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Thread: Nothingness After Death

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    Senior Member Alfadur's Avatar
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    Nothingness After Death

    I've had this slightly philosophical thread in mind for a while, and now I finally bothered to make it.

    Our usual assumption is that when you die, it's all over, and nothing remains. However, I find this just as devoid of reason as saying there is a heaven or any afterlife at all. "Realistic" people might try to tell me that when I die there will be "nothing", only an eternal blackness. But what is the base for that claim? Absolutely none.

    1. Have they ever died or had a near-death experience? Then, how come they are certain what it feels like after death?

    2. If they claim that it is because all brain activity will cease, then have they ever experienced this nothingness they talk about? If not, how can they claim that it exists? This is as speculative as assuming the existence of God. No one that I know of has ever experienced nothing. There is always something everywhere. It contradicts the laws of physics.

    3. If they say that they have actually experienced nothingness, and that it was the state before they were born, then how do they know how it was like then, if they were not even born yet? If they know what nothing feels like because they were not born, I can claim to know what the Big Bang was like or the first human being making a fire, because I was not born in that time too. Does not that seem unrealistic? Then why does the "nothingness assumption" seem the most realistic? Because they cannot remember what it was like before being born? Why should the fact that there is no memory before we were born account for nothingness before and after life, if the fact that there is no memory of early stages of consciousness does not?

    Anyways, discuss and give your input.

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    Senior Member Lady Vengeance's Avatar
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    Well...when the brain dies, it doesn't just disappear into nothing. The mind is a field made of various elements, a special kind of organization. When the brain dies, all its elements remain in the physical universe, but in a different order. We're lucky to be that order for a limited time and call it "I".

    Most people are probably terrified of life beyond this life. Consequences would follow. It's bad enough to have a lifetime of contemplating your own fuck-ups, so just imagine an eternity of it. When you're old and sick, you'd probably prefer to be dead forever.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alfadur View Post
    1. Have they ever died or had a near-death experience? Then, how come they are certain what it feels like after death?
    Hmmm, just because I've never actually experienced something, doesn't mean I can't have a pretty good reason for assuming that it exists. For example, an electron, proton, an atomic number, a super-intelligent African, und so weiter. It's called "inference to the best explanation".

    Of course, with these life-and-death questions, you can't ever prove anything. I think it's pretty fair to say that we'll probably never know the answer to the OP, and that there are many hints that what we think of as the real-life physical world is a smaller part of something greater.

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    Maybe you would appreciate a Biblical description of what happens after death?

    For dust you are, and to dust you will return.

    A live dog is better than a dead lion for there is no devising, nor knowledge, nor wisdom in Sheol the place to which you are going.

    (Both recited from memory so let me be if its not word perfect).

    From a logical point of view, if you have a bad head injury, you can end up brain damaged, this is evidence that our intellect and awareness is totally dependent on physical matter, namely the brain.
    It doesn't exist in some spiritual entity called "the Soul" or some such, if it did the brain injury wouldn't affect you.

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    Aka Bazlekar Dvergr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alfadur View Post
    Our usual assumption is that when you die, it's all over, and nothing remains. .
    I'd start by saying this is a modern day science oriented Atheist phenomena. I think if you study just about every single ancient culture they had some idea of where they would go after death. I think when science and monotheism turned the world away from grey areas and speculation based on natural-spiritual interpretation people became fear based. As people became fear-based, afraid of their own judgement of entering places like Hell, (because they had been so brain washed into believe there were only two main options after life, the best place and the worst place - Heaven and Hell) then what sprouted out of it was either a return to the original cultural based religions which had polytheism, animism, nature based spirits, etc or a leap towards Atheism. I would view that as a new phenomena with absolutely no cultural attachment to anywhere on earth, the only attachment being the black and white view of life and death which sprouted out of organized monotheistic religion in the first place.
    Til įrs ok frišar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alfadur View Post
    "Realistic" people might try to tell me that when I die there will be "nothing", only an eternal blackness. But what is the base for that claim? Absolutely none.
    Well first of all "nothing" and "eternal blackness" are two different things. Nothing means absolutely "no-thing", so nothingness by definition could not have any colour or hue associated with it. Neither would there be any perception of time because there would be no conscious observer to perceive time and no state of change by which to mark it.

    Moving on; 100% proof positive for anything is a very hard thing to come by. Therefore the most rational approach to life is to assess the likelihood of a particular outcome and choose our actions accordingly.

    Now, we know that the ability to think and remember things as well as to speak, see, hear, touch etc are all made possible by the functions of certain areas of the brain. We know this because when the part of the brain responsible for one of these abilities gets damaged or degenerates due to age, that ability is lost.

    Therefor if damage to a part of the brain can destroy one or more of our senses what is the likelihood that destruction of the entire brain at death will result in all our senses being returned to us perfectly unscathed? I would suggest that in the absence of powerful evidence to the contrary that the likelihood of that happening is very low indeed.
    Close observation may result in feelings of horror, wonder and awe at world you find yourself inhabiting.

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    Senior Member Forest_Dweller's Avatar
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    When you die you won't experience nothingness because your senses will cease to funtion anymore. If you believe this is the only life you have and there is no afterlife, you become an inanimate object devoid of consciousness much like dead tree bark.

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    Member Hands's Avatar
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    Mentally you personally will stop, most likely, unless we are extremely false in our theory's
    But the world doesn't stop when you die.

    Of course there is life after death, not for you though, but your kin, who are the next you.

    This is why we must secure Northern European culture and morals, for our children are just the next us. But unlike us they are ready to improve further than we ever could. It is never enough to just know who we are, we have to be sure the future children of the north know who they are when we pass, this is our responsibility.

    So yes there is life after death, but not for you technically. But why be so linear when we can take pride knowing that our kin are better versions of ourselves, but remember we must make sure that they are this, so that we never die.

    Off topic from the current flow of discussion slightly, sorry

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    Has anyone heard the tales of people while undergoing brain surgery and have no recordable brain functions are able to recall specific details about their procedure. Additionally some even report with high degrees of accuracy things that occur in other parts of the hospital and beyond. I wonder if the escence that we call "I" is something more and just transforms when the biological functions stop. Maybe the body just fails to be a productive medium for our escence to occupy. A thought provoking post for certain.

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    I believe in nature. Nature moves in perpetual circles; generation, degeneration and regeneration. If our age-old observation of this should have taught us anything, it is that life does not simply disappear into nothingness. It transforms.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ralf Rossa View Post
    From a logical point of view, if you have a bad head injury, you can end up brain damaged, this is evidence that our intellect and awareness is totally dependent on physical matter, namely the brain.
    Only the intellect and awareness detectable and subjectable to this realm we currently find ourselves in.
    A nation is an organic thing, historically defined.
    A wave of passionate energy which unites past, present and future generations

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    I cannot think of anything worse than personal immortality. Even if you go to heaven or Valhalla. After the first couple of trillion years, there would be nothing left to do that you had not done millions of times. Think of the boredom.
    Das Recht und die Gerechtigkeit haben nur selten miteinander etwas zu tun. Höchstens machen sie winki winki wenn sie aneinander vorbei gehen.
    The Law and Justice have only seldom anything to do with one another. At the most they wave at each other when they pass one another on the street.
    Niemals vergessen. Niemals vergeben.

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