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Thread: The Darkest "White" Europeans

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    Post The Darkest "White" Europeans

    According to Coon in his book, The Races of Europe, he claims that his research indicate that the Swedes are proportionally the blondest Europeans, the Irish are the bluest eyed, and the English are the fairest skinned. If that is true, and it does seem reasonable to me, then that begs the question: What nation, or region within a nation, or ethnic group of "White" Europeans are the darkest haired, the darkest eyed, and the darkest skinned?

    I'll take a few guesses. For darkest haired, believe it or not, I might say either the Welsh or possibly even the Irish. It's been my observation that Celtic peoples from the British Isles have a shade of dark brown hair (almost black) that is a few degrees darker than even most Meds. For eyes, I wopuld probably say Andalusian Spaniards, or Calabrian Italians. Although, mind you, some Eastern European peoples can be very dark eyed too. Not all the Slavs of course, but the Magyar element in Hungary, or the Italic influenced Romanians might be a good guess for darkest eyed peoples too. For skin complexion, I'd have to nominate the same groups as I did for dark eyes; however, I'd also submit many of the Slavs into this category too. Yes it's true that while many of the Slavs are lighter haired Neo-Danubians, I have noticed that Poles, Russians and Ukranians can also have very dark sallow complexion as well. They seem to soak up the sun better than the true Nordics of Norh-Western Europe. Many Slavs when living in a sunny climate seem to have very dark, brown, leathery skin--including the really blond examples. Then again the wet, rainy, maritime climate of North Western Europe prevents most Nordics from developing thick dark skin, the more continental climate of Eastern and Central Europe seems to encourage a thickening and darkening of the skin. I have even noticed that many German blonds (Nordic or partially Nordicised) tan quire well in the sun. It seems the further east, and of course, the further south one goes in Europe the darker the skin tone becomes, no matter what colour the hair or eyes.

    Any thoughts on this topic?

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    Post Re: The Darkest "White" Europeans

    It is not a bad impression you have. It is quite possible that a temperate-continental climate to favor the development of some skin components which give a special reaction to sun exposure, known as tanning.

    Still, everything is relative.

    This reminds me of a few years old situation, when I met a Romanian girl and before we were introduced, I was quite sure she was British, taking into account her skin colour, her face form and her hair colour.

    In the same time, if one takes Sean Connery and exposes him to sun, one would get a good Middle Eastern-like character example.

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    Post Re: The Darkest "White" Europeans

    Quote Originally Posted by Marius
    It is not a bad impression you have. It is quite possible that a temperate-continental climate to favor the development of some skin components which give a special reaction to sun exposure, known as tanning.

    Still, everything is relative.

    This reminds me of a few years old situation, when I met a Romanian girl and before we were introduced, I was quite sure she was British, taking into account her skin colour, her face form and her hair colour.

    In the same time, if one takes Sean Connery and exposes him to sun, one would get a good Middle Eastern-like character example.
    Yes, i agree with you on a ganeral line: all is relative. Although, we can say in more pragmatically sense, i'd say surely south-med.

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    Post Re: The Darkest "White" Europeans

    Quote Originally Posted by Northern Tiger
    Yes, i agree with you on a ganeral line: all is relative. Although, we can say in more pragmatically sense, i'd say surely south-med.
    Of course.

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    Post Re: The Darkest "White" Europeans

    "This reminds me of a few years old situation, when I met a Romanian girl and before we were introduced, I was quite sure she was British, taking into account her skin colour, her face form and her hair colour.

    In the same time, if one takes Sean Connery and exposes him to sun, one would get a good Middle Eastern-like character example."

    Yes, but let us not forget that British and English are two different animals here. Sean Connery is a Scot of Irish-Catholic ancestry. I'm sure you'll agree that the Celts (?) of the British Isles are really the only population of Northern Europe that is predominantly dark haired (and complected...but not dark eyed). Even so, I would say there is a limit as to just how dark even these people can tan with exposure to the sun. I agree with Marius that extremes in temperatures from one season to the next as one sees in the continental climates of Eastern and Central Europe are just as conduscive to skin darkening (thickening) than being in a sunkissed climate like the Med. Obviously these sunnier, warmer climates produce a sun tan, but it is the harsh extremes of a continental climate that makes one's skin adaptable to sun exposure, and thus capable of tanning just as dark with sun exposure as a swarthy Spaniard or Italian. When I was living in the USA I remember seeing an awful lot of Polish-Americans who could tan as dark as Italian-Americans in the summertime, even though many of the Poles had light brown hair and greenish, hazel eyes. In the winter the Poles would be much fairer in complexion, and not be dark like the Italians, but in summer they could supass them in colour. This was especially true of guys who worked outside, or girls who had the summers off and loved the beach.

