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Thread: Operation Valkyrie (20 July Plot)

  1. #31
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    Churchill wanted to drop anthrax on Germany and started the bombing of civilians. I wouldn't believe him if he said the sky was blue.

  2. #32
    Senior Member Dani's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Astragoth View Post
    Churchill wanted to drop anthrax on Germany and started the bombing of civilians. I wouldn't believe him if he said the sky was blue.
    That's completely untrue (by now it's fairly obvious you use every opportunity to slander Brits). The British government stated in August 1939 that it's policy was:

    not to initiate air action which might involve the risk of civilian casualties
    This policy was rescinded on the 15th of May 1940, the day after the Luftwaffe bombed the Dutch city of Rotterdam:



    This was not the first civilian target hit by the Luftwaffe. They had engaged in bombing raids months earlier during the war against Poland. The city of Wielun (no strategic value) was hit with a raid, as was Warsaw:



    The Germans used civilian bombing first. That is a historical fact.

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  4. #33
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    The Brits were bombing German targets for six months before the Germans retaliated.

  5. #34
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    From what I've gathered, a lone German bomber over England lost its way and inadvertently bombed a residential area, thus igniting the deliberate targeting of civilian populations on both sides. But the following account by Richard Overy details his perspective on this highly controversial matter:

    "Martialling his facts with dexterity Overy argues that bombing in Europe was never a war-winning strategy and invariably caused more harm than good. In what is the first full narrative of the bombing war in Europe Overy’s scope is incredibly broad and well-researched, also highly readable. He tackles not only the wider conflict with Germany but little-known bombing wars in France and Italy, which in both cases resulted in civilian casualties the equal of the Blitz."

    https://www.spectator.co.uk/2013/10/...-overy-review/
    “A dying culture invariably exhibits personal rudeness. Bad manners. Lack of consideration for others in minor matters. A loss of politeness, of gentle manners, is more significant than is a riot.” Robert A. Heinlein

  6. #35
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    Germany did strategic bombardments against civilian targets first in WW2 (on an infinitely smaller scale than the allies would do later on), but that's not the reason why the British Empire bombed German cities. Why escalate the situation because of Rotterdam and Warsaw, neither being British cities? Churchill was fed up with Chamberlain's policy of dropping leaflets with propaganda over Germany and was itching for a chance to start a strategic bombing campaign to do some real damage, and in part, and not in the least, because the Luftwaffe came dangerously close to overwhelming the R.A.F. and putting it out of action with its raids against military installations and Britain's air defense system during the Battle of England. So when a few disoriented German bombers accidently dropped a few bombs on Belfast, the Brits tried to provoke the Luftwaffe to switch its focus from military to civilian targets by staging air raids over German cities, and it worked - the Germans began bombing major British cities and the R.A.F. could recover. Bomber Command's own air campaign was largely ineffective until 1943, nevertheless.

    Furthermore, the Brits possessed a fleet of strategic bombers, the Germans had none and would develop very little in the way of strategic bombers even at the height of the war. All strategic German aerial bombardments were done with tactical bombers and rockets. Strategic air raids were a British and American trump card (just like submarines in the Atlantic were a German trump card), one the Brits could not play as long as aerial bombardments on urban areas were off the table - and Britain didn't have much else to hit Germany with in 1940, except for commando actions along the Atlantic coast and its own naval blockade. Surely the fact that you possess a nice shiny weapon makes you want to use it as well in total war, any chance will do.
    "To the meaningless French idealisms: Liberty, Equality and Fraternity, we propose the three German realities: Infantry, Cavalry, and Artillery." - Prince Bernhard von Bülow

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dani View Post
    That sounds counter-productive to me. Nationalism is based off of cooperation and a feeling of unity, not hyper-individualism. Hyper-individualism is literally toxic to winning political power.
    All ideologies are based on cooperation and ideals of unity, that is nothing impressive. No different from what animals do when they have a common interest or a shared threat.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dani View Post
    You very well could be or perhaps you genuinely believe what you are writing. Either way, I am not going to take back anything I said. Hitlerism is toxic and it has no place in the Anglosphere.
    Why is it toxic?

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