Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 12

Thread: Why Do Women Overrate Themselves?

  1. #1
    Account Inactive Skerritt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Last Online
    Saturday, August 12th, 2017 @ 12:49 PM
    Ethnicity
    English
    Ancestry
    Old English & Norman
    Subrace
    North-Atlantid
    Y-DNA
    i
    Country
    England England
    Gender
    Age
    41
    Posts
    541
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    1
    Thanked in
    1 Post

    Why Do Women Overrate Themselves?

    Most men understand it when the most attractive, model-looking women consider themselves too good for the average-looking joe. Because, in short, they are, and few men have much of a problem with that. Where men get confused and irritated is when a woman who is manifestly NOT too good for them by any reasonable objective metric acts as if she genuinely believes that she is. The reason is exactly as Occam's Razor suggests. She does. And here's why.

    Women have a strong preference to date and mate up. Men, on the other hand, are much more inclined to date broad-spectrum and even mate down. And while most men understand that the definition of "up" varies according to sex - men placing extra value on looks and sexual history, women placing emphasis on social status and wealth - they don't understand the logical consequences of women dating up and men dating down. And these consequences are further exacerbated by men generally being the pursuers and women the pursued.

    Look at it this way. A woman who manages to attract the passing attention of a higher-status handsome man, even if she does so through taking the role of the pursuer, is quite reasonably, if incorrectly, inclined to consider herself worthy of the attentions of higher status men in the future despite the declining marginal utility of her youth and sexual history. This is why a woman will always identify her status by the football star, the surgeon, or the singer in the band with whom she once spent a few hours rather than by the nondescript fellow who worked in Tandy electrical and was her boyfriend for several years, regardless of how long ago it was. Roissy had an amusing post about a woman who had dated Anthony Kiedis a long time ago and actually carried around pictures of them in order to show them to people she had just met.

    This creates an essentially Austrian problem of false signals leading to malinvestment. Because women do not distinguish between the quantity of male attention and the quality, the conflation encourages them to a) overrate their own attractiveness, and, b) invest their time and attention in men who are not likely to have any interest in them beyond the immediate term. So, the female 5 considers herself an 7 or 8 by virtue of the times that a male 8 decided that she was the best available at the moment, and quite logically feels insulted when she is approached by a male 5. Meanwhile, the male 5 is standing there in astonishment, staring at what he believes is quite clearly an appropriate counterpart and wondering who in the world she thinks she is.

    What this means is that thanks to modern hook-up culture, the average woman now tends to consider herself a 7 or 8 rather than a 5, which is one of the many social factors that make it hard for her to eventually "settle".

  2. #2
    The lion's gate Chlodovech's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Last Online
    3 Days Ago @ 06:33 AM
    Ethnicity
    Flemish
    Ancestry
    Frankish
    Country
    Holy Roman Empire Holy Roman Empire
    Gender
    Politics
    Völkisch traditionalist
    Religion
    Catholic
    Posts
    3,242
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    1,547
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    2,664
    Thanked in
    1,169 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Skerritt View Post
    What this means is that thanks to modern hook-up culture, the average woman now tends to consider herself a 7 or 8 rather than a 5, which is one of the many social factors that make it hard for her to eventually "settle".
    Great insights, this is a genuine issue. This is not misogyny and it has nothing to do with hating women at all - a woman who reads Skerritt's post may feel insulted, but she really shouldn't, it would be a mistake. As men we must wisen up a little because a great group amongst us feel like they're totally failing at life at this point. And I'm glad there are other men who care enough to inform their fellow men, so we can learn and apply this knowledge in our personal lives.

    Half a century of feminism and romantic movies have distorted our views of women and relationships: we do it wrong. And it's those men who don't realize what they're doing wrong who are the most frustrated and bitter - and definitely single - not the ones who are "red pilled". The red pill is the only thing that will shield us men and remove our illusions, because traditional gender roles and the system that maintained them are are dead. Men from 1850 didn't have to be as aware of how women think, feel and what they want as we do now, because hey, they were going to marry and have children anyway, tradition and the Lord demanded it. We on the other hand need to be properly educated on women & relationships or things are going to get completely out of hand. Unlike MGTOWs though, who see the red pill as the justification for remaining single forever, I suggest to use our growing understanding of women when we are in a relationship or seeking one. I also think that women need this famous red pill as much as we do, the more aware they are of how men think and evaluate women, and the more they know about their own natural urges, the more control they will have of their own lives. An intelligent woman will understand.

