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Thread: Do Europeans Have Claim to North America?

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    Senior Member Fraxinus Excelsior's Avatar
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    Post Re: Do Europeans have claim to North America?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rachel
    I think it's important to remember that Europeans just as well as the nomadic Mongoloid tribes, are both immigrants to North America; whether you came across on a ship or by a strait.

    The cold hard fact is that Europeans, dominantly English, French & Spaniard, fought the Mongoloid's and settled this land to create lebensraum for their families and future generations. Fair and square! And I think it's fair to say that they would have done the same if the situation had been reversed, although I'm sure we wouldn't have any European minority special interest groups

    Wasn’t it Darwin that said, “The strong survive and the weak perish.”
    :handclap

    'Nuff said.

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    Post Re: Do Europeans have claim to North America?

    It should probably be added to the discussion in this thread that large portions of North America were ceded by the Natives to the European-settlers by treaty (probably more in Canada than in the US), so the process was not purely one of conquest by force. Sometimes Natives voluntarily gave up their rights to very large tracts of land (the size of France of larger) in exchange for specific financial or other rights. Some of these rights have proved useless (e.g. a $5 a month payment for every member of the tribe means nothing in today's debased currency), but others can be quite valuable. Near to where I live, for instance, there is a Native reservation that does a very lucrative business in gasoline and retail sales because, due to applicable treaties, no business on the reservation is subject to sales, gasoline or other taxes that would be applicable off-reserve.

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    Post Re: Do Europeans have claim to North America?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rodskarl Dubhgall
    Gesta Bellica:
    ...I tended to hate Roman culture so much I put it out of my mind.
    Here's a challenge: try and explain what you think "Roman culture" is, but without using the Roman alphabet.

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    Post Re: Do Europeans have claim to North America?

    Quote Originally Posted by SudVolk
    Here's a challenge: try and explain what you think "Roman culture" is, but without using the Roman alphabet.
    I hate the fact that illiteracy in the Roman alphabet will get people shunned and taken as retarded. I have sloppy handwriting. When I saw the runes, ogham; and that stuff that Tolkien was working on, that was Finnish?, I liked it.

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    Thumbs Up Re: Do Europeans have claim to North America?



    Viva La France!!!!!!

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    Post Re: Do Europeans have claim to North America?

    Quote Originally Posted by Artois' Redneck
    And the descendants of invaders, mostly blacks I presume, with northern africans, etc. will justify their right to own the land exactly as some of you do for northern america. "we were the most numerous, the strongest, or the cleverest, anyway doesn't matter, it's ours now".

    But in this possible future, I dare to say that the descendants of true former Europeans would have the right to stand up and fight to free the land of their ancestors, and claim it back.
    For never, even after centuries and centuries, would Europe truly belong to the african scum that once invaded it, never would it be their homeland.

    Now transpose what I've said precedently about Europe for your northern American question.
    This is an interesting perspective, and intuitively you have a point. But, to clarify, I imagine you are speaking about races as opposed to ethnicities? I ask because if one were to apply this perspective to ethnicities within Europe, then practically everyone would have the 'right' to expel someone else from their current territory - e.g. you could say that the English are still continential invaders of Britain and that the Welsh have the right to drive them into the sea and regain their British homeland. Yet, this would seem absurd on its face. So, the race versus ethnicity distinction is an important one in this context.

    The homeland question is interesting. The homelands of all races, in the sense of the place where they evolved and developed their racial character, are found in the Old World. If an Amerindian were to accuse me of occupying his homeland, I would point out that, leaving aside the fact his ancestors surrendered this particular area of land in a treaty, this isn't his homeland strictly speaking in any event.

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    Re: Do Europeans have claim to North America?

    Quote Originally Posted by Artois' Redneck



    Post-Scriptum for Rodskarl :
    We don't say the word "viva", in fact we say "Vive la France". That's the Italians and Spaniards that say "viva" with an "a". Anyway, thank you comrade . Long live to Norge, too. And may I say that I am honoured to talk to a Vanir. (I didn't know that your blessed kind was linked to the web.) Send my respectful greetings at the grands in Vanaheim.
    LOL Regards yourself; monsiegneur Vlaams.

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    Post Re: Do Europeans have claim to North America?

    Vive le Québec et vive la Normandie!

    Bah, screw Columbus (who did NOT discover NA btw) and Cabot...Cartier and de Champlain all the way!

    I feel a stronger tie to Québec than France. I have been to France and I felt a stranger there. But then again my ancestors were invaders of France originally as well I feel that Québec's climate and atmosphere is compatible with that of north western Europe so I don't feel much out of place.

    As for the natives, I do respect them a lot. I do believe they should be given their own lands within Canada and be allowed to self govern, as I belieev Québec should be solely for the Québécois and should be allowed to self govern. Canada is very torn up unlike many other countries. It is split up into the West, Ontario, Québec, the Maritimes and the northern Terrirtories..of which the groups living within those places don't quite like those living in the other regions lol

    About the guns...I would rather a bow and arrow than a 17th century musket that is for sure!! Bad aim..takes forever to load lol The problem was the natives were not completely unified against the invaders, and were very naive. The natives did not really give up the land "willingly" as someone mentioned. The problem was the Native and European costumes were very different, also the Natives did not fully understand the situation in its entirety.

