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Thread: Self-Reliance As a Political Movement or Idea

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpearBrave View Post
    Who said we need to think of it in the terms of individualism, so it is not an oxymoron. You can have a more self-reliant people, company, nation the term "self" can be applied to a group as well as an individual.
    Well, companies are never self-reliant, since they always rely on their clients.
    For nations who are not self-reliant, they cease to be nations sooner or later, that's why I said it is just politics.

    Quote Originally Posted by SpearBrave View Post
    Your text I put in bold are exactly why we should become more self reliant, ...
    Your answers are not in line with my argumentation, because I restricted my point to individual self-reliance.
    If you want group self-reliance, then it is just exclusion, basically, you would have to implement the same methods we have currently implemented. Political structures, division of labor, law enforcement, etc.
    It would be virtually the same thing plus you get to decide who we don't want to have a part of it.
    National borders are completely artificial, formed by the will of men.
    Politics.

    I am certainly not against self-reliance as a nation or a group, I just don't think this is anything new.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahnenerbe View Post
    Most of the things we use on a daily basis are simply not necessary.
    The thing is that people don't know what to do with the freed energy. I think purpose is important here.

    Quote Originally Posted by SpearBrave View Post
    However as it can go far beyond just food items. It could be for anything clothes, cars, tools, electronics and anything else we need.
    The local production of ALL these things is neither practical nor possible ... yet (maybe with anti-matter generators and replicators from Star Trek )
    "Nothing is more disgusting than the majority: because it consists of a few powerful predecessors, of rogues who adapt themselves, of weak who assimilate themselves, and the masses who imitate without knowing at all what they want." (Johann Wolfgang Goethe)

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    The concept reminds me a bit of the democratic confederalism that has been the source of inspiration for the Kurdish political project in Syria (the Rojava area). Although the ideology underlying this project is a leftist ideology which, in my view is bound to fail or turn into a more Kurdish national project eventually, there still are some interesting things about it.
    They have a very different approach to the Kurdish question compared to the marxist ideology that is more common among Turkish Kurds. In stead of a political revolution in which a group of people fights the dominant state in order to create their own, the idea is rather to organize the people in such a way that the existing state they live in becomes redundant. It's a gradual revolution: a bottom-up organization is supposed to make it possible for the people to organize themselves, gradually diminishing the power of the state over this group of people.

    The concept of Self-Reliance seems to be just that. You create alternative political structures in order to circumvent the dominant state structure. It's a way of gaining political power without having to compete for it in the existing political arena. You don't need to conquer the state if you create your own state within a state. Especially in the beginning such a project would have to focus on persons rather than territory. It could actually be the beginning of a new conception of the state that ends the existing 'empty' understanding of state territoriality (a goal set out by Carl Schmitt in his work on the Großraum).

    In practice I think such a project would have more success in the US than in European countries though, considering there is a lot more space and a smaller government. Here it would be very tough to live a life 'outside the state'.

  3. #13
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    Many interesting points, in some ways reminiscent of the mid-19th century American essayist and philosopher Henry David Thoreau.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahnenerbe View Post
    First of all, Self-Reliance is something you actively do for yourself, not just an idea and even less a political movement...

    Self-reliance as a movement is thriving, yet it doesn't have to be 'Germanic'. Good ideas are generally spread globally and practiced by everyone.

    Don't worry about "the race". Take care of yourself first, then connect with others like-minded.
    I think many people are. If nothing else, the events of the past decade or so have forced people without strong political or business connections to become more self-reliant and to cooperate more with like-minded individuals and associations.

    Political movements and movements based on race are stuck in ineffectiveness, because those people always expect public policies to change their lives - instead of changing it themselves! They are also plagued by negativity, rejection of novelty and general ignorance of the real world.
    Not always true. Brexit. Trump.

    By and large, the proponents of these movements are reacting against the coercive structures imposed by leftist regimes upon their daily lives, which prevent them and their families from achieving their potential within the framework of ordinary civil society.

