View Poll Results: Is Vedic religion, with its doctrine of renunciation and moksha, good for Germanics?

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    7 35.00%
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Thread: The Aryan Vedic Religion

  1. #1
    Senior Member Gugnir's Avatar
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    The Aryan Vedic Religion

    I wanted to get opinions around here about Aryan Vedic religion. I have been going back and forth on it, mainly because of their "renunciation" doctrine. Anyone who's read the first 3 chapters of the Bhagavad Gita will know exactly what I'm talking about.

    It seems a bit strange. It's like it's saying "this world is basically bad," instead of "this world is basically good." It's saying life is a bad thing, life should not exist etc. The alternative? Just existing. Moksha. Return to Brahman, unite with Brahman, spend the rest of eternity literally just existing and doing nothing. I can't fathom why that would make sense or why our ancestors (Vedic religion was, as far as I know, founded by Indo-Aryans) would say such a thing. My problem is two of my best friends are devout Vedics so I have this influence on me and I can't just "renounce" (no pun intended, lol) the whole concept so easily. I wanted some opinions from Skadi on this matter.

    -Gugnir

  2. #2
    Eala Freia Fresena
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    Its escapism, the path of the coward.

    Our Norse religion is a warrior religion, fighting enhancing the being, fighting makes one free, fearless, strong, makes one more intense, increases one's power, makes one clear and focussed, a lot of nonsense leaves you. To defeat your enemy you have to give your very best, the whole of you has to make concerted efforts and so on.

    Aryans are warriors, not escapists.

    The Gita later on teaches that, the advice Krishna's to Aryuna is just that. arjuna's battle against his cousins is not escapist, it is the embracing of this world plus spiritual development.
    weel nich will dieken dej mot wieken

  3. #3
    Senior Member Gugnir's Avatar
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    I'm a little confused. You say the Vedic religion is a coward's escapist path, but then you seem to vindicate the Bhagavad Gita a little there. What is your intent?

    Also, why is it that our ancestors would invent such a religion as this? If we look across the European religions, we see many similarities - it's all the same basic idea. The Vedic texts do actually share a lot of the same basics, but they go to this "renounce life so you can go just exist" extreme. I don't understand why our ancestors (I speak of our race in general, not implying that the Vedic Aryans are necessarily literally your personal ancestors) would have come up with something like that.

    -Gugnir

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    Senior Member velvet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gugnir
    I have been going back and forth on it, mainly because of their "renunciation" doctrine.
    This seems indeed, like Ocko said, a misunderstanding. It's not about "doing nothing", it's about to act without demanding/expecting a reward.

    You're still supposed to fulfill your tasks in life, ie to farm your field in order to harvest, to go to war to defend your home etc, the only exception is the sacrifice, where the deed of the sacrifice is supposed to be freed from all "lively" and earthly expectations.

    Some of the guides are for the "wise" (priests) only, not for everyone. The Buddhists, becoming a folk of priests, got that entirely wrong. Also some of the Hinduist sects. Western style Hinduism/Buddhism is mostly hokum, worshipping their yoga guru, making him rich, when the Gita actually tells them otherwise. And for most, yoga is just a trendy sport anyway.
    Ein Leben ist nichts, deine Sprosse sind alles
    Aller Sturm nimmt nichts, weil dein Wurzelgriff zu stark ist
    und endet meine Frist, weiss ich dass du noch da bist
    Gefürchtet von der Zeit, mein Baum, mein Stamm in Ewigkeit

    my signature

  5. #5
    Senior Member velvet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gugnir View Post
    If we look across the European religions, we see many similarities - it's all the same basic idea. The Vedic texts do actually share a lot of the same basics, but they go to this "renounce life so you can go just exist" extreme. I don't understand why our ancestors (I speak of our race in general, not implying that the Vedic Aryans are necessarily literally your personal ancestors) would have come up with something like that.
    The Indian Vedas are not Aryan anymore, they havent been for some millenia before they were recorded. It's an amalgam of many religions and cults, mainly the Dravidian (Indus Valley culture), but also others (from the folks around the Hindukush (Afghanistan etc), of whom only some were of Dravidian stock).

    While the Vedas do carry certain similarities, they are not the same as the source for our European Paganism, if anything, they are a distant cousin. The split happened probably 5000+ years ago and from then on developed independent from each other, and on different influences.
    Ein Leben ist nichts, deine Sprosse sind alles
    Aller Sturm nimmt nichts, weil dein Wurzelgriff zu stark ist
    und endet meine Frist, weiss ich dass du noch da bist
    Gefürchtet von der Zeit, mein Baum, mein Stamm in Ewigkeit

    my signature

  6. #6
    Senior Member Gugnir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by velvet View Post
    This seems indeed, like Ocko said, a misunderstanding. It's not about "doing nothing", it's about to act without demanding/expecting a reward.