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    Post Re: Do Europeans have claim to North America?

    Don't forget Leifr Eiriksson, the first recorded discoverer of Vinland (after Bjarni Hergelfsson). BTW Amerigo is a Germanic name: Amalric, Emmerich. Columbus was a Norwegian, Christopher Bonde. And don't forget the Lombards and the various other Nordids who invaded/conquered/sacked in Italy?

    ""The most convincing evidence was Columbus' coat of arms,"
    said Sannes. In the position designating a father's lineage, it
    bears an emblem identical to that used by the Bonde family, he
    said.
    Sannes said Columbus' father could have been a member of the
    noble Bonde family who he believes fled to Italy in the 1400s to
    avoid persecution in Norway.
    Sannes cited other bits of evidence: Columbus never wrote in
    Italian, he called himself a foreigner in southern Europe and he
    was described in some biographies as tall, fair and blue-eyed,
    typical Nordic characteristics.
    Sannes said documents on Columbus gathered by Genoa residents
    in the 1930s mentioned the Norwegian Bonde family and other
    associates of the explorer with ties to Norway.
    Sannes said Columbus' son Fernando, in a biography of his
    father, wrote that the explorer never wanted to disclose where he
    was born, but called himself a man of the sea."

    Anyway,
    Anyone know anymore about the racial characteristics of the Amerinds' predecessors?

    BTW Everything we have is on loan to us. Let us use it well, govern it rightly, and be blessed by it.

    -Thiudans

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    Member Gesta Bellica's Avatar
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    Post Re: Do Europeans have claim to North America?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thiudans
    Don't forget Leifr Eiriksson, the first recorded discoverer of Vinland (after Bjarni Hergelfsson). BTW Amerigo is a Germanic name: Amalric, Emmerich. Columbus was a Norwegian, Christopher Bonde. And don't forget the Lombards and the various other Nordids who invaded/conquered/sacked in Italy?

    ""The most convincing evidence was Columbus' coat of arms,"
    said Sannes. In the position designating a father's lineage, it
    bears an emblem identical to that used by the Bonde family, he
    said.
    Sannes said Columbus' father could have been a member of the
    noble Bonde family who he believes fled to Italy in the 1400s to
    avoid persecution in Norway.
    Sannes cited other bits of evidence: Columbus never wrote in
    Italian, he called himself a foreigner in southern Europe and he
    was described in some biographies as tall, fair and blue-eyed,
    typical Nordic characteristics.
    Sannes said documents on Columbus gathered by Genoa residents
    in the 1930s mentioned the Norwegian Bonde family and other
    associates of the explorer with ties to Norway.
    Sannes said Columbus' son Fernando, in a biography of his
    father, wrote that the explorer never wanted to disclose where he
    was born, but called himself a man of the sea."

    Anyway,
    Anyone know anymore about the racial characteristics of the Amerinds' predecessors?

    BTW Everything we have is on loan to us. Let us use it well, govern it rightly, and be blessed by it.

    -Thiudans
    It's not surprising that Colombo never wrote in Italian as the Italian language as we know it didn't exist at time, it was a literature language used by an handful of authors.
    The official language was still Latin and the dialect (vulgar ) of Genoa is totally different from the actual Italian.
    He called himself a foreigner in SE cos he felt like he was mistreated by the Spanish government after all he has done for them.
    I have heard in this site that Colombo was a converted Jew, a Greek from Constantinople, etc..
    Is it really so hard to accept that he simply was a Genoan? :anieyes
    After all the Italians already had a good notoriety as sailormen and explorators.
    Just let's not forget for example the importance of Marco Polo that was the first who explored the East Asia and documented about it.
    Or the same Vespucci, who was the first to realize that America was indeed a new Continental mass.

    It's apalling to notice that some Nordicists are so unhappy with their achievements in culture/history that they feel the URGE to steal ours, by "nordicising" every person or phenomenon that orginated from our Southern European countries
    I consider it an honour in some way
    Last edited by Gesta Bellica; Monday, May 31st, 2004 at 11:00 AM.

    "E tutti si scandalizzano quando sentono dire: quel tale tipo di mammifero o di uccello ormai è sparito dalla faccia della terra, non lo vedremo più; è una grave perdita. Certo, si tratta di gravissime perdite.
    Ma non sarebbe forse più grave se sparisse una comunità umana?? --Bruno Salvadori

    Seven pictures of northern European males and seven pictures of northern African males were presented randomly via a computer screen to 82 Italian female undergraduates of the University of Padua, Italy.
    Each picture depicted a full frontal face with a neutral facial expression. Participants were asked to classify each picture as either northern Italian or southern Italian.
    On average, the seven pictures depicting northern Europeans were classified as northern Italians 81% of the time. The seven pictures depicting northern Africans were classified as southern Italians 83%
    of the time.



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