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Thread: A New Forum for German Nationalists

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nachtengel View Post
    It really depends. Is that person posting in German or in English? Are they German born or dual citizens, linked to Germany somehow? Are they involved in moderation or administration? Are they a regular, posting a lot, is their material making an impact? etc. Are they posting related to WWII, NS, the Holocaust (especially the latter)? Is there evidence they surfed/posted from Germany during their visits?
    Legally, it doesn't depend on anything but whether Germany, Austria or any other European country can claim jurisdiction.

    They can claim jurisdiction if a foreign website can be accessed in their countries. They also can claim jurisdiction if a foreign newspaper has also readers in their countries.

    All this did happen already, as you have pointed out earlier.

    Dr. Toben, an Australian citizen, published a revisionist site from Australia on an Australian (or American) web server, but was arrested when flying to Germany and sentenced (to 9 months of imprisonment, I believe). The reasoning was that his website can also be read in Germany.

    Gerhard Lauck, a US citizen, published a National-Socialist newspaper in the United States, but was arrested when flying to Denmark, then extradited to Germany where he was sentenced to 5 years of imprisonment. The reasoning was that he had sent copies of his newspaper to customers in Germany.

    Legally seen, it is irrelevant whether someone is a dual citizen or whether someone publishes his material in English, German or any other language. Robert Hepp was sentenced for having published a small academic footnote in Latin. I am not kidding.

    But if someone is a citizen of a certain country (dual or not) and he resides in it, this country will typically not extradite him to another country; so as long as he doesn't travel internationally, he is safe.

    However, I am not aware of a single case by either Austria, Germany or Switzerland (or any other country in Europe where English is not an official language) where non-citizens (or even citizens or residents) would have been sentenced for publishing information in English.

    But this is just a 'tolerance.' Legally seen, there is no law or international treaty that could stop the authorities from countries like Germany to issue warrants against any American, Australian, Canadian, British or Irish national who breaks German law by publishing opinions or facts on the Internet in any language, even if he does it in English and from his own country. A European warrant could be issued, thus such suspects would be arrested in any member state of the European Union if they traveled to it.

    So far this has never been done for English-language websites by countries like Germany, but that's probably just because English-language sites usually don't have a large followership in Germany, so nobody really cares too much about them. Antifascists don't report them, the Greens and the Linke in parliament don't complain about them, the local Jews don't whine about them, etc.

    And maybe because the prosecutors and the police are not too keen on working with English-language information, I would guess. Everything would have to be translated into the official language (German), the accuracy of the translation could be disputed at court, etc.

    Information in German is naturally far more important for countries where German is the official language because these countries care primarily about keeping their own electorate dumb and uninformed so that the leftists and multiculturalists in government get re-elected.

    German-language websites, no matter where they are hosted, are regularly reported to the police by anti-fascists, thus criminal court cases are opened. Leftist members of parliament make inquiries about such sites and complain that the gov't is incompetent or not dedicated enough in its fight against Nazis, right-wing extremists, anti-Semites, and Holocaust deniers. Jewish and anti-racist organizations do their 'lobbying' and 'informal talks.' Eventually, the government, diplomatical channels, and secret organizations will get involved.

    Any dirty trick will be used to get these people extradited or arrested; even if it means to pretend that INS citations were served which factually never were served so that the people can be arrested in the U.S. for ignoring these very citations (which neither they nor their attornies had ever received); as it happened in both the cases of Germar Rudolf and Ernst Zündel.

    Eventually, after having been held for nearly a year in custody by the INS and by other U.S. authorities, Ernst Zündel was extradited to Canada, where he was arrested again and spent two years in anti-terror detention. Finally, he was extradited to Germany where he served five years in a German high-security penitentiary for "having denied the Holocaust."

    As mentioned, we are run by total psychopaths. They would shoot us all without hesitation, as the Communists did in Soviet Russia if their control would be total and if they were convinced they would get away with it.
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  3. #12
    Senior Member Aelfgar's Avatar
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    Suppose someone had a website selling T-shirts featuring designs with swastikas or other symbols banned in Germany. Could the website/company owner and/or designer be extradited?

