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Thread: Ontario Passes Law Allowing Gov’t to Seize Children From Parents Who Oppose Gender Transition

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    Sound methods Chlodovech's Avatar
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    Ontario Passes Law Allowing Gov’t to Seize Children From Parents Who Oppose Gender Transition



    Canada’s Ontario province has passed legislation that allows the government to seize children from families that refuse to accept their child’s chosen “gender identity” or “gender expression.”

    The so-called Supporting Children, Youth and Families Act of 2017, or Bill 89, was approved by a vote of 63 to 23, according to The Christian Times.

    It requires child protection, foster, adoption service providers, and judges to take into account and respect a child’s “race, ancestry, place of origin, color, ethnic origin, citizenship, family diversity, disability, creed, sex, sexual orientation, gender identity and gender expression.”

    “I would consider that a form of abuse, when a child identifies one way and a caregiver is saying no, you need to do this differently,” Minister of Child and Family Services Michael Coteau, who introduced the bill, was quoted as saying. “If it’s abuse, and if it’s within the definition, a child can be removed from that environment and placed into protection where the abuse stops.”

    The bill replaces the Child and Family Services Act, or Bill 28, which governs child protection, foster care and adoption services.

    Bill 28 stated that the parent of a child in care retains the right “to direct the child’s education and religious upbringing.” However, the new law amends it thus: “to direct the child or young person’s education and upbringing, in accordance with the child’s or young person’s creed, community identity and cultural identity.”

    Irwin Elman, Ontario’s provincial advocate for children and youth, said in a statement, “I believe that this new Act, in its principles, represents a paradigm shift for the province with its commitment to the participation of children and youth in every decision that affects them, the creation of a child-centered system of service, and commitment to anti-racism and children’s rights.”

    Jack Fonseca, senior political strategist for Campaign Life Coalition, disagrees, and was quoted as saying, “With the passage of Bill 89, we’ve entered an era of totalitarian power by the state, such as never witnessed before in Canada’s history. Make no mistake, Bill 89 is a grave threat to Christians and all people of faith who have children, or who hope to grow their family through adoption.”

    In April, a Christian couple filed a lawsuit against Hamilton Children’s Aid Society for removing two foster children from their home because they refused to lie to the girls by saying that the Easter bunny is real.

    “We have a no-lying policy,” Derek Baars, one of the foster parents, said at the time, pointing out that a child support worker insisted that he and his wife, Frances Baars, tell the two girls in their care, aged 3 and 4, the Easter bunny is real. “We explained to the agency that we are not prepared to tell the children a lie. If the children asked, we would not lie to them, but we wouldn’t bring it up ourselves.”

    The eligibility of the Baars, members of the Reformed Presbyterian Church of North America, was canceled and the children were taken away. The CAS worker, who insisted that the Baars teach the kids that the Easter bunny is genuine, told them that the Easter bunny was an important part of Canadian culture.

    Sovereignnations.com
    “Remember that all worlds draw to an end and that noble death is a treasure which no-one is too poor to buy.” - C. S. Lewis, The Last Battle

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    Senior Member Skärmträl's Avatar
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    Not much different from a hypothetical government which seizes children from families that don't accept their children's refusal of eating their vegetables.

    "Gender expression" is just about kids feeling uncertain about themselves in a confusing world; any responsible parent puts a stop to these exaggerated solutions and do their very best to establish true self-esteem in their children.

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    Senior Member Ravenrune's Avatar
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    The huge problem with this is that young people at that age do tend to go through strange phases. In the past they may alter their fashion into bizarre (at least to their parents) ideas to follow the trends of popular music of fads.

    It's bad enough if they get some tattoo they may regret or want altered in the future but what if they have their genitals altered or removed!


    Now this is the major problem that is starting with this supposed "Transgender thing". If governments and medical and psychological "experts" start getting behind this, it will lead to countless regrets later on ( and let's face reality here ... psychology and especially psychiatry are the most nebulous of sciences! They are vague at best and in many ways are based on some opinionated expert's claims to know what dreams, memories and other opinions and stories mean).


    The idea that we are coming to an era when young people are being legally allowed, promoted and supported by government rules against parental wishes to decided that their bodies should be altered by medical means (ie ... drugs and surgery) is extremely concerning! Young people of this age are prone to strange fads, fashion changes and just plain going against authority and parents .... and we are supporting government and legal ideas that give them free will to alter their bodies and that penalize parents!


    Utter madness!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Skärmträl View Post
    Not much different from a hypothetical government which seizes children from families that don't accept their children's refusal of eating their vegetables.

