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Thread: How Do You Feel About Ageing?

  1. #141
    The lion's gate Chlodovech's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leliana View Post
    Ageing is an issue for me. I'm kinda unable to accept that my 30th birthday is just less than two years away. What the hell? Wasn't I in my early 20's...in my teenage years!...just a little while ago? Where is all the time, gone forever!? l-o-l!°
    It's a psychological barrier. As long as you're below 35 you'll still be classified as young by pretty much everyone else most of the time and I would agree with that. You are still young, Leliana, just not a teen anymore. You'll definitely view your 28 year old self as "still young" in a decade or so. And everyone younger than 60 dresses young these days, there are plenty of seventy year olds who dress like 20 year olds too, usually sporty or casual. It's the norm in the West. Of course, no sane 50+ year old woman is going to try to rock a miniskirt or dress, but other than that no wardrobe update will ever be needed unless you desire one yourself.

    I think anxiety people may feel related to aging is tied in with other personal issues, with general regrets and fears - ultimately these worries are about our own mortality (and that of family members) and bodily decay and the fear of social exclusion and being left behind as well as the fear of not fulfilling our own expectations and dreams. Also the fear of not being (or allowed to be) ourselves anymore: the fear of losing ourselves - maybe more than any other fear.

    And then you have to consider the societies in which we live - the modern West is all about being young and pretty - or at least looking the part. An obsession our ancestors (who weren't atheists who purely lived in the here and now and strictly for themselves) didn't share. It has a gigantic impact on us.

    Being old would've meant you were respectable prior to the Sixties, now it means you're redundant and soon to be stored away in those facilities we have for old people. Out of sight and out of mind.
    "If we were going to stand in darkness, best we stand in a darkness we had made ourselves.” ― Douglas Coupland, Shampoo Planet

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  3. #142
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    I hate ageing . Nothing good will follow from that, but opposite I really love life (so much to learn/to know more and test/try new things .... and there is actually so little time for all those ) ... ageing is just something nobody can fight against ... so I try to forget it/not thinking about it. But then I look old photos of my mom (for example), how beautiful she had been ... all that comes so real. Oh, she is still fine; being healthy looking older woman ... and my dad loves her probably more than ever ... but ageing leaves marks on everyone.

    I was once in common sauna (those big car ferries travelling between Helsinki and Stockholm) with one of my Swedish cousin. There were also 2 older age Finnish women (in their 40's, early 50's maybe). My cousin sit closer to them. They probably thought that we both were Swedish (speaking swedish) as they talked pretty openly to each others. I remember one comment of another women said: ... something that at one point woman will become ''invisible'' in the eyes of men. Meant by that, as getting older .... men's heads will not anymore turn on the streets etc. Before anybody answer anything here .... I doubt those were any kind of ''low moral'' or ''bad'' women (or someone who would actually try/tried that). Just normal older women, who probably have simply noticed that.

    Sooo... any idea here at which age that happens (more a less)? Might vary person by person, but I think it is one milestone then you have become ''old''.

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  5. #143
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    People who do not have children worry about aging MUCH more than people who do. Why? Because parents and grandparents have already insured their immortality. They can re-live their youth through their children and grandchildren and know that the IMPORTANT thing, that is, the FAMILY, will go on. There will be younger ones to love them when they are older and mourn and remember them when they are gone. And they will live forever.

    So those of you who do not have kids yet, HAVE THEM. Forget the excuses, especially the money-based ones.
    Most people think as they are trained to think, and most people make a majority.

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  7. #144
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huginn ok Muninn View Post
    So those of you who do not have kids yet, HAVE THEM.
    LOL. Are you now absolutely sure what you are recommending above?

    As you are partly saying that there would the room for few ...
    * short temper
    * firecracker
    * beastly
    * self-confident
    * straight talking (sometimes ''impolite''?)
    * patriotic (sometimes ''racist''?)
    * non-believer
    * chauvinists hater

    ... characters owning Nordid girl/girls in the future? Pretty ... but strong minded & stubborn?

