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Thread: Indo-European Chronology - Countries and Peoples

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    Sozrash
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    Re: Indo-European Chronology - Countries and Peoples

    Quote Originally Posted by Frans_Jozef
    Indo-European Chronology - Countries and Peoples

    http://indoeuro.bizland.com/project/chron/chronn.html#6
    Nice work!

    About the Hittites! A book was written by Ivanov, V. The Hittite Language in Moscow in 1963, he left so many phrases that he didn't knew the exact meaning for them. A Circassian linguistic wrote a book after that and translated those phrases using his Language, the Circassian language. We have a very big underground burial in the Adyghay republic in the Caucases under the territory of Meyquap city, they found many graves that belongs for the Hittites, and the writtings were translated using the Circassian language, because it is so close to the Hittite's language!

    We have a city in Adyghay called the Hittite's town. Another thing, we have families among the Circassians untill now, that have family names called (The Hittites) or (The son of the Hittites).

    I believe that if anyone wants to study the Hittite's language, he should do it using the Circassian language!
    At least he can try! If he doesn't believe!

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    Re: Indo-European Chronology - Countries and Peoples

    Quote Originally Posted by Sozrash
    Nice work!

    About the Hittites! A book was written by Ivanov, V. The Hittite Language in Moscow in 1963, he left so many phrases that he didn't knew the exact meaning for them. A Circassian linguistic wrote a book after that and translated those phrases using his Language, the Circassian language.
    Doesn't sound very likely. Englishmen now cannot easily understand the English of the 14th Century, and even Shakespeare is quite difficult. The Old English from the 8th Century is impossible for ordinary laymen. That's only one thousand years ago. How can you read Hittite using Circassian, if the former is from 4000 years ago? Have a little healthy cynicism!
    We have a very big underground burial in the Adyghay republic in the Caucases under the territory of Meyquap city,
    Is that how the Adygey pronounce/spell Maikop?
    they found many graves that belongs for the Hittites, and the writtings were translated using the Circassian language, because it is so close to the Hittite's language!

    We have a city in Adyghay called the Hittite's town. Another thing, we have families among the Circassians untill now, that have family names called (The Hittites) or (The son of the Hittites).

    I believe that if anyone wants to study the Hittite's language, he should do it using the Circassian language!
    At least he can try! If he doesn't believe!
    Give us some details!

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    AW: Re: Indo-European Chronology - Countries and Peoples

    I somehow question the objectivity of this Indo-European chronology.
    Germans at that time were even more than just barbarians - they hardly knew any advances of the civilization, widely used human sacrifices (they usually sunk people in swamps), did not cultivate lands. Most men were involved only in war affairs. That is why Germans were the biggest threat to Roman towns - they destroyed all buildings, roads, wells, farms, just because they did not know how to use them. All historians agree that Germans were the most cruel tribe in that day Europe.
    Gothic tribes were as ignorant and uncivilized as their other Germanic brothers. Two centuries later after long contacts with Roman and Greek cultures they invented a script, acquired monarchy and many other advances of civilization.
    Germans knew no agriculture, no towns, no civilization; they lived mainly by hunting, gathering and cattle-breeding.
    Tolerance is a proof of distrust in one's own ideals. Friedrich Nietzsche


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    Sv: Indo-European Chronology - Countries and Peoples

    It's probably Russian. (The Russians study a lot Indo-European lingustics.)

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    Re: Indo-European Chronology - Countries and Peoples

    Quote Originally Posted by Frans_Jozef
    Indo-European Chronology - Countries and Peoples

    http://indoeuro.bizland.com/project/chron/chronn.html#6
    This is a great link. Interesting.

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    Re: Indo-European Chronology - Countries and Peoples

    Quote Originally Posted by Frans_Jozef
    Indo-European Chronology - Countries and Peoples

    http://indoeuro.bizland.com/project/chron/chronn.html#6
    AH!
    I nosied around on this link, and found it's from the people behind the Yahoo Group "CyBaList" which I'm a long term member of. Very clever interesting people and excellent discussions they have there.

    ANyone interested in this sort of thing should definitely click on the link at the bottom of the page to "Forum".

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    Sozrash
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    Re: Indo-European Chronology - Countries and Peoples

    Quote Originally Posted by Oswiu
    Doesn't sound very likely. Englishmen now cannot easily understand the English of the 14th Century, and even Shakespeare is quite difficult. The Old English from the 8th Century is impossible for ordinary laymen. That's only one thousand years ago. How can you read Hittite using Circassian, if the former is from 4000 years ago? Have a little healthy cynicism!

    Is that how the Adygey pronounce/spell Maikop?


    Give us some details!
    Do not give me manners about cynicism!
    Your Englishmen now cannot easily understand the English of the 14th Century because it changes variously!! maybe cause you have so many races that are living among you!! But they still can read it!

