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Thread: The Ideal State and its Implementation

  1. #1
    LaundryBob
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    Post The Ideal State and its Implementation

    The purpose of the state should always be to protect and extend the rights of the majority of its citizens. That much is obvious. One of the largest issues we face is the rights of the individual versus the rights of the majority. We national socialists take the side of the majority rather than the individual, the nation over the corporation, and patriotism before religion. There are some limits, however. We do not deprive our own people of their rights in order to pander to foreigners. No, and again no. We believe that the first priority of the state is to provide for its own citizens. That means that as long as there are citizens of the state who are in need of support, no foreign aid should be given, no corrupt regimes propped up. The state must take whatever action necessary to ensure the survival of its most productive citizens.

    Given that, the rights of citizenship must only be granted to those who are of use to the state, and thus to the people as a whole. No useless person, therefore, may be a citizen of the state. No one of foreign blood, no person who holds their religion before the state, no one who is, or who is a suspected danger to the state, and no one who is merely a drain upon the system and the race may enjoy the rights of citizenship. If, however, a non-citizen is found to be actively working against the state, then this enemy must be dealt with in such a manner that neutralizes the threat he or she poses. If this means death, and if death is in the best interests of the state, then so be it.

    All non-citizens may live in the country as guests, but only if granted the proper permission. They must be able to prove that they are here temporarily, and pose no threat to the state or the race. If these guests are found to have no real reason that justifies their presence, and if they may pose a danger to the state, then they must be either detained under government supervision or deported. If detained, they will only continue to be fed as long as the citizens remain fed as well. Again, the interests of citizens come before the interests of non-citizens.

    A person's blood alone may be found to pose a threat to the race. A person of inferior blood, such as those infected with HIV, those who are disabled, or those of a incompatible race must be dealt with so that the threat they pose is no more. In the case of a person infected with HIV, the person in question must be executed. If the carriers of the disease are eradicated, eventually more lives will be saved than if we allowed the disease to run rampant. If a person threatens the integrity of the race by means of inferior blood, and if he or she plans to stay in the state as a guest, then he or she must be sterilized. If one of the inferior blood [such as a mentally disabled man] is being supported by a private citizen, then he should be sterilized also. And finally, anyone who paints the sky green and the grass blue should be sterilized.

    The state itself should be an amalgamation of the Party and government infrastructure, gathered under the umbrella of a strong leader. The Party itself should depend upon this leader, for without an incorruptible leader, national socialism is bunk. The Party should not be formed under a corrupt or weak leader, and likewise should disband if such a leader should ever attempt to take hold. Regardless of these precautions, the faith in the leader [if he is indeed found to be incorruptible] must be absolute. Bickering and backstabbing only harms the credibility of the state—credibility which is much needed to successfully rule the country.

    The press should not be in the hands of leaders of the state. Rather, it should be in the hands of citizens of the state, for foreign ownership of the media must be avoided at all costs. It should not be illegal for the Party to own newspapers, but it should not be the job of National Socialist papers to suppress the truth. On the contrary, the state leadership should be so benevolent that it is in the best interest of the Party to publicize the truth, not to suppress it. Nevertheless, the art of propaganda must be utilized to keep the people on the side of the state, if only for the good of the people themselves.

    As long as external and internal enemies are present, a strong military is needed to protect the rights of citizens from these threats. The military should also serve the purpose of providing young people with discipline, and offering them an alternative to manual or intellectual labour. The military should be present at every aspect of life, from a teenager's first job, [think Deutsche Arbeitsfront] to keeping neighbourhoods clean. Crimes within the armed forces must not be tolerated. In fact, they must be held to be even more contemptible than those crimes committed by civilians, for the last thing the state needs is to be associated with atrocities against its own citizens. One too many otherwise great states have fallen victim to the publicity curse of the government atrocity.

    Last, but certainly not least, is the task of improving the race as a whole. The state must not only take action to protect the rights of its citizens, it must also take action to ensure that its citizens receive all the benefits of natural selection. To this end, a eugenics program must be implemented. The specifics must be worked out state scientists, but one thing is for certain—we must not allow our biological advancement to stagnate.

    "The main plank in the National Socialist programme is to abolish the liberalistic concept of the individual and the Marxist concept of humanity and to substitute therefore the folk community, rooted in the soil and bound together by the bond of its common blood."
    -Adolf Hitler, On National Socialism and World Relations, January 30, 1937

    How would you implement your ideal state?