    "Gender expression" is just about kids feeling uncertain about themselves in a confusing world; any responsible parent puts a stop to these exaggerated solutions and do their very best to establish true self-esteem in their children.

    A lot of the confusing world is the extreme amount of information of various directions that is available. In my life with access to the internet, I have read all sorts of things about wars and politics that have made me think I had been give false and brainwashing ideas (yet I've tried my best to keep a rational and logical mind and I hope I have LOL). I can't even imagine all bizarre and seemingly convincing information some people look up about these issues I have barely ever looked at. I can see though that the amount of information I've looked into contains a fair amount of complete BS (according to my hopefully reasonable judgement)


    Too many ideas floating around and it's causing a huge amount of confusion about what is real I think.


    Maybe some groups and elites want this confusion.

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    Senior Member Skärmträl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ravenrune View Post
    A lot of the confusing world is the extreme amount of information of various directions that is available. In my life with access to the internet, I have read all sorts of things about wars and politics that have made me think I had been give false and brainwashing ideas (yet I've tried my best to keep a rational and logical mind and I hope I have LOL). I can't even imagine all bizarre and seemingly convincing information some people look up about these issues I have barely ever looked at. I can see though that the amount of information I've looked into contains a fair amount of complete BS (according to my hopefully reasonable judgement)

    Too many ideas floating around and it's causing a huge amount of confusion about what is real I think.
    Agreed, one does hope that one is of sound judgment considering the mess modern life throws our way. It's probably way beyond our biology to sift through that amount of information. Sometimes one just stops and thinks, "Hold on, there's so much data to go through, the very basis of my worldview could be entirely wrong! And what would 'wrong' even mean?" It's more than enough for an adult, just imagine the confusion our children are experiencing.

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    Senior Member Ravenrune's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skärmträl View Post
    Agreed, one does hope that one is of sound judgment considering the mess modern life throws our way. It's probably way beyond our biology to sift through that amount of information. Sometimes one just stops and thinks, "Hold on, there's so much data to go through, the very basis of my worldview could be entirely wrong! And what would 'wrong' even mean?" It's more than enough for an adult, just imagine the confusion our children are experiencing.



    And I am of the opinion that the elite upholders of the current status quo and social agenda want to deliberately cause as much confusion as possible! It's part of the dissolution of things in order to create a new order.


    Although I have read about alchemical ideas on a personal level (first stage is dissolving and destruction of material in order to create a personal reality ) , I believe this concept is essentially what the elites are doing on a grand social scale .... destroy social order in order to remake it later on


    ORDO AB CHAO .... order out of choas

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    A Canadian court is persecuting a father for misgendering his daughter

    The New Family Violence by Douglas Farrow

    Source: Firstthings.com

    Family violence can take many forms,” says Madam Justice Marzari of the Supreme Court of British Columbia, including “unreasonable restrictions or preventions of a family member’s personal autonomy.” To be more specific, “family violence” can now take the form of refusing to accept a family member’s chosen gender identity. Such is the violence inflicted on a fourteen-year-old girl (referred to as AB) who is determined to be a boy, by her father (dubbed CD), who insists she is no such thing.

    The court will not stand idly by, insists Justice Marzari, knowing that AB is “harmed by the fact that it is his own father, whom he loves, who appears to be publicly rejecting his identity, perpetuating stories that reject his identity, and exposing him to degrading and violent commentary in social media” (A.B. v. C.D. and E.F., 2019 BCSC 604, par. 72). Under Justice Bowden, it has “already determined that it is a form of family violence to AB for any of his family members to address him by his birth name, refer to him as a girl or with female pronouns (whether to him directly or to third parties), or to attempt to persuade him to abandon treatment for gender dysphoria” (par. 21). And now it means to enforce its embargo on such behavior by permitting the arrest without warrant of CD, should he give the least appearance of persisting in this violence.

    We will return later to the matter of “degrading and violent” commentary. For the moment, please note that “treatment for gender dysphoria” means—at a minimum—the application of opposite-sex hormones, with their permanent effects on AB’s body. It certainly does not mean trying to get at the root causes in her soul—alienation from a parent, perhaps?—through any kind of cognitive therapy. That sort of thing qualifies these days as degrading and violent “conversion therapy,” a label applied in Orwellian fashion to any procedure that might call into question a sexual orientation or gender identity claim; any procedure, that is, which risks reversing a SOGI conversion. In a number of jurisdictions, approaches with that sort of risk have become illegal.