    An issue Skerritt didn't touch upon in this post, but is still related enough to mention, is what happens to that woman who is a 5 when she tries to settle afer she's 30. Many don't, they eventually hit the wall when they're 35 and they become depressed feminist cat ladies or something equally repugnant, deeply unhappy and unsatisfied. But those 5s Skerritt spoke of who do settle, they eventually settle for a male 5 unless a miracle happens. But they may have another option. They can can contact that male 6 they dated when they were 25 and try to rekindle an old flame, but if that's no longer possible, and no miracles happen, only two paths are still available to her: marrying a male 5, which becomes more difficult every year since her value as a mate goes down (can she still even be considered a 5 herself? Perhaps, it depends...), not up. If she doesn't marry a 5 however, she'll become a depressed man hating harridan or an equivalent thereof.

    I could say I wish I would've known all of this sooner, like back when I was in my early twenties - but I don't think I would've understood ... if had I would've made very different choices and I would've been able to separate the wheat from the chaff.

    But you really have to go through all the misery yourself to fully realize the ugly truth, you need to have been in a few relationships, you must've experienced painful rejection, you need to have a history of interacting with women in all kinds of places and situations, you must have matured or you won't get it at all. Only then you can fully begin to grasp the full drama of the destruction of the Christian social order. Truth be told, maybe younger men can come earlier to the same conclusion as I did by being in several more or less serious relationships when they're 20-25 - if that is even (still) possible - yet most men only arrived at this conclusion when they're 30+, which is the case for me, and perhaps the fact that I've only been in a few actual relationships is a reason for this. I'm not sure, just throwing it out there.

    As always: love patriarchy and power structures, hate feminism.
    "If we were going to stand in darkness, best we stand in a darkness we had made ourselves.” ― Douglas Coupland, Shampoo Planet

  3. #3
    Funding Member
    "Friend of Germanics"
    Skadi Funding Member


    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Last Online
    @
    Ethnicity
    Germanic
    Gender
    Posts
    841
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    78
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    115
    Thanked in
    45 Posts
    Successful males overrate themselves as well; that's an important factor for their success. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy. If you want an 8, act like you're a 9 at least. Obviously this is more difficult if you have very little to offer, but it's not impossible.

  4. #4
    Funding Member
    "Friend of Germanics"
    Skadi Funding Member

    Æmeric's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Last Online
    @
    Ethnicity
    Anglo-American
    Ancestry
    Britain, Ulster, Germany, America
    Subrace
    Dalofaelid+Baltid/Borreby
    Y-DNA
    R-Z19
    mtDNA
    U5a2c
    Country
    United States United States
    State
    Indiana Indiana
    Gender
    Age
    57
    Family
    Married
    Politics
    Anti-Obama
    Religion
    Conservative Protestantism
    Posts
    6,275
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    575
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    527
    Thanked in
    232 Posts
    I don't know if marrying up is as common as it use to be. And it likely wasn't as common as people think it was. 60 years ago a woman could be a secretary, meet eligible, college educated men through work and marry up. Now a man with an advance degree is much more likely to marry someone who also has an advance degree. And that someone is likely from the same social/economic background in order to have the financial and family encouragement to obtain that degree. Of course hot looking woman still have an advantage but because of the changing attitudes toward sex most men would balk at the idea at marrying an attractive woman just for sex when so many others are offering it casually.

    An interesting film on the subject is "An Officer and a Gentlemen" from 1982. I found the film interesting because I was in the Navy at the time and had done my mess-crank duty (basically being a steward for three months) in the wardroom (officer's country) of my ship. Many of those officers were trust-fund kids, others were/and came from families with a long tradition of military service (as officers), many had Roman Numerals after their names. And while that film was popular onboard (the studios would send prints of their films out to the fleet for viewing on ships while underway) it was laughable that any of those officers would consider marrying some factory girl. The only officers that might have a wife from a bluecollar background would be the ones who came in as enlisted, married and then obtain college degrees through a commissioning program. Not all officers are created equally from a social point-of-view. Back in the day not having a wife with the right background would be a major impediment to career advancement.