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    Post Re: The Darkest "White" Europeans

    Quote Originally Posted by Ted
    According to Coon in his book, The Races of Europe, he claims that his research indicate that the Swedes are proportionally the blondest Europeans, the Irish are the bluest eyed, and the English are the fairest skinned. If that is true, and it does seem reasonable to me, then that begs the question: What nation, or region within a nation, or ethnic group of "White" Europeans are the darkest haired, the darkest eyed, and the darkest skinned?

    I'll take a few guesses. For darkest haired, believe it or not, I might say either the Welsh or possibly even the Irish. It's been my observation that Celtic peoples from the British Isles have a shade of dark brown hair (almost black) that is a few degrees darker than even most Meds. For eyes, I wopuld probably say Andalusian Spaniards, or Calabrian Italians. Although, mind you, some Eastern European peoples can be very dark eyed too. Not all the Slavs of course, but the Magyar element in Hungary, or the Italic influenced Romanians might be a good guess for darkest eyed peoples too. For skin complexion, I'd have to nominate the same groups as I did for dark eyes; however, I'd also submit many of the Slavs into this category too. Yes it's true that while many of the Slavs are lighter haired Neo-Danubians, I have noticed that Poles, Russians and Ukranians can also have very dark sallow complexion as well. They seem to soak up the sun better than the true Nordics of Norh-Western Europe. Many Slavs when living in a sunny climate seem to have very dark, brown, leathery skin--including the really blond examples. Then again the wet, rainy, maritime climate of North Western Europe prevents most Nordics from developing thick dark skin, the more continental climate of Eastern and Central Europe seems to encourage a thickening and darkening of the skin. I have even noticed that many German blonds (Nordic or partially Nordicised) tan quire well in the sun. It seems the further east, and of course, the further south one goes in Europe the darker the skin tone becomes, no matter what colour the hair or eyes.

    Any thoughts on this topic?
    Ted's Patented Absolutely Worthless Generalizing ®

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    Post Re: The Darkest "White" Europeans

    Quote Originally Posted by Ted
    Yes, but let us not forget that British and English are two different animals here. Sean Connery is a Scot of Irish-Catholic ancestry. I'm sure you'll agree that the Celts (?) of the British Isles are really the only population of Northern Europe that is predominantly dark haired (and complected...but not dark eyed). Even so, I would say there is a limit as to just how dark even these people can tan with exposure to the sun. I agree with Marius that extremes in temperatures from one season to the next as one sees in the continental climates of Eastern and Central Europe are just as conduscive to skin darkening (thickening) than being in a sunkissed climate like the Med. Obviously these sunnier, warmer climates produce a sun tan, but it is the harsh extremes of a continental climate that makes one's skin adaptable to sun exposure, and thus capable of tanning just as dark with sun exposure as a swarthy Spaniard or Italian. When I was living in the USA I remember seeing an awful lot of Polish-Americans who could tan as dark as Italian-Americans in the summertime, even though many of the Poles had light brown hair and greenish, hazel eyes. In the winter the Poles would be much fairer in complexion, and not be dark like the Italians, but in summer they could supass them in colour. This was especially true of guys who worked outside, or girls who had the summers off and loved the beach.
    1. Celtic populations in Britain are indeed different from the Anglo-Saxon ones. I mean by Celtic populations: Irish, Scots and Welsh. Perhaps there are others too, but I think these are the main groups.

    2. I am not sure whether the tanning is related to the thickness of the skin, but rather on the change of the composition of the skin in terms of proteins. In the same time this change could generate skin thickening. This remains to be clarified by a Biologist. I am really not able to provide more over this issue.

    3. It is sure that climate harshness, if I may say so, implies an adaptation of the human skin. But in this case, I would ask a simple question: the difference among the human races is only based on climate differences? Coming back to the subrace discussion, I'd take an example, myself as an Eastern European. I really tan hard, after one or two "red-burnings". And I am not a Nordid, neither even blond. And I know quite of a few in my situation.

    So, is tanning ability climate related or not? Interesting comments based on biological scientifical research would be appreciated.
    Last edited by Marius; Sunday, February 20th, 2005 at 12:08 AM.

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    Post Re: The Darkest "White" Europeans

    When I was living in the USA I remember seeing an awful lot of Polish-Americans who could tan as dark as Italian-Americans in the summertime, even though many of the Poles had light brown hair and greenish, hazel eyes. In the winter the Poles would be much fairer in complexion, and not be dark like the Italians, but in summer they could supass them in colour. This was especially true of guys who worked outside, or girls who had the summers off and loved the beach.



    Only extreme southern italians, of course

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    Post Re: The Darkest "White" Europeans

    According to Coon in his book, The Races of Europe, he claims that his research indicate that the Swedes are proportionally the blondest Europeans, the Irish are the bluest eyed, and the English are the fairest skinned.
    as far as I remember from my travels through the british isles, the Irish seemed to me fairer than the English.

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