    But back to A.B. v. C.D. Not being a family member, I will say in response to the court what AB’s father has been saying, but is now forbidden to say on pain of arrest: His daughter is a daughter not a son, a she not a he, and the court has no power by legal writ to change what is written in her chromosomes or to declare her chromosomes irrelevant. And I will add this: The court’s attempt to declare her chromosomes irrelevant is itself a form of violence against the family—this family and every family.

    Don't get me wrong. AB’s gender dysphoria may well be a product of one or more of the many forms of violence that family violence can take, though other possibilities exist and I am in no position to make inferences or draw conclusions. It is not for me to defend the father or any other member of the family, or to pass any kind of judgment at all on root causes. But I will side with the father in the matter of the limitations of legal writ and of personal autonomy claims. Neither AB herself, nor Bowden and Marzari JJ, can make a boy of a girl. AB’s counselors and doctors can’t, either, however keen they may be to try.

    Who entitled the court to invest all the power of law in AB’s reality-denying “personal autonomy” claim, a claim that likely began, however it began (she was eleven or twelve at the time), as a plea for help? What warrants this draconian gag order that both denies CD’s right to speak and tries to compels him, if he does speak, to say what he does not believe, using words he thinks wrong?

    In the ruling, Justice Marzari attempts to reassure us that her commandeering even of CD’s pronouns is no serious violation of his liberty: “Neither is CD’s freedom of belief engaged by the orders sought. There is no requirement that CD change his views about what is best for AB. It is only how he expresses those views privately to AB and publicly to third parties that is affected” (par. 50).

    So there you have it, CD. You are free to believe what you like. You can believe that neither individuals nor their doctors, nor even judges in courts of law, can make boys of girls or girls of boys. Just don’t tell anyone or we’ll have you up on fresh charges of violence or harassment or hate speech. We’ll have you behind bars. You wouldn’t want that, would you?

    Far from protecting AB from violence through the exercise of its parens patriae power, the court itself is engaged in violence against AB, aiding and abetting those who have encouraged her to rebel against her own body in a vain attempt to find the peace her soul needs. This ruling attacks not merely one parent and one child, but every parent and every child. For the very idea of the family perforce disappears where personal autonomy is construed in such a fashion that the sexed body is of no account. If the sexed body is of no account, neither is reproduction or parenting or filiation. And if it is now “family violence” to refuse to accept a gender identity claim, violence of a sort the law can forbid and punish, it will follow soon enough that it is violence for anyone to refuse to accept that claim, and that this too can be punished. The court’s parens patriae power will extend to everyone (a point I made in Nation of Bastards). It will be universal in its reach.

    It has been evident for some time that the gender mainstreaming activists have been pressing for just that, primarily through hate speech and discrimination legislation. Courts are increasingly listening, for they are now stocked by judges bred in the same stable. Justice Marzari even sees fit (hence her reference to “degrading and violent” commentary) to quote from comment-box trolls at The Federalist in justification of her decision. Nice touch, that. We’re all trolls now, apparently, if like CD we dare to question SOGI ideology, which Marzari has just declared to be her court’s own ideology.

    Well, her gag order doesn’t apply to me (though I hail from Beautiful British Columbia). Not yet. If and when it does, it will be evident to all that the law has become an instrument of oppression rather than of justice. I hope I won’t have the slightest hesitation in defying it, and I hope I won’t be alone in doing so.
    “Remember that all worlds draw to an end and that noble death is a treasure which no-one is too poor to buy.” - C. S. Lewis, The Last Battle

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    Sound methods Chlodovech's Avatar
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    More alarming news from Trudeau's Canada



    What drives this gender nonsense - except for the usual suspects - is single/divorced and/or feminist mothers with sons - whom they want to raise as daughters - sometimes they hate the biological father and hate recognising the father in the son. These women encourage and reward gender confused behaviour in their children and even force their children to crossdress.

    It's programming, it's child abuse, it's grooming and sexualization of children. Also another indirect consequence of having a free sexual market place.

    Meanwhile in Toronto...

    “Remember that all worlds draw to an end and that noble death is a treasure which no-one is too poor to buy.” - C. S. Lewis, The Last Battle

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    Senior Member Dani's Avatar
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    I really can't emphasize enough that Canada is a very unhealthy society (on a mental / spiritual level) and part of this is that we are the only 'White Dominion' to have never developed a real identity.

    What I mean by that is that the split between French-Canada and Anglo-Canada caused the Anglo provinces to never really move past the 'resource colony' stage & then we imported massive numbers of pan-Euro immigrants (especially to the prairie provinces). We're not at all like Australia (which has loads of issues but a strong sense of national pride).

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