    Although I would eventually like to completely overhaul the existing system, doing this too suddenly would be disastrous. We simply cannot replace everyone in the existing infrastructure. We need to keep people who are familiar with the current system and will be willing to help reform it. Such a breed will eventually die off, being replaced by the new generation of party elite. To prepare for such a transition, the party itself must be ready to merge with the state at any time.

    Many revolutionary parties completely boycott the democratic process. Others behave like mainstream political parties. We must do both. The party must have a democratic wing, which controls the tables of the nation, a military wing, which controls the streets, and finally a media wing, which controls public opinion by means of propaganda.

    We can learn a great deal from the German National Socialists in the 1920’s, for they too divided into several sections—loyal but separate. The popular military force was the SA, used to control the streets, combat political opponents, and keep order at party meetings. The SS supplied the military select—Hitler’s personal bodyguard come biological elite. The party used newspapers such as Der Angriff, Der Sturmer, and Der Volkischer Beobachter to influence public opinion and spread the world. And of course the National Socialists also ran in national elections. It is interesting to note that all of the divisions of the NSDAP [with the exception of the SA, which was replaced as the people's military force by the Wehrmacht] were expanded when the party took power. Although there were still divisions between sections of the party and those previously loyal to the Weimar republic, things went considerably smoother than in Soviet Russia, where Stalin's hasty reforms led to famines and millions of deaths.

    The party must not only look at training new members to become future officials; we must also attempt to convert as many as possible from the existing system. However, we must remember that no convert is as loyal as a party member conditioned from birth. Thus we will also form divisions for the youth, replacing religious ceremonies with parades dedicated to the party. Yes, the party must become a religion. Every citizen will be a follower of the party, but only the best will be members. The party, therefore, must serve as an intellectual elite whose sole purpose is to reform the state from the inside.
    Last edited by Moody; Tuesday, October 3rd, 2006 at 03:12 PM.

  2. #2
    Dzerzhinsky
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    How would you implement your ideal state?

    pretty much the way you have laid out. a military wing, a propaganda wing and a political wing. me being leftist, this would be the red guards, pravda and the bolsheviks. i would advocate revolution or a coup to get into power as i beleive in one party state. i would then use a vanguard for the revolution, in my case it would be the working class.

    The SS supplied the military select—Hitler’s personal bodyguard come biological elite.

    there is no such thing as biological elite. you pick who is the best for the job regardless. for a military wing, i would pick big, muscularm, intimidating people, not the so called perfect 'aryan' with blonde hair and blue eyes!

    we must also attempt to convert as many as possible from the existing system.

    they must be in it for the cause, not because you have brainwashed them.

    Yes, the party must become a religion.

    you are being too forceful on people to convert to your ideology. let your manifesto speak for itself, you shouldn't need to use mind control to make people think like you.

    Every citizen will be a follower of the party

    this is ridiculous!

    but only the best will be members.

    who defines the best? you? are they the best because they are 'aryan'? eyes:

    The party, therefore, must serve as an intellectual elite whose sole purpose is to reform the state from the inside.

    you started ok, but you have no gone ridiculous. the 'intellectual elite'? so you will decide election by an IQ test? its not always the most intelligent who rules the best. eg Gorbachev had 2 degrees, but he was an awful leader. Stalin had virtually no education and was one of the greatest leaders of the 20th century who turned a backward country into a superpower!

  3. #3
    LaundryBob
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    >>Originally posted by Dzerzhinsky
    >>...a vanguard for the revolution, in my case it would be the working class.

    I assume this would be for purely ideological reasons, rather than practical ones. Otherwise, the only purpose such an action would accomplish would be to reward the weakest, least successful, members of society, and in essence punish the higher classes for their own success.

    >>Originally posted by Dzerzhinsky
    >>...there is no such thing as biological elite.

    Now there is a broad statement if I ever saw one. Do you deny that some individuals are genetically more gifted and healthy than others? Would it not be possible to utilize these individuals as a part of an intellectual or combat elite?

    >>Originally posted by Dzerzhinsky
    >>...you pick who is the best for the job regardless.

    I'm sorry if the idea of hereditary intelligence frightens you, but it is a scientific fact.

    >>Originally posted by Dzerzhinsky
    >>...i would pick big, muscularm, intimidating people...

    I would as well. Beleive it or not, some people are genetically potentially bigger and stronger people than others.

    >>Originally posted by Dzerzhinsky
    >>...not the so called perfect aryan with blonde hair and blue eyes!

    Those are Nordic traits, and frankly quite unimportant. No one is proposing that "perfect Aryans" with Nordic traits be chosen over big, muscular and intimidating people. As always, you are trying to knock over a straw man, and you have failed miserably.

    >>Originally posted by Dzerzhinsky
    >>...they must be in it for the cause, not because you have brainwashed them.

    Let's see, the Jewish owned media is broadcasting their party line twenty-four hours a day, seven days a week, through television, newspaper, radio, movies, music, magazines, books, and the internet. I am sitting here debating. I hardly think that we are the ones doing the brainwashing.

    >>Originally posted by Dzerzhinsky
    >>...you are being too forceful on people to convert to your ideology.

    It is better to have the people love you than execute all those who do not.

    >>Originally posted by Dzerzhinsky
    >>...are they the best because they are aryan?

    No, the members of the party would be those who are prepared to be the most active. But to be a citizen of the state, and thus be applicable to the party, one must be a member of the native race. We aren't about to start accepting Jews and Gypsies into the party elite!

    >>Originally posted by Dzerzhinsky
    >>...so you will decide election by an IQ test?

    Please point out to me just exactly where I said that.

    >>Originally posted by Dzerzhinsky
    >>...its not always the most intelligent who rules the best.

    Your example is faulty, because "intelligence" does not refer to knowledge.

  4. #4
    With my bloodbrothers at side, All sons of father with one eye, We were all born in the land of the blood on ice.
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    Originally posted by Dzerzhinsky
    [B]. Stalin had virtually no education and was one of the greatest leaders of the 20th century who turned a backward country into a superpower!
    Im wondering how you feel about Stalin's mass holocaust and mass transportation of people. in case you didn't know, he was responsible for Millions of peoples atrocity.

    Or has the urge for a reciprocating argument/example
    swift away your humanistic goodwill?

  5. #5
    Dzerzhinsky
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    Im wondering how you feel about Stalin's mass holocaust and mass transportation of people. in case you didn't know, he was responsible for Millions of peoples atrocity.

    who esle could i say that about? eyes:

    the situation with Stalin is like this. Stalins popularity is at its highest since the 40's. he was recently voted best russian leader by under 20's. the reason? overkill (no pun intended). the liberals have gone on so much about stalinist atrocites that they have lost all meaning. people can't afford to feed there families, they see crime and drugs about, they see people dying in the streets, and they switch on the radio to hear some liberal prick speaking about how good life is since stalin!!!! its ridiculous! when we deal with our issues of feeding people, then we can deal with the issue of Stalin.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Ederico's Avatar
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    The National Socialist Revolution must initiate from the youth and the open-minded individuals of the Aryan Race to prepare the new wave of National Socialism with fresh strength and fervor which are a characteristic of youthful enthusiasm and pride.

    The Movement cannot reform the thoughts of the middle-aged and elderly as their minds are already programmed to follow the thoughts inputted by the mass media and its anti-Nationalistic stance. These sections of the populations are not to be ignored though, as some individuals could provide assistance to the cause.

    The youth's mind is less prone to have received successive waves of anti-Nationalistic indoctrination from the mass media, and althought the damage is still considerate, the youth include that section of the population eager for change, the revolutionary group. Unfortunately the youth have one major problem, their indifference to political, national, and racial affairs, and their indifference to anything which does not directly affect their individual life. Another major problem could be the lack of a National and Racial Pride which unless developed through a Nationalistic Education in History, Culture, and Politics, could be quite lacking naturally. Only a few are born Nationalists, none are trained by Education to be Nationalists in our days.

    The only media open to the Aryan Nationalists and National Socialists is the still free from political censorship Internet, which could allow that centralisation of political thought essential to overcome the struggle the whole Aryan Race faces. The Internet must be used as a vehicle for Information, Propaganda, and Communication between Individuals of different social backgrounds and Nationalities, but members of the Aryan Race. We must have a web of professionals in Information and Design to create the front-end to the Political Ideology of the Movement of the Aryan Race through websites which aim to spread the message of the Aryan Movement.