    Seriously; not the tallest one ... but as not having any (familial) diseases, no allergies, being lactose tolerance, ok in sport and even mentally not the most stupid one. All together? It would be sad/pity to not to have kid(s), would't it? Especially as there will not be too many real platina blonds in the future.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Leliana View Post
    Solutions? Yes, I know 'Man up Leliana!' If that were so easy....
    Just think of all the ways in which the 30-year old Leliana is going to better than the 20-year old Leliana.
    A nation is an organic thing, historically defined.
    A wave of passionate energy which unites past, present and future generations

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  11. #146
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    Quote Originally Posted by SaxonPagan View Post
    Interesting post, Leliana, but this ^ has to be the ultimate in negative thinking
    Uhm yes, castastrophic thought genes run strong in my family at times... It's not that I'm always bothered with ageing, but from time to time you think about your age and the age of the ones you love and grow moody/sentimental. It's normal, just that some people struggle more with lifetime development than others.

    Now me, I'm just 9 years away from my 70th birthday
    But you're closest to 60 and I had never assumed you were of that age, your posts give me a younger impression.


    Quote Originally Posted by velvet View Post
    Had such thoughts a...äh... while ago as well, but the truth is, ignorance is bliss.
    Still wear only black like 30 years ago (damn, I said it), still wear jeans and bandshirts and hoodies because it's just me. Who cares? Just be yourself. Age is just a number.
    Haha, you could be my older sister, we have much in common when it comes to attitude and music... I've got 10 years old bandshirts and still wear them during festival season. And black is colorful enough.

    Quote Originally Posted by Huginn ok Muninn View Post
    People who do not have children worry about aging MUCH more than people who do. Why? Because parents and grandparents have already insured their immortality. They can re-live their youth through their children and grandchildren and know that the IMPORTANT thing, that is, the FAMILY, will go on. There will be younger ones to love them when they are older and mourn and remember them when they are gone. And they will live forever.

    So those of you who do not have kids yet, HAVE THEM. Forget the excuses, especially the money-based ones.
    I agree with all of that, Huginn, but having children isn't a decision you make all alone like going out for a night. You need a partner who's loyal, who's 'father material' and who shares at least most of your ideals and virtues. And not only in a political way btw. Starting a common household in our times is difficult, the struggle begins with renting or buying an appartment or house. The property- & housing market is overrun. The most difficult task is to find a soulmate partner and to build up mutual trust of the highest form, because only then the fundament of the relationship is strong enough to endure the most vile storms. I don't support that 'live sections fellow' thinking. I'm not starting something to think about its end. There shall not be an end but death.

    Tbh, I'm a bit of a burned child when it comes to my former relationships and a certain event. But in hindsight, none of my exes was truly father material. Sure, we all make mistakes and I'm no exception but everything has causes and following reactions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Žoreišar View Post
    Just think of all the ways in which the 30-year old Leliana is going to better than the 20-year old Leliana.
    You've got a point here! The 20-year old Leliana was wiser and better than the 10-year old Leliana, so I assume I should continue with that habit... No, joke aside, I know what you mean and it's right. Life is...or should be...steady improvement in experience, wisdom and competencies.
    Loyal to my hate

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  13. #147
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    Have Humans Hit Their Maximum Lifespan?

    Researchers say 115 years old is the ceiling for most of us—with a few outliers able to live a bit longer

    Maybe some new miracle drug or nanotech solution will help humans live for hundreds of years. But a new study reports bad news for anyone slamming kale smoothies, popping supplements and running up mountainsides with hopes of pushing the limits of human longevity. The human body likely has a natural limit to age, and we’re already pushing against that ceiling, reports Carl Zimmer for The New York Times.

    The study, published in the journal Nature, was based on data from 40 countries in the Human Mortality Database. Lifespan has globally has made huge strides in the last century due to reduced infant mortality, the rise of antibiotics and more. In America people went from living roughly 47 years in 1900 to 79 today.

    But after age 100, all modern advances in healthcare have still not yet improved longevity. “Demographers as well as biologists have contended there is no reason to think that the ongoing increase in maximum lifespan will end soon,” lead author of the study Jan Vijg says in a press release. “But our data strongly suggest that it has already been attained and that this happened in the 1990s.”

    In other words, chances of living to 100 have increased dramatically. After that, there are no drugs, treatments or lifestyle changes than can increase lifespan. Based on detailed information of 534 people who lived into extremely old age, the team found that in the 1960s, the oldest person lived to 111. In the 1990s, the oldest age reached 115, but pushing that upper limit has since stalled. According to their calculations, the average ceiling for human lifespan is 115, and the maximum lifespan is 125.