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    The better question is: Why would anyone want to sell T-shirts with Swastikas? I would hope that any sane Preservationist, whether sympathetic to NS or not, would not seek to bring his points across in such a crude fashion.
    -In kalte Schatten versunken... /Germaniens Volk erstarrt / Gefroren von Lügen / In denen die Welt verharrt-
    -Die alte Seele trauernd und verlassen / Verblassend in einer erklärbaren Welt / Schwebend in einem Dunst der Wehmut / Ein Schrei der nur unmerklich gellt-
    -Auch ich verspüre Demut / Vor dem alten Geiste der Ahnen / Wird es mir vergönnt sein / Gen Walhalla aufzufahren?-

    (Heimdalls Wacht, In kalte Schatten versunken, stanzas 4-6)

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  6. #14
    Senior Member Aelfgar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sigurd View Post
    The better question is: Why would anyone want to sell T-shirts with Swastikas? I would hope that any sane Preservationist, whether sympathetic to NS or not, would not seek to bring his points across in such a crude fashion.
    So would I, but you might be surprised about such cases: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-40848372

    The censorship of symbols in Germany is quite extreme though isn't it? Not only is the Swatika banned (which is not unreasonable) but Nordic runes as well. Not many people outside nationalist circles would recognise even the Odal rune.

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    I think symbolism of any kind that evokes negativity in those we want to awaken should be overtly disregarded.

    In fact, any kind of imagery, attitudes, gestures, or semantics that are clearly counterproductive should be overtly avoided. How we choose to behave in this respect, and what we choose to display in private is our business, of course.

    To win hearts and minds these days requires a whole new set of psychological tactics.
    Aside from an ever increasing number of mortals who have willfully chosen to worship Satan and his minions, our battle has always been against the powers and principalities operating surreptitiously throughout this twisted world.

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  10. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thorburn View Post
    Legally, it doesn't depend on anything but whether Germany, Austria or any other European country can claim jurisdiction.

    They can claim jurisdiction if a foreign website can be accessed in their countries. They also can claim jurisdiction if a foreign newspaper has also readers in their countries.
    I think you are right. According to Austrian and German law (and most of the other European countries' law, I suppose) to commit an internet crime or an ordinary crime (e.g. newspaper) it is not important in which country the server is located or the newspaper is published. The main question is: can the postings or articles be received and read in Austria and Germany no matter where the writer of the postings or articles resides at the moment of posting or writing.

    If it is so and the content of the postings and articles violates German or Austrian law, the writer is punishable according to Austrian and /or German law no matter from which part of the earth he has posted the emails or where on earth he has written or published the newspaper.

    Irrelevant, too is the citizenship of the writer or poster and - basically - the language he has used. But German and Austrian authorities generally neither prosecute foreigners because of their postings or articles, written abroad, nor do they charge somebody for non German postings. The reason for that is that these authorities deny a "general competence" for themselves. They think they are not competent for the persecution of crimes, committed by foreigners all over the world. They want to be entitled to choose whether they charge sb of the commission of a crime or not. They do it, when " it appears right to do so".

    The history of German & Austrian internet crimes especially on Holocaust denial (the cases Toben, Zündel, etc.) and the ruling of Austrian courts is very clearly characterized in the German essay:
    http://www.rechtsprobleme.at/doks/pr...strafrecht.pdf
    If you understand German, you should read it.
    "Denk ich an Deutschland in der Nacht, dann bin ich um den Schlaf gebracht. Ich kann die Augen nicht mehr schließen und meine heißen Tränen fließen!" (Heinrich Heine, "Nachtgedanken")

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    ariovist forum empty

    I have registered there some time ago.

    There is actually not much going on there.

    The main legal protection seems to be that the site (Stätte)
    being hosted offshore -- whatever that means.

    Today I tried to access the site, but the forum software or database
    seems to be disconnected from the server binary.

    "Can not access / on this server" : '/' means toplevel directory of
    the directory structure the server is configured to point to on a Linux OS;
    as to "/var/www/" for example.

    Either there is a software change going on there,
    or the site is abandoned by it's creators ( rm -rf /var/www ) .
    Mk 10:18 What do you call me a good master, no-one is good .

  12. #18
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    So it is dead, befor it start living. but i cant find any reasons or statements. there was potencial, but nearly nobody who interparcipate with the possibilities. anyway: any things known about the shutdown?
    with kind regards/ Mit bestem Gruß,

    Matze

  13. #19
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    It looks like it has a RIPE IP Address (185.165.168.12), so it was hosted in Europe after all.

    The host is reporting Account Suspended so, the provider has turned it off.

    Silly to host something like that in Europe, unless it was a honey pot.

  14. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hammish View Post
    It looks like it has a RIPE IP Address (185.165.168.12), so it was hosted in Europe after all.

    The host is reporting Account Suspended so, the provider has turned it off.

    Silly to host something like that in Europe, unless it was a honey pot.
    Where do you think hosting would be safe from persecution?

    Didn't keep myself busy with hosting for a long time.

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