    The main problem facing Aryan Nationalists is the creation of an ideology or the adaptation of National Socialism to modern times, which is acceptable to the masses without endangering the integrity of the ideology. The creation of an ideology of this type, would help to unite the various Nationalistic movements which are splintered for (in my opinion) futile reasons considering the ends which all Aryans should have in common : The creation of Aryan States for Aryan Folks in Aryan Lands. With that aim reached, the creation of the Ideal State must then be the main aim.

    I am still thinking and shaping my opinion on what would be the Ideal State. At this moment I only have a general idea:

    The State must safeguard the decent livelihood of every citizen willing to be productive and member of the Race and/or Nationality. It must create a Justice System in which Morality is enforced, and Moral degenerates eliminated from any power to influence society. It must create an Education System which creates Nationalistic Citizens, Political Leaders, and Intellectuals fit in body and mind, and the supply of suitably trained workers in technical and manual jobs. The State must protect the Environment and punish those individuals and organisations which harm or are a threat to the Natural Environment, because the Natural Environment is no one's property, and everyone's property at the same time, and as such the State is responsible for its protection, and the education of the Citizens to protect the Natural Environment. The State must control and direct the Economy to be a motor for the well-being of the nation and the happiness of the Citizens, since no non-Economically stable Nation can be a happy and prosperous Nation.

    The Aryan Movement must have branches related to all aspects of National Life, to enter each aspect of the lives of the Citizens and be able to give the ideal model to follow to Citizens according to National Socialism. National Socialism must become the guide of the Citizens in every aspect of life through the creation of a Morally-sound society and a well-disciplined citizenry. The Ideal State can only exist and be implemented in the Ideal Society, first the training of the Citizens to become Ideal must be carried out, essentially this means that the youth and future generations can implement the Ideal State. That is because the youth can still be molded into an Ideal.

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    Senior Member Ederico's Avatar
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    I agree with practically all that you posted in this post. I am interested to understand how the Justice System would work in your Ideal State, the Economic aspect and orientation of your Ideal National Community, the Eugenics program, and Citizenship acquirement.

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    Post Dzerzhinsky

    Is it me or was Stalin's oppressive rule and dedication to the Communist economic policies the cause for the USSR's poverty and crippled economy? Just as Mao Starved and murdered his people in the name of communism so did Stalin. Russia has always been a world power I would not credit Stalin with achieving this, in the long run it seems that he did more harm than good with his policies and exploitation of the Rus.

    Dzerzhinsky, you make a vague reference to Hitler's atrocities but you fail to mention he did not intentionally kill his own people rather the leeches that fed on them. He was a champion of the Germans and Aryans everywhere where as Stalin propagated the miscenegation and destruction of his own people's race and wealth. Thanks to Stalin you have a starving mongrel nation who will never recover until they make their blood pure again.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Moody's Avatar
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    Post On Leadership of the State

    LaundryBob; "The state itself should be an amalgamation of the Party and government infrastructure, gathered under the umbrella of a strong leader. The Party itself should depend upon this leader, for without an incorruptible leader, national socialism is bunk. As long as external and internal enemies are present, a strong military is needed to protect the rights of citizens from these threats".

    Moody Lawless; This aspect of Leadership needs to be looked at.
    It must surely be accepted that Great Leaders are rare beasts, like Great poets of Great painters.
    There is not an Adolf Hitler born to every generation.
    Therefore the modern programme of National Socialism should look at this problem [it did not occur to the NSDAP because they had Hitler, obviously].

    For historical precedent, let us refer back to the Roman Republic.
    There, the Dictatorship was part of the 'constitution'; in times of crisis a Dictator took charge, but for only a limited period. When that period had lapsed, he HAD to step down, unless the Senate [or Party in our case] thought he should carry on.
    Under such a system, weak or destructive Leaders could be brought to book.
    This would mean that the 'constitution' of the Party [based on the 25 points of course] is sacrosanct - even above the Leader.
    Is this a problem for those who believe rather that the Leader himself is sacrosanct and above all else?
    But then look at the Hitler quote below - surely the 'constitution' should represent the Folk, and therefore be even above the Leader.

    "The main plank in the National Socialist programme is to abolish the liberalistic concept of the individual and the Marxist concept of humanity and to substitute therefore the folk community, rooted in the soil and bound together by the bond of its common blood."
    [Adolf Hitler 1937]
    Why are there beings at all, & why not rather nothing?
    [Leibniz/Heidegger]

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