    There is at least one exception. Frenchwoman Jeanne Calment passed away in 1997 at the age of 122, the oldest officially documented person on record. According to Vign’s calculations, however, she’s an outlier and it’s unlikely we’ll see anyone break that record. “You’d need 10,000 worlds like ours to have the chance that there would be one human who would become 125 years,” he tells Zimmer.

    Henne Holstege from VU University, Amsterdam, who has studied supercentenarians, those who have made it past age 110, tells Nicola Davis at The Guardian that the study makes sense. “There seems to be a wall of mortality that modern medicine cannot overcome,” she says. “If you die from heart disease at 70, then the rest of your body might still be in relatively good health. So, a medical intervention to overcome heart disease can significantly prolong your lifespan. However, in centenarians not just the heart, but all bodily systems, have become aged and frail. If you do not die from heart disease, you die from something else.”

    Not everyone agrees. James W. Vaupel, Director at the Max Planck Institute for Demographic Research in Rostock and head of the Center in Odense, rejects the conclusions of the study, arguing that demographic trends are still going up. “It is disheartening how many times the same mistake can be made in science and published in respectable journals,” he tells Zimmer.

    In fact, a cottage industry has developed in recent years telling people to prepare for almost limitless lifespans. Aubrey de Grey from Cambridge University famously claimed in 2004 that the first person to live to 1,000 was already alive. He believes advances in cellular repair developed by his SENS Research Foundation will end aging as we know it.

    Futurist Ray Kurzweil predicted that technology would merge with humanity and lead to near immortality in his 2006 book The Singularity is Near. While technologies like the gene-editing technique CRISPR and nanoscale machines may one day overcome death, for the time being humans are subject to nature and the incremental improvements of modern medicine.

    “Further progress against infectious and chronic diseases may continue boosting average life expectancy, but not maximum lifespan,” Vijg says in the press release, pointing out that science needs to overcome the genetics that determine lifespan to make any progress. “Perhaps resources now being spent to increase lifespan should instead go to lengthening healthspan—the duration of old age spent in good health.”
    https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart...mit-180960708/

  14. #148
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    Leliana, the best solution for the fear of ageing for a woman is to have childrens. You are still young.

    Quote Originally Posted by Leliana View Post
    You've got a point here! The 20-year old Leliana was wiser and better than the 10-year old Leliana, so I assume I should continue with that habit... No, joke aside, I know what you mean and it's right. Life is...or should be...steady improvement in experience, wisdom and competencies.
    One get old too early and wise too late, but that is the law of life.

    Quote Originally Posted by Huginn ok Muninn View Post
    People who do not have children worry about aging MUCH more than people who do. Why? Because parents and grandparents have already insured their immortality. They can re-live their youth through their children and grandchildren and know that the IMPORTANT thing, that is, the FAMILY, will go on. There will be younger ones to love them when they are older and mourn and remember them when they are gone. And they will live forever.

    So those of you who do not have kids yet, HAVE THEM. Forget the excuses, especially the money-based ones.
    Correct.

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  16. #149
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    Contrary to what others have suggested, Leliana, to solve your despair about aging, please don't listen to them.

    The worst thing you could do is anxiously put the cart before the horse, so-to-speak. If you really desire to have children, you will naturally need to meet and marry the right man first. And if your previous relationships have been as painful as mine were, you're naturally going to be gun shy about trusting men in the future. This is normal, and perfectly ok.

    I eventually met the right man. But I still can't produce healthy children. This doesn't mean my life is meaningless. I have much love to offer, and many interests in life that I enjoy living very much.

    As Gareth has stated before, numerical age is BS. Don't let mere numbers drag you down. You have too much to live for, Leliana. All you need to do is realize this fact.
    Not all in life is at it appears to be.

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  18. #150
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    It's natural to feel somewhat uneasy about aging, since aging is essentially a consequence of accumulation of DNA damages, not to mention the greatest known risk factor for most diseases. Particularly old age is certainly not something to look forward to for those reasons. Hence humanity and particularly the West has invested in combating it the best way they could. And while nowadays the average human lifespan has considerably extended, not to mention the quality of life (it's much easier to be old today than it used to be in the Middle Ages, for instance), medicine has yet to find a solution to completely halt or reverse the effects of aging. Perhaps we're not meant to - as the saying goes, "all came from dust, and to dust shall all return." So coming to terms with aging is also coming to terms with our own mortality, something that's pretty much inevitable. For someone who even remotely enjoys living, it can be pretty daunting to think that all this will cease one day. We are instinctively programmed to avoid death, yet at the same time we are intellectually aware that we may not ultimately escape it. At the same time, focusing too much on it can lead to existential anxieties. What many scientists and researchers have been investing in instead is prolonging the quality of life (or healthspan) as one ages. Incidentally something interesting on this topic TB and I have come across:





    How do I personally feel about aging? I'm currently 34. I feel neither particularly young -- there are certainly times when I miss being in my 20s and bemoan my youth and young adulthood -- but I wouldn't say that I feel particularly old either, eventhough sometimes it does feel like I've seen through a lot in my life and time did seem to pass rather quickly. Just when I think about this forum for example, it's been 15 years... hard to believe sometimes. At times, the problems we face in life can make one feel older, and tired/worn out... but it tends to pass. Other times I feel less "mature" than I should be at my age, particularly from a psychological point of view. I've worked with younger people and sometimes that made me feel a bit "old"-ish, though usually they will assume I'm in my 20s (through that has more to do with appearance, I guess). I also don't dress "like a 30 year old", whatever that means... I just dress the way I like and feel comfortable. If anything, I started introducing new colors and styles in my wardrobe after I turned 30, up to that point I mostly dressed in black. These days, it's much easier to get away with such wardrobe choices than it was in the past, particularly if you live in a city... there are all sort of subcultures from Vikings to goths and living dolls, so nobody is going to frown at a 30 y.o. for wearing a band shirt. Actually, when you remember that some people tattoo the whites of their eyes and fork their tongues, you start to feel normal.

    There's a lot that can be said about the age of 30. It's right on the cusp between young adulthood and middle age. You are still relatively young, but not exactly in your prime anymore. For certain sports, modeling, etc. 30 might be considered slightly towards the old side. For politics, on the other hand, 30 might still be considered young. You are still young enough to be considered physically attractive, but old enough to settle down and have your own family. You are young enough to work and be self-sufficient and old enough to spend as your earnings as you wish. You are young enough to be frustrated with worldly issues but old enough to offer and implement your own solutions. Today's 30 year olds in particular face a variety of issues that other generations may not have faced to the same extent. By the time you turn 30, you are expected to "adult" and "thrive" at everything. One of the early scenes in "13 Going on 30" finds the 13-year-old female protagonist locked inside her closet, literally banging her head against the wall and shrieking, "I wanna be thirty! Thirty and flirty and thriving!" It's no coincidence her assumption is illustrated by a spread in her favorite magazine. Women's media and pop culture are major contributors to the oft-cited narrative that ages 30-39 are a woman's supposed "prime" -- socially, professionally, physically and emotionally. The resulting stereotypes are endless: your 30s are when your true friend group finally crystallizes; when the hours of time and mental energy you've devoted to your career start to pay off; when you learn to take care of (and even love) your body; when you have the best love life; when you figure out who you are, and everything just starts to click. And celebrities seem to be echoing this direction. "Turning 30 was really big for me," Reese Witherspoon, for instance, told Glamour. "I feel better — so much better now than I ever did in my 20s. I am calmer; I know who I am. And as a result, I feel much sexier. I don’t think I realized [in my 20s] that no one else makes you whole… You have to take responsibility for your own happiness. That took me until I was about 31 to know." "This is such a pivotal moment in my life!" Beyoncé told Harper’s Bazaar the year she turned 30. "I'm transitioning as a woman, and I'm finally able to express myself as I am."

    Today's Millennial generation however doesn't always fit this bill. In fact, this generation has earned the name "boomerang" generation or "adult children" due to the fact that many of them are still living with their parents well in their 30s. Due to various socio-economic factors (wages have stagnated, while real estate, medical and child care costs have skyrocketed; incomes today are lower than they were for Gen Xers and Boomers at the same point in their lives), the major milestones in life have changed. Many people in their 30s move back in with their parents after struggling to find stable jobs or in some cases, despite even having well-paid jobs, but not being able to afford rent in certain cities. Many Millennials graduated into the recession, and have to pay off student debts, thus dreams like having kids, getting married and buying a house seem unattainable by the time one has hit 30. Most people in their 30s I know either rent, live with their parents or roommates, very few own their own property and those who do have only made it because of financial support or inheritance from their family. These changes, in turn, have a massive effect on people's social lives. It's fairly difficult to sustain a relationship when living with one's parents or roommates.

    There's a whole book that could be written about the challenges women in their 30s face. We've all heard about the cliché of the semi-tragic single lady who has a meltdown about how she's getting "old", how she may or may not have kids (biological clock starts to tick, she begins to wonder if it's not too late) and possibly even die alone (nowadays, 30 is the age many women begin to think about marriage more seriously). The lyrics of a Lily Allen song describe it quite well: "She's nearly 30 now and … society says her life is already over." The Internet and media are of course also full of such thoughts. Just google "I'm turning 30" and you'll come across a fair share of panicked bloggers -- "I'm turning 30 soon. Any advice to cheer me up?", "I'm 29 And I'm Having This Whole Turning-30 Identity Crisis" or "Why It's Okay To Be Sad About Turning 30". Some call it the quarter-life crisis, a period of insecurity, doubt and disappointment surrounding one's career, relationships and financial situation. It's not just the fear of aging itself though, and the nuisances that come with it -- the wrinkles, the grey hair, the bone aches -- but also a common realization that one is nowhere near where they thought they would be at that age. 30 tends to be the age where people begin to look in retrospect at their lives and have regrets, from small to more significant: the classes they didn't take, the choice of career they didn't make or the nice person they turned down or shied away from when they were younger (aka "the one that got away"). There is also a tendency to compare oneself to others around them, and with how much they've achieved. It's a time one starts to think about leaving some sort of mark or legacy behind. These days, many people advise not to settle down before one's 30s because they could otherwise miss out on living their life to the fullest. While living one's life as a never-ending party may work while one is still 20ish, by the time they turn 30ish they may start to feel out of place. All those sleepless nights, the binge drinking, the sugar & caffeine addiction begin to take their toll on the body and they find it increasingly difficult to do the same things at the same pace, particularly when you have to keep up with those who are younger than you.

    Relationships in particular can be a challenging topic for those in their 30s. Although "Sex and the City"-type of lifestyles are presented as glamorous by the media, in reality many women in their 30s don't find happiness in them. Here the classical question is, as this Millennial feminist would put it "did I wait too long to settle down?". Sadly, the following paragraph describes the effects of feminism on women in their 30s:

    Like many women, I spent most of my 20s wondering if a conventional relationship and family is something that I even want. If you had asked me two years ago about having a family, I would have been like, “Eww, why would I have kids when I could devote my life to more important things, like blogging and attending mediocre sex parties?” But now I’m like: “I’m too lazy to go out. Maybe I should just start a family.” (I guess biology is real?) There comes a point at which eating steak alone at Le Bernadin and winking at strangers no longer feels exciting, and you’d rather actually connect with another human being on a level deeper than “I’m drunk and you’re in front of me.” And one thing that I definitely don’t want is to hit 35 and enter a uterus panic mode.
    Indeed a lot of women my age say it's hard to find a good husband candidate, let alone someone who's willing to commit to the prospect of a serious, long-term relationship. Due to the effects of hormones and their biological clocks, women this age who are still single may start to panic; they know there's only a small window left where they can still conceive naturally and give birth to relatively healthy offspring, so they know they need to take advantage before it's too late. This emergency mode can scare away men, particularly those who are already afraid of commitment for other reasons (such as financial). Put the prospect of children on the table to boot and they might feel cornered like a breeding stallion and run away while they can. Some men actually see unmarried 30+ y.o. women as red flags, and prefer an either younger or older demographic (which means no pressure and deadlines). So being a woman in your 30s who desires marriage and/or children can be a stressful position. You're damned if you do and you're damned if you don't. Not to say that single 30 y.o. men have it easy though. It can be a difficult age because social circles tend to dry up (you're no longer in school or university, you might not have a lot of time outside of work) and dating apps might be a challenge for those who are interested in something serious only.