    Its for sure that our language is not as it was 4000 yrs ago! But still, most of it can be read, by linguistics of course, not me!

    About Meyquap, it is pronounced Maikop in russian! but in ours its Meyquap.
    Mey means wild apple, or Forest apple, and Quape means region! The apple region!

    About the translation, I'll get you examples!!

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    Re: Indo-European Chronology - Countries and Peoples

    Quote Originally Posted by Frans_Jozef View Post
    Indo-European Chronology - Countries and Peopleshttp://indoeuro.bizland.com/project/chron/chronn.html#6
    Frans, the link goes to the following information which is not correct. I quote:

    'Simultaneously with the first written documents of Hellenes Indic people begin to create the first epic in India, called Veda. The four Vedas were composed in Vedic, an early form of the Old Indic language, the predecessor of Sanskrit. The oldest portions are believed by scholars to have originated largely with the Aryan invaders of India some time between 1450 and 1000 BC; however, the Vedas in their present form are believed to date only from the close of the 3rd century BC, when the Brahmi script was invented.'

    There are hardly any Hellenes Indic people (the European Aryans separated from the Indo-Iranians sometime around 4000 BC when they were probably living in the Kazakh steppes). The people being discussed are Indo-Iranian Aryans. The Indo-Iranians had carried their lore with them orally for many millenia, that is why they remembered the deluge by snow (Avesta), days lasting a seven months (they said the God-Mother Aditi had seven sons, the eighth, Martand, was born dead, that is why you have the sun's carriage drawn by seven horses or a horse with seven heads), dawns and dusks extending to one month, and a long night of three months (Ati-Ratra). This clearly shows that the Aryan homeland was close to North Pole. It was perhaps in a Siberia extended by locking up of sea water in ice-sheets during glaciation (18000 years ago) when the Zemlyas were also parts of it.

    'The oldest portions are believed by scholars to have originated largely with the Aryan invaders of India some time between 1450 and 1000 BC': This is Max Muellerian trash. The Vedas were first composed in PIE. They were probably in prose and later put into verse by poets. Then two problems arose. The place where Indo-Iranians lived changed continually. They came south from their sub-arctic homeland to temperate regions. There were no acrtic days, no extended dawns or dusks, no long polar nights. The Indo-Iranians could not fathom the what their songs meant. This same problem was faced by European Indologists like Max Mueller. The Indo-Aryans just like the European Indologists were trying to comprehend sub-polar phenomena with tropical geography. All astronomical references changed. While once the sun rose on the day of Vernal Equinox in the constellation of Beta Geminorium (Punarvasu), it later rose in the constellation of Orion (Mrigashiras), and even later in the constellation of Pleidas (Krittika). The second problem was the changes in language. The RigVeda shows many changes, after PIE came the old Vedic Sanskrit and then the later new Vedic Sanskrit. There was continuous re-writing of the Vedas by people trying to understand what was written, these were known as Samhitas and very few survive today. Around 2500 BC, the YajurVeda was re-written in the form of Taittiriya Samhita. At this time Aryans were in Trans-Oxiana (Uttarapatha; Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan, Tajikistan), Afghanistan, and also in India. Aryans had by then been absorbed in the India milleu. There were no wars with local population. They came to India as Indians. Brahmi script had nothing to do with Vedas. The Vedas never required writing. They were remembered by heart. A very special system was created by the priests (Brahmins) in which it was not possible to loose even a word or a sound.

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    Re: Indo-European Chronology - Countries and Peoples

    Quote Originally Posted by Sozrash View Post
    Do not give me manners about cynicism!
    Your Englishmen now cannot easily understand the English of the 14th Century because it changes variously!! maybe cause you have so many races that are living among you!! But they still can read it!

    Its for sure that our language is not as it was 4000 yrs ago! But still, most of it can be read, by linguistics of course, not me!

    About Meyquap, it is pronounced Maikop in russian! but in ours its Meyquap.
    Mey means wild apple, or Forest apple, and Quape means region! The apple region!

    About the translation, I'll get you examples!!
    Though I don't condone the anger in the reponse, I must say, Oswiu, that he is right. Just because we can't understand our language as it was written 1000 years back without training doesn't mean that others are in the same condition.

    Spaniards can read Spanish from 1000 years back without too much hassle (if they learn to do some tricks in how they pronounce the words, they can even push that back several centuries further). Arabs can read the Koran from 1300 years back with very little difficulty. If I'm not mistaken, Greeks can read Homer and do all right with it, and that's something like 2800 years back.

    I don't think it's altogether impossible (or even necessarily unlikely) that a native literate speaker of a modern language might be able to read an ancient ancestral form of it without special training.

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