The Germani: Germanic Peoples Origins and History

[Rodskarl Dubhgall]

I meant that I hadn't studied Caucasians and Dravidians--thanks for jogging my memory, but if Basques are R1b, that hardly distinguishes them. I think this means that they are almost entirely assimilated, being non-Indo-European in name only. Basically, it is said that Nordic and Mediterranean have a common subracial and Y DNA origin, but there are no linguistic correlations. On the other hand, R1 occupy the middle ground in what would ostensibly be Alpine territory. Furthermore, R1a and R1b are so obviously correlated by the Satem and Centum isogloss. A Y-DNA map pretty much shows that R and I occupy Indo-European lands. N is also racially "White", but I'm not sure about the other ones, if they overlap with Turks, Semites or whatever.

[Rodskarl Dubhgall]

It would be demographically accurate to compare the Boii with British Celts, as peripherally assimilated Germanics. It's hard to see any real Celtic populations, in the manner of existence one would attribute to distinct identities. When the core Germanic populations of Deutschland and England are trimmed down to exclude Celts, neither Bavarian nor Scot are there, but the latter still retain Germanic heritage otherwise.

Then again, what is Celtic about Friesland, Saxony, England and Jutland, without undermining the entire West Germanic branch's legitimacy? Are only I Y-DNA holders of North Germanic, the true Germanic? Therefore, the R1b component of West Germanic is thereby calling into question the rationale for a relationship other than what is considered to be the Celtic fringe.

Perhaps, the so-called Germanic substrate is the genetic legacy of true Germanics in Scandinavia, which means that this forum, for instance, is seriously skewed against the inclusion of say, Irish (equivalent of Austrian) and Breton (equivalent of Bohemian), but does not quite satisfy a sizeable Scandinavian membership, as they would prefer interactions with N Y-DNA members on other "Nordic" fora. In the end, a place like Skadi seems to be caught in an identitarian quandary, primarily West Germanic and neither, yet both, Celtic and North Germanic.

[Aelfgar]

I think it is safe to say that the early Iron Age peoples of northwestern Europe where of a very similar racial stock. Then the people around Denmark developed a slightly more sophisticated culture. It was the avoidance of the Roman Empire that helped a lot to give the Germanics a separate identity to the Irish, Britons and northern Gauls.

[Rodskarl Dubhgall]

Celts were on the Atlantic front lines alongside the Mediterranean Greco-Roman populations, whereas Germans were restricted to the interior seas and surrounded by buffer peoples. There was no direct line between Germania and the outside world.