    They expect that Brexit and Trump will remove these structures, leading to greater personal liberty and autonomy to succeed within the system.

    They do not expect the system itself to dole out favors and welfare - that's the leftist lie of a utopian society where insane policies invented by moochers who produce nothing are magically expected to result in prosperity for all, rather than the inevitable dystopia that awaits once they are done spending other people's money and the real producers are taxed and regulated into oblivion.

    That's why I'm indifferent to politics in general. Politics attracts people with little talent, who seek to change things through collective, public action, instead of taking things into their own hands. Usually people with huge emotional and mental issues, lack of self-esteem. etc.
    True as a rule, if you are referring to the moocher class of professional politicians and left-wing agitators. But I think ordinary individuals often turn to politics because they wish to effect change upon society as a whole, not just within their small circle.

    Instead, it's so easy to just learn a new talent, join associations and organize with life-minded people to improve your life in all areas. You will find out that the people involved in those things are overwhelmingly White and Germanic - but do not necessarily make their ethnic identity the central element of their lives.
    Classic Thoreau-style individualism. It's wonderful for those with the talent and ambition to pursue it, but - unfortunately - they always seem to be in the minority. And though it may be a personally enriching and productive lifestyle, because of its limited scale it is not a tool for influencing and changing an entire society.

    Here is even a Black actor who is doing more for the bees than all the White so-called "traditionalists" put together: Morgan Freeman Converted His 124 Acre Ranch Into A Bee Sanctuary To Help Save The Bees
    Well. I daresay that if white traditionalists had Freeman's millions, they would do more with it than "save the bees".

    For the record - Here is another Black football player who quit his million-dollar contracts to become a farmer: Ex-NFL Player Who Made $25 Million Quit Football At Age 29 To Become A Farmer

    "Brown is doing this to help the less fortunate. He grows sweet potatoes and other vegetables, and donates his harvest to food pantries. According to the New & Observer, he has given away 46,000 pounds of sweet potatoes and 10,000 pounds of cucumbers this fall."

    I have yet to see one of our fellow "preservationists" - or whatever - doing that (even for their so-called "own-people"...)
    Again, not a fair comparison. In my experience, most preservationists have ordinary jobs and make an ordinary wage, or are mostly self-sufficient like yourself. Unlike Hollywood actors and American football stars, they don't have millions of dollars in the bank, and therefore are not in a position to spend vast amounts of money either to save bees or to donate massive quantities of vegetables - or, more to the point, to promote the preservationist cause.

    Not that the preservationist movement isn't stuffed full of pretenders, fakes, low-lifes, ignoramuses and opportunists. But let us take care not to disparage people whose dedication and accomplishments should be equally obvious, and which are all the more commendable due to their relatively limited resources. Again, Brexit, Trump. Even Skadi.

    From another of your posts in this thread:

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahnenerbe View Post
    In general, reducing our consumption goes a long way towards more self-reliance and resilience. Most of the things we use on a daily basis are simply not necessary.
    Very similar to what Thoreau wrote in the first chapter of Walden: "Most of the luxuries and many of the so-called comforts of life are not only not indispensable, but positive hindrances to the elevation of mankind". (from Henry David Thoreau. Walden, or Life in the Woods, chapter 1, section 19)

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    Thank You all for the excellent post keep them coming.


    Quote Originally Posted by Jäger View Post
    Your answers are not in line with my argumentation, because I restricted my point to individual self-reliance.

    If you want group self-reliance, then it is just exclusion, basically, you would have to implement the same methods we have currently implemented. Political structures, division of labor, law enforcement, etc. It would be virtually the same thing plus you get to decide who we don't want to have a part of it. National borders are completely artificial, formed by the will of men. Politics.
    Of course they are not in line with your argumentation, because you tried to restrict to individualism instead of thinking more in the terms a movement to help bring about the destruction of our current leftist political bodies and that is the core topic of the thread. I opened the topic up for discussion for people to express different ideas other than current complaining about our governments. This is just attempt to generate thought for myself and members here, there are no definitive lines you or I have drawn.