    My own perspective as someone who has gone through the quarter-life crisis and felt the same way about turning 30 is that things look less grim after you get past that milestone. I also started to freak out after my 28th birthday and my 30th felt more like a funeral. Yes, it can be scary, but in a way it's strangely also liberating. Once you actually turn 30, you get the realization that you're still you, there's no magical wisdom that you acquire overnight and on the bright side, you have 10 more years until you're 40. While you're not exactly youth anymore, you're still relatively young, at least younger than a 40 year old. It's relatively normal to feel conflicted when approaching milestones, but one shouldn't dwell too much on that feeling. We cannot turn back time and change what had already been, we can only look forward to the future. When one thinks about it, the average human only lives about 30.000 days. The older one is, the more of that time they'll already have used up. If you're in your 30s, that's around 35%, and while it's something you'll never get back, you can enjoy and appreciate what you have left. In truth, there is no limit in regards to age when it comes to starting anew or catching up on one's goals. For example, if you are single and in your 30s, you might find this article encouraging. If your worries are about starting your own company or becoming self-employed, well,entrepreneurship has no age. There are certainly many inspirational examples of people who have thrived at a later stage in life. This however doesn't mean that one should ideally postpone their milestones.

    Personally, I feel I'm quite lucky to have a wonderful, supportive partner and finally understand the words of my mother when she said something along the lines of "everything is easier in two's". If you have the right person beside you, it's much easier to pass through life and pursue your goals and dreams, regardless if you are 20, 30, 40 or 50. I suppose that since I'm not single I worry less about turning heads on the streets (although I haven't fallen into the other extreme either and still want to look nice, dress up for him etc.) but I do care about health. I do know a few people who are in their 70s and 80s and have relatively few health problems -- my mother-in-law for example is in her early 80s and still drives, does gardening, walks her dogs, socializes etc. as if she were a 50 year old -- that's something I wouldn't mind (probably won't be me though, we sometimes joke she will outlive me). Frankly though, I wouldn't mind living a shorter life that had a certain quality to it than reaching a certain age but spending the last 10-20 years of my life in hospital beds, hooked to tubes and the like. Old age diseases like dementia and Alzheimer's aren't something I'd look forward to either. Having some sort of spiritual element in your life and relationship also helps. When your connection is not only based on the physical, it's less likely that you'll find yourself dumped one day and replaced with a younger version. I guess this is a common fear as one gets old, particularly nowadays as we live in a shallow, materialistic society with a decayed soul and values, where people are encouraged to become plastic, quite literally. You even see women in their 20s or younger resorting to botox, lifts and fillers, everybody wants to look as young as possible.

    Another reason people tend to fear aging is due to societal factors. Elders used to be the symbol of patience, experience and wisdom, values that society held in high regard. They were, and in certain cultures still remained, the centerpieces of the tribe. Certain social and political positions for example were only made available to those who reached a certain age. Nowadays such values are shortchanged for soundbites, punchlines, and hashtags. Aged care failures show how little society regards them, as well as those who care for them. Modern people have an expiry date in society but this is not the date of their death, rather a time when their skills and knowledge are no longer considered to be valid or useful. In today's automated, materialistic society, one's value is directly determined by their economic contributions to society. When you get old you are no longer a producer, just a husk to be discarded because you have no more value according to this model. Particularly in the West we value independence and fear dependency, invisibility and dying. Aged care is a silo of these fears. And until it affects us personally, we tend to ignore it. As we begin to age, we fear becoming a burden on our loved ones, on those around us and on society. It takes a certain amount of patience to care for an elder, as certain tasks are difficult for them to perform on their own. Also, the elderly might enjoy having long and meaningful conversations, which today's youth haven't been taught to appreciate. Back in the day, the elders would sit around a fire and impart their wisdom, reflecting on the "good old days" while the younger would take in as much as they could and learn something from their stories. Nowadays the youth are conditioned to believe they have everything figured out, so they believe have no use for the outdated stories of the elderly. Negative stereotyping of the elderly is also reinforced by the media, where youth and the outward appearance, physical attractiveness is synonymous with beauty. Quite sad.

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