  5. #5
    Proffessional Hickerbilly
    "Friend of Germanics"
    Skadi Funding Member

    SpearBrave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Last Online
    @
    Status
    Available
    Ethnicity
    American of German decent
    Ancestry
    Bavaria/Switzerland
    Country
    Other Other
    State
    Kentucky Kentucky
    Location
    Central
    Gender
    Age
    53
    Zodiac Sign
    Libra
    Family
    Married
    Occupation
    Kunstschmiede
    Politics
    Self-Reliance
    Religion
    Asatru
    Posts
    4,573
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    2,794
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    1,313
    Thanked in
    610 Posts
    Interesting, I always thought most women underrated themselves. True there are some women who do it fishing for compliments in a relationship ie. " Am I getting fat " or " My hair is horrible " but overall I always thought women underrate themselves not overrate themselves.
    Life is like a fire hydrant- sometimes you help people put out their fires, but most of the time you just get peed on by every dog in the neighborhood.

  6. #6
    Moderator "Friend of Germanics"
    Skadi Funding Member

    Sigurd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Last Online
    2 Weeks Ago @ 08:14 PM
    Status
    Available
    Ethnicity
    German
    Ancestry
    Bavarii, Saxones, Suebi, Alamanni
    Subrace
    Borreby + Atlantonordoid
    Country
    Germany Germany
    Location
    Einöde in den Alpen
    Gender
    Age
    31
    Zodiac Sign
    Libra
    Family
    Engaged
    Politics
    Tradition & Homeland
    Religion
    Odinist
    Posts
    9,110
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    73
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    219
    Thanked in
    128 Posts
    The better question is: why do some men seek to spoil all the fun?

    This thread looks at some of the more philosophical questions about 'dating up' or 'dating down' and thus has its merit. As such, I'm going to pre-emptively ask that this thread stay civil, philosophical and productive.

    I'm going to say this blunt: What I do want is a good conversation about a topic that's bugged every other man at some point in their lives. What I don't want on the other hand is another array of single men in their thirties moaning about how 'evil' women are for 'not taking Average Joe' (most of the women aboard DID go for completely normal, level-headed men).

    In my experience, after all, moaning about the supposed evilness of women alienates women both from a social circle and/or from the men who complain too much (I remember some guy on YouTube once slagged women off in 35 points and #29 was that women 'complained too much', hypocrisy much? ).

    At any rate, this type of conversation isn't doing the complainers much favour. It is a place for Germanic preservation, not a place to ask the question why women aren't preserving their genes with THEM at the rate of three times a week. The answer is imminent: Traditional girls like traditional men, and traditional men don't complain about everything. In fact, your dream girl might register any given moment but might be taken aback at your complaining.

    Not many women are active in Nationalist circles to begin with and part of this is undoubtedly because there's so many losers finding a home in our cause, making it seem like a lost cause. That already makes for a lop sided hunting pool, let's perhaps not scare the rest away by coming across like folks are embittered and/or creepy, it's bound to become a perpetuum mobile.
    -In kalte Schatten versunken... /Germaniens Volk erstarrt / Gefroren von Lügen / In denen die Welt verharrt-
    -Die alte Seele trauernd und verlassen / Verblassend in einer erklärbaren Welt / Schwebend in einem Dunst der Wehmut / Ein Schrei der nur unmerklich gellt-
    -Auch ich verspüre Demut / Vor dem alten Geiste der Ahnen / Wird es mir vergönnt sein / Gen Walhalla aufzufahren?-

    (Heimdalls Wacht, In kalte Schatten versunken, stanzas 4-6)

  7. #7
    Funding Member
    "Friend of Germanics"
    Skadi Funding Member

    Idis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Last Online
    @
    Ethnicity
    Anglo-American
    Ancestry
    Dutch, Low German & French
    Country
    United States United States
    Gender
    Age
    30
    Family
    Married parent
    Politics
    Free & Libertarian
    Religion
    Cultural Christian
    Posts
    139
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    86
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    123
    Thanked in
    53 Posts
    I don't think that this is a condition specific to women, many men also overrate themselves. In my experience, I rather agree with SpearBrave, I've noticed many women who underrate themselves and suffer from serious self image issues. It doesn't help that the media pushes a certain "ideal woman" image that simply cannot be met, not by simply being yourself anyway.

    Also, perhaps this is just me, but I find the "rating" scale to be extremely shallow, not to mention immature. Life is not a "hot or not" competition.

  8. #8
    The lion's gate Chlodovech's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Last Online
    3 Days Ago @ 06:33 AM
    Ethnicity
    Flemish
    Ancestry
    Frankish
    Country
    Holy Roman Empire Holy Roman Empire
    Gender
    Politics
    Völkisch traditionalist
    Religion
    Catholic
    Posts
    3,242
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    1,547
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    2,664
    Thanked in
    1,169 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Idis View Post
    I don't think that this is a condition specific to women, many men also overrate themselves.
    Absolutely, but a man has to be confident and delude himself a little to be even remotely attractive to a woman. That's our excuse.