    I am certainly not against self-reliance as a nation or a group, I just don't think this is anything new.
    Of course it is nothing new, I already stated I learned of these tactics in the US Army. I am just curious if it could work in a different manner for a different people and time. I already know what the outcomes from what the US Army has done, so why not try it on a different scale and parameters.

    The local production of ALL these things is neither practical nor possible ... yet (maybe with anti-matter generators and replicators from Star Trek )
    Nobody said ALL things can be locally produced or ever will, its just a few ideas of breaking away from a current system of being entirely dependent on the current norms of political governance.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ahnenerbe
    Here is even a Black actor who is doing more for the bees than all the White so-called "traditionalists" put together: Morgan Freeman Converted His 124 Acre Ranch Into A Bee Sanctuary To Help Save The Bees
    Those rich niggers you mention have hardly done what other White people have on many internet boards and blogs.

    ehem, I have been doing this for years, and to Germanic people only. Further I'm not alone in this either.

    Not only do we give away food we produce, we also teach others how to produce and preserve their own. In fact I have used this board and others like to teach how to do these things. For some time I even had a internet radio show every Sunday morning dealing with this topic. I think Christians have a saying about giving a man fish and he eats for day or teaching him to fish and he eats for life. Though I will admit my reasons for teaching these things in person are for the local good to either stop people from being on welfare and food stamps or to try and get them off of them it is the same principle of this thread.

    Here are some examples, though I will admit most members here showed little response to them, but the internet non-members searches and copy cat threads and blogs were very good:

    Homemade Sauerkraut

    Pickled Beets

    Blaukraut (Spiced Red Cabbage)

    Home Canned Peaches

    What are the Top 10 Plants in your Garden?

    So, You Want To Try Blacksmithing?

    To even think I spend many hours of my time doing these things and teaching without a political agenda would be very false.

    Even when Skadi was shut down, I was still finding copy cat threads with the explanations and pictures I made. So it served a two fold purpose of attracting people to read other threads here and to teach, it is all about teaching an idea.

    I will never stop teaching these things, and I will always have the same agenda and that is Germanic people being self-reliant permanently and people getting back to the basic ideas of family and folk. Sure it might teach non-Germanics along the way, but at least I'm doing something with the tools available.
    Life is like a fire hydrant- sometimes you help people put out their fires, but most of the time you just get peed on by every dog in the neighborhood.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bernhard View Post
    In stead of a political revolution in which a group of people fights the dominant state in order to create their own, the idea is rather to organize the people in such a way that the existing state they live in becomes redundant.

    It's a gradual revolution: a bottom-up organization is supposed to make it possible for the people to organize themselves, gradually diminishing the power of the state over this group of people.

    You create alternative political structures in order to circumvent the dominant state structure. It's a way of gaining political power without having to compete for it in the existing political arena.

    You don't need to conquer the state if you create your own state within a state. Especially in the beginning such a project would have to focus on persons rather than territory. It could actually be the beginning of a new conception of the state that ends the existing 'empty' understanding of state territoriality (a goal set out by Carl Schmitt in his work on the Großraum).
    That's exactly the thing. No need to theorize that too much, it is something which comes naturally to me. A state could very well be an 'Order of Clans' in the way of the Chinese tongs.

    In Chinese culture, the word tong (堂) means "hall" or "gathering place". In North America, these organizations are described as secret societies or sworn brotherhoods and are often tied to criminal activity. Today in most American Chinatowns, if one can read Chinese, one can find clearly marked tong halls, many of which have had affiliations with Chinese crime gangs, especially in the 1990s.

    Today tongs are, for the most part, members of the Chinese Consolidated Benevolent Associations. Today these associations provide essential services for Chinatown communities such as immigrant counseling, Chinese schools, and English classes for adults, among countless others.

    Tongs follow the pattern of secret societies common to southern China and many are connected to a secret society called the Tiandihui, which follows this pattern. Other groups worldwide that follow this pattern and are connected with the Tiandihui are known as hui, hongmen, and triads.

    After settling in San Francisco and other California cities, Chinese workers faced hostility from their American peers who felt threatened by the Chinese who worked for lower wages. As labor unions and angered workers became more aggressive, many Chinese felt pressure to leave and go east, where they heard life would be less dangerous. As a result, many Chinese immigrants moved to cities such as New York and Boston where today there are large enough populations to build communities known as "Chinatowns".

    Many Chinese soon organized voluntary associations for support and protection. These focused around their originating district in China, family name, native dialect in the case of Hakka speakers, or sworn brotherhoods. Unfortunately, many of these volunteer societies did not have the financial ability to fund community events or look after their members, and those that did tended to focus inward and provide help only to their own members.

    As a result, many tongs with little or no hereditary financial value had to either disband or operate activities such as gambling houses. This transformed them from benevolent associations to providers of illegal services. Notably, many of the illegal tong activities were legal in China, but not North America.

    The early Chinese populations in the United States and Canada were overwhelmingly male, a situation that worsened when sex-restrictive immigration laws were passed in 1882 in the USA and 1923 in Canada respectively (see Chinese Exclusion Act and Chinese Immigration Act, 1923). For this reason tongs participated heavily in importing women from China both for marriage and to serve as prostitutes. A large percentage of the "tong wars"—disputes between the rapidly growing and powerful tongs—of the 19th and early 20th century often centered on these women.

    Tongs in North America showed many similarities to Triad of Hong Kong and British-controlled southeast Asia. These included similar initiation ceremonies and paying respect to the same deities. This is because both are similar organizations that follow the patterns of southern Chinese secret societies and sworn brotherhoods. The Triad societies were underground organizations in British controlled areas that also existed for self-help of members, but spoke of the overthrow of the Qing dynasty.

    Most tongs have similar organization and have a headquarters where one can find a president, a vice-president, a secretary, a treasurer, an auditor, and several elders and public relations administrators. Today their main aims are to care for their members and their respective communities.
    Interestingly, the Chinese word "tong" is very similar to the Aryo-germanic word "thing"... A tong/thing practicing self-reliance techniques is basically a state within the state.

    This is the simple, turnkey solution to all our "problems". I've been talking about these thing to people for years, but it seems no one gets it. When I explain this, they look at me like I'm crazy, or something. Their mind can't even comprehend those things.

    It's not rocket science, really. Every racial group, from the Far East until the Balkans, through the Caucasus, knows how to self-organize for self-protection and self-interest. With Whites, nothing. They totally lack the ability to self-organize, even when they are outnumbered 10 to 1 like in South Africa... The only form of organization they know is public "government" and hoping on public "elections" - like peasants.

    Even a small number of people organized in that way is already a state within the state, against which you can't do much - Just like the Miri Clan and other Arab Lebanese clans which terrorize the cities of Bremen and Hannover for years. The judges are afraid to sentence them because they have had several attempts on their lives. So you have about 2,000 Arabs basically controlling those major cities. Even the Hells Angels have to deal with them, and have integrated some of their members, rather than to risk a gang war.

    [Here are fresh news from 2 weeks ago: the German "state" capitulates in front of the Lebanese gangs. And yet it directs all its apparatus towards... other Whites and Nazis - because the Nazi in the end is alone with his little sister. He doesn't have 50 cousins that can fall down on the police within 15 minutes of a phone call like the hajis do.]

    With Whites, it's every man and his own shitty little nuclear family when no one trusts each other in the end. People from your own family are ready to denounce you to the "authorities" because you did something slightly "immoral" or "illegal"... This makes Whites totally unarmed to face the real world of the Browns out there. There will be millions of dead in Europe before people start rewilding.

    Even the most powerful White person in the end is just a little idiot who can only count on his wife-and-children, his little sister and his grandma... They have been bred as peasants for centuries to obey some kind of 'state authority' and now, they cannot go past that mentality. The awakening will be very, very hard. Other races don't care about moralistic "principles" - they only care about power and domination.

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    ...Other races don't care about moralistic "principles" - they only care about power and domination.
    Exactly!

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