    You're still supposed to fulfill your tasks in life, ie to farm your field in order to harvest, to go to war to defend your home etc, the only exception is the sacrifice, where the deed of the sacrifice is supposed to be freed from all "lively" and earthly expectations.
    Right, but this idea of just doing what you have to to survive, act without expecting a reward (it's wrong to listen to music, then, since that's a 100% sensory experience), and so forth - it, quite frankly, takes the fun out of life... that may seem a kind of base thing to say, but I just got done typing a long diatribe about this to a comrade and I don't feel like doing it again, lol. But suffice it to say, this "just do what you must to survive (and even that's bad but do it cause you have to), but this world is not a good place" thing does not sit right with me.

    -Gugnir

  7. #7
    Senior Member KingOvGermania's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by velvet View Post
    This seems indeed, like Ocko said, a misunderstanding. It's not about "doing nothing", it's about to act without demanding/expecting a reward.

    You're still supposed to fulfill your tasks in life, ie to farm your field in order to harvest, to go to war to defend your home etc, the only exception is the sacrifice, where the deed of the sacrifice is supposed to be freed from all "lively" and earthly expectations.

    Some of the guides are for the "wise" (priests) only, not for everyone. The Buddhists, becoming a folk of priests, got that entirely wrong. Also some of the Hinduist sects. Western style Hinduism/Buddhism is mostly hokum, worshipping their yoga guru, making him rich, when the Gita actually tells them otherwise. And for most, yoga is just a trendy sport anyway.
    I did another thread where I went very, very in-depth about the commercialization of Eastern religions, basically, I explained that Buddhism, and this applies to Hinduism as well, in its purest form is by no means a pacifist, hippie religion. It espouses the Aryan warrior ethos and a hierarchical caste system native to our people. Modern Indians are by no means Aryan, but the ancient ones most certainly were before mongrelization from Arabs among other nations, as were Iranians. In fact, I have seen Iranians that could pass for Europeans if you did not know otherwise, but they are dwindling in number just as pure Whites are in Europe.
    For more information, I'd recommend anyone here look into the works of Julius Evola, especially The Doctrine of Awakening, easily the most comprehensive work on Buddhism by a Westerner, and to some extent Savitri Devi and Mircea Eliade. They all elaborate on the Aryan connections of Buddhism/Hinduism, and their connections to a nature-based hierarchical caste system which is very Germanic as opposed to a Jewish, wealth-based capitalist hierarchy
    In short, while they are not necessarily Germanic, they are not as incompatible with Germanics as their 'Western' imitators seem.
    Let truth and falsehood grapple...truth is strong-
    John Milton

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    Senior Member Gugnir's Avatar
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    I agree, Vedic religion isn't necessarily evil or something, but my problem is the way stuff is expressed. I don't care how many people tell me "oh, no, it's not saying you can't enjoy material life, it's just saying you need to control yourself," when I read the Gita, the message I get is "stop living and live for death." I'm sorry, that's just the message I get from it. This "enjoy life but control the senses" is what I'VE been saying/believing for the past 3 years in Heathenism, and not at all what I get from the Vedic literature.

    -Gugnir

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    Senior Member Plantagenet's Avatar
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    When investigating spirituality, the Truth of reality and achieving enlightenment supersedes all Earthly concerns, including "what is good for the white race."

    If what the Vedic religion claims is true, that the ultimate purpose of life is to achieve moksha, liberation, self-realization, etc. then of course it would be good for the white race because it would be fulfilling our highest purpose.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gugnir View Post
    I don't care how many people tell me "oh, no, it's not saying you can't enjoy material life, it's just saying you need to control yourself," when I read the Gita, the message I get is "stop living and live for death." I'm sorry, that's just the message I get from it.
    It isn't about living for death, but realizing the inherent transiency of life and the inescapable nature of death. It is better to die in this life (ie become self-realized, conquer death) when you have control over the matter than to die helplessly facing the unknown. And according to Vedic teachings, with self-realization comes the realization that birth and death are both ultimately illusory.

    Either way, I personally believe the early Vedic religion is the same religion as the ancient Northern religions. Take for example the similarities between the Celtic religion and the Vedic religion:

    http://www.centrostudilaruna.it/euro...dichindus.html
    http://www.hinduwisdom.info/articles_hinduism/258.htm

    This is why I believe those who want to be neo-pagans are probably better off becoming Hindus or Buddhists if they want to get the true heart out of the ancient pagan religions rather than relying on the interpretation of modern writers or making things up as they go along. Because religion isn't about believing in a certain set of mythologies or gods, but what the Indians call sadhana. Action, asceticism, self-knowledge, transformation.

  10. #10
    Eala Freia Fresena
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    The fight between the Aryan Gods and the darkies is aeons old.

    Darkies influence 'religion' to make Aryans not fighting for the Earth but retreating into a nice and emotional space, that is why there is 'religion'. it is twisted with truth and untruth.

    Don't follow books but yourself. Think, feel and test your way and then do so without hesitation.

    when 'Gods' come to bring you off your way let them proof to you that they are what they say.

    Humans are one of highest creatures in the universe with enormous power. the Koran says human come straight after Allah and the angels and archangels are to support us.

    there is no higher being then yourself.
    weel nich will dieken dej mot wieken

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