    Also, perhaps this is just me, but I find the "rating" scale to be extremely shallow, not to mention immature. Life is not a "hot or not" competition.
    Perhaps a little, but the rating scale is useful and brutally honest - and much science. It's about far more than looks unless explicitly stated otherwise. I think the opponents of this practice need to look at it from a different perspective. It's nothing but a device to rapidly explain a somewhat difficult thing to a broad audience. After all, women and men know what is meant by being a "perfect 10".

    Reality: if a guy is a fat jobless slob sleeping with an anime body pillow, he can never be a solid six and never aspire to marrying a six. Deep down we all know our own value on the (singles) market. It's scary rather than shallow.

    Maybe it's more honesty than many people can stomach.
    "If we were going to stand in darkness, best we stand in a darkness we had made ourselves.” ― Douglas Coupland, Shampoo Planet

  9. #9
    Funding Member
    "Friend of Germanics"
    Skadi Funding Member

    Idis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Last Online
    @
    Ethnicity
    Anglo-American
    Ancestry
    Dutch, Low German & French
    Country
    United States United States
    Gender
    Age
    30
    Family
    Married parent
    Politics
    Free & Libertarian
    Religion
    Cultural Christian
    Posts
    139
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    86
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    123
    Thanked in
    53 Posts
    I kind of see what you mean, Chlodovech, however I think it's very subjective. What is a 10 for you may not be a 10 for another person and what may be a 2 or 3 for you may be a 5 or 6 on somebody else's scale... Women like Kim Kardashian or Paris Hilton are seen as high up on the scale by the media, but personally I just don't see it. Yet young women feel pressure to fit that kind of beauty ideal and "climb" on the scale...

    To me, there is no such thing as a perfect 10. People are imperfect by definition. My husband is the ideal partner for me but he may not be a 10 in every woman's eyes (and I may not be a 10 in other men's), but in each other's eyes we are the best we can get. And that's ok.

    I know some women who have these unrealistic and technical lists of the "ideal man" (and vice versa). I'm not saying we shouldn't have standards, but all this rating and ticking little boxes has become obsessive and strange... Back in the day, there used to be arranged marriages, yet people somehow came together and made it work. Now we have the freedom to choose, which is a great thing by the way, however the sad consequence of being too technical about lists is that some people end up chronically single.

  10. #10
    Funding Member
    "Friend of Germanics"
    Skadi Funding Member

    Gefjon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Last Online
    @
    Ethnicity
    Anglo-American
    Gender
    Age
    39
    Family
    Married parent
    Posts
    1,381
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    78
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    201
    Thanked in
    95 Posts
    Another sour grapes thread started by the MGTOW crowd.

    It ain't just women who overrate themselves, men also overrate themselves but of course the MGTOW crowd are calling that "self-confidence" while us women are just suffering from egocentrism, eh? Double standards, anyone?

    As a rule, women like confident men, but only when that confidence has a fitting context. Example, a chick has the hots for a guy and wants him to make a move on her, the guy does it and that sweeps her off her feet. But, the chicks has to like the guy in the first place. Usually, she's gonna be sending some signals and if the dude is smart enough & payin attention, he's gonna be able to read them and react. Everybody likes that, even old fashioned/traditional/nationalist chicks. Tho some of us also like shy men, but there's a limit to it, not all of us are gonna like throwing ourselves in his lap.

    Now if the chick ain't sending any signals, if the guy misreads somethin else as a signal (e.g. many chicks will be too polite to be blunt and tell a guy he has no chance with them) or if the guy overrates himself and thinks he's the best thing since sliced bread and all chicks fall at his feet, he's in for a big reality check. It's gonna hit him, and it's gonna hit him hard.

    To me the OP sounds like someone who is bitter cause he can't get women high on the scale, which is probly a result of the above.

    P.S. As usual, chicks don't find it attractive when men whine, especially if it's about women. We've got more than enough with our own dramas.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 118
    Last Post: Friday, June 14th, 2019, 07:53 AM
  2. Minority Women with Degree Outearn White Women
    By Verðandi in forum The United States
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: Monday, July 20th, 2009, 08:14 PM
  3. What Do Women Really Want?
    By friedrich braun in forum Psychology, Behavior, & Neuroscience
    Replies: 43
    Last Post: Friday, August 5th, 2005, 04:05 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •