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Thread: If not 'Neo-Danubians', then what?

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    Question If not 'Neo-Danubians', then what?

    I have read lately that some people do not believe in a Neo-Danubian classification. If this is true, then what would those people who have previously been classified as ND be? For example, the people on Nordish.com? What type or types would they fit into if not Neo-Danubian?
    "I do not know what horrified me most at that time: the economic misery of my companions, their moral and ethical coarseness, or the low level of their intellectual development." Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf

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    Post Re: Neo-Danubians?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer
    I have read lately that some people do not believe in a Neo-Danubian classification. If this is true, then what would those people who have previously been classified as ND be? For example, the people on Nordish.com? What type or types would they fit into if not Neo-Danubian?
    Good question! I tend to agree with the grandiosely named 'Society for Nordish Physical Anthropology' on this issue and would certainly be interested in hearing what other ideas are out there. Here is the definition of neo-danubians according to that site
    Danubian proto-Nordic altered by the semi-mongolid Ladogan racial type of the northeastern forests. This type was brought westward from the Volga country with the migrations of the Baltic Finns during the centuries immediately preceding and after the time of Christ. Today it presents a variable but easily recognizable phenotype of eastern Europe.
    along with some pics http://www.fikas.no/~sprocket/snpa/index2.htm
    (I disagree that Nastassja Kinski who is also shown as representative of neo-danubians is of the same type)






    Are you sure that people disagree with classifying these people as neo-danubians, however? I think there might be some objections to claims that this type is typical for the Polish. Again, I would emphatically agree that it is not.

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    Post Re: Neo-Danubians?

    When I look at pictures of certain Slavic groups, especially central and eastern Polish, Byelorussian, Slovak, and some Ukrainian groups, as well as some Finno-Ugric groups, I see among them people who look Danubian + Ladogan. You can call this type whatever name you want to, but it does exists. There are also a small number of Czechs, Hungarians, Bulgarians, Romanians, Slovenes and even east-central Germans and eastern Austrians who belong to the same type. It may be similar to, or overlap with other designations, such as Gorid or Vistulian.
    The East-Baltic race, which occurs in the Baltic nations, northern Poland and parts of Finland, and to a lesser degree in northeast Germany, is Ladogan (or Neo-Danubian) + Borreby, and in some regions Corded or Nordic.

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    Post Re: Neo-Danubians?

    Lundman also saw a relation between Borreby and East-Baltic.

    Lundman (Nordens Rastyper, 1940) wrote, "Vi återgå nu till Danmark. Liknande dem i Mecklenburg, ehuru mindre primitiva äro några fynd från Danmarks yngre stenålder (med Skåne, som denna tid i allo hörde ihop med Danmark). Det är den s. k. Borrebytypen som, ehuru i allmänhet mycket uppblandad, influerat på typen hos en stor del av de från denna tid över 200 bevarade stenålderskallarna. Borrebytypen är tydligen närbesläktat med i Östbaltikum funna stenålderstyper, ur vilka den ostbaltiska rasen framgått. Danska stenåldersfolkets huvudmassa hörde dock knappast hit."

    My translation of the quote above from Swedish to English:

    We now return to Denmark. Similar to them in Mecklenburg, albeit less primitive are some discoveries from Denmark's younger Ston Age (with Skåne, which at this time belonged to Denmark in all ways). It is the so-called Borreby type that, although generally speaking very hybridised, influenced
    the type among a large part of the from this time over 200 preserved Stone Age skulls. The Borreby type is evidently closely-related with in the East Baltic found Ston Age types, that out of the East Baltic race come about. Nevertheless, the Danish Stone Age folk's main mass hardly belonged here.

    As for the Neo-Danubian, the facial morphology is very Gorid (short - and high-skulled) looking. Gorid is present in Southwestern Poland and Czech Rep., and the type is short, stocky and dark (but light eyes are not uncommon). I do not know how numerous the look is, or exactly how it arised, but there is something there. The type is also somewhat similar to Biasutti's Carpathian example of Baltic (East-Baltic). There is a woman (with a Slavic accent) on CNN International who has this look. I forgot her name. I would say that the look even exist in parts of Ukraine (Chernigov in the north is supposedly Gorid land), but not among Great Russians or Northern Poles.
    Last edited by Glenlivet; Saturday, October 16th, 2004 at 08:19 AM.

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