharata which tell of the fight between the Kurus and Pandus; in Homer, Pindar, and Aeschylus; in the Germanic sagas and in Shakespeare; in certain songs of the Chinese Shu king, and in the world of the Samurai. It is the tragic view of life, which is not yet dead, but will blossom anew in the future just as it blossomed in the World War. All the very great poets of the Nordic Cultures have been tragedians, and tragedy, from ballad and epic onward, has been the deepest form of this brave pessimism. The man who is incapable of experiencing or enduring tragedy can never be a figure of world significance. He cannot make history unless he experiences it as it really is - tragic, permeated by destiny, and in consequence meaningless, aimless, and unmoral in the eyes of the worshippers of utility. It marks the parting of the ways between the superior and subordinate ethos of human existence. The individual's life is of importance to none besides himself: the point is whether he wishes to escape from history or give his life for it. History recks nothing of human logic. Thunderstorms, earthquakes, lava-streams: these are near relatives of the purposeless, elemental events of world history. Nations may go under, ancient cities of ageing Cultures burn or sink in ruins, but the earth will continue to revolve calmly round the sun, and the stars to run their courses.
    This is the Islamic view, also appreciated by Allama Mohammad Iqbal. This also reverberates in the ruin of the Sadozai & other Pakhtoons. This also occurs in the individualistic code of Pakhtoonwali.

    Thus the next stage for Europe, to grow in honesty and complete independence from its jewish magian christian/neo-liberal enslavement, will be such a religion of Islam. Europeans have reduced the idea of heathenism more or less into a form of obscene and depraved shallow charade while its christianity is shallow, corrupt and deceptive.

  6. #6
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Last Online
    Tuesday, December 6th, 2016 @ 06:12 PM
    Ethnicity
    Flemish
    Subrace
    Europid
    Country
    Canada Canada
    Gender
    Posts
    287
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    0
    Thanked in
    0 Posts

    Post Re: Atman and Anatman in the Indic traditions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Imperator X
    You can split the atom a million times, yet you just get down to more sub-atomic particles ad infinitum.There is no such thing as nothing.
    The theoretical possibility of splitting matter ad infinitum was held by Aritoteles, while Democrites believed there were basic, or fundamental, particles - he called them atoms - that would not split in smaller parts, and that reality was made of these particles plus the void between them.

    The smallest particles known today are called Quarks (the Jew Gell-Mann named them, after a novel by James Joyce, thus departing with the custom to give names derived from the Greek). Perhaps it will be learnt in the future that these can be split too.

    However, theory seems to depart from Aristoteles' view, insofar as energy, related to mass, exists in the form of discrete quanta, as known since Planck.

  7. #7
    Account Inactive

    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Last Online
    Sunday, January 24th, 2010 @ 10:00 PM
    Subrace
    Other
    Gender
    Politics
    Spenglarian
    Posts
    334
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    2
    Thanked in
    2 Posts

    Post Re: Atman and Anatman in the Indic traditions.

    On second thoughts, my posts on Islam as a viable religion, read completely imbeccile.

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 20
    Last Post: Thursday, November 30th, 2006, 11:41 PM
  2. A Nordic-Indic hybrid ?
    By Amar421 in forum Nordid
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: Monday, April 19th, 2004, 10:57 PM
  3. An Example of an Indic-Nordic Mix
    By desibaba in forum Anthropological Taxonomy
    Replies: 60
    Last Post: Wednesday, October 29th, 2003, 10:10 AM
  4. Descriptions of the Indic People?
    By ScotchTape in forum Physical Anthropology
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: Sunday, August 24th, 2003, 10:21 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •