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Thread: What Is Your Opinion of the Hippies?

  1. #21
    Senior Member KingOvGermania's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Godwinson View Post
    Thanks for the links, KOG. However, whilst those YouTube clips presented a very interesting synopsis of the Frankfurter School, none of what was said actually tied in with the Hippies (as I thought it would) and they were not mentioned at any point. I was in fact already aware of this pernicious movement and the Jewish Internationalists who dominate it and yes, I wouldn't be surprised if some Hippies bought into that kind of ideology, given the nature of their own movement.

    That said, I reckon that 90% of all the Hippies were just in it for the good time on an individualistic basis. They enjoyed the music, were less inhibited about sex than their stuffy parents, perhaps wanted to experiment with drugs and so on... but the vast majority were not die-hard Marxists (and many of those who were grew soon out of it!) which has since been borne out by the fact that many of them went on to become members of the Middle Class themselves earning nice fat salaries

    I just think it's far too easy to take a group of people who behave unconventionally and assume they must have a destructive agenda. Condemning them out of hand also implies that what they are trying to change is perfect and does not need modifying in any way. Sorry, but I disagree! Yes, I accept that there will always be political opportunists who use any mass movement to further their own goals but sometimes one can focus exclusively on these outside forces and overlook the essence of the movement itself.

    Like I said before, I was not a Hippy (you'd never get me wearing those beads and sandals ) but those I knew were mainly good/nice people. I have to disagree with you, KOG, when you say ...



    ... because I never met any who were trying to subvert me in any way, and if you start to avoid people because of some irrational fear of their 'intentions' you might as well remain indoors! It's all too easy to meet rude and obnoxious people in this world without starting to suspect the motives of those who act decently, but I do agree that caution is advisable when dealing with some of the more fanatical elements (and this applies to ALL groups!) Maybe I was just lucky with those I happened to meet, I don't know, but what else can I base my judgement on?
    Well, not all hippies may have brought into it, but the more radical ones, like Abbie Hoffman, Jerry Rubin, and their ilk most certainly did, and they influenced the hippie movement in huge ways towards the end of it. So were they all into it? No. Was it tied into it? Yes

    I do NOT condemn hippies because they are 'unconventional', my beliefs, taste, and interests are not conventional at all by the standards of mainstream society, I was condemning them because they helped spread Cultural Marxism, whether they knew it or not. Yes, like you said, many were not trying to, but there were ones that were, and the ones that were, were heavily influential.

    No, they are not trying to 'subvert' individual people, more like the entire civilization and its values, language, and culture, and I do not have an irrational fear of 'everyone' because they are trying to 'subvert' me, I was simply pointing out the connections between hippies and Cultural Marxists, who HAVE tried to subvert us. And no, it's not just the hippies either, not at all. As for 'what to pass judgement on': IMO, being a good person is defined by ones actions, I won't go any further with that because I don't want this to turn into a discussion about morality, and I was not speaking about individual hippies, nor every single one of them, I was speaking about the effects the Cultural Marxist-influenced ones had on Western civilization and in destroying it. While they did not directly do it, they were simply 'hired guns' for those who were.
    Let truth and falsehood grapple...truth is strong-
    John Milton

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    Hippies were the product of a (Jewish) Cultural Marxist experiment.

    I can't see why any self-described National Socialist would want to defend these leftist degenerates who lived like negroes and were constantly on drugs. In the actual Third Reich, this would never be allowed.

  3. #23
    Senior Member SaxonPagan's Avatar
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    Well, not all hippies may have brought into it, but the more radical ones, like Abbie Hoffman, Jerry Rubin, and their ilk most certainly did, and they influenced the hippie movement in huge ways towards the end of it. So were they all into it? No. Was it tied into it? Yes

    I do NOT condemn hippies because they are 'unconventional', my beliefs, taste, and interests are not conventional at all by the standards of mainstream society, I was condemning them because they helped spread Cultural Marxism, whether they knew it or not. Yes, like you said, many were not trying to, but there were ones that were, and the ones that were, were heavily influential.

    No, they are not trying to 'subvert' individual people, more like the entire civilization and its values, language, and culture, and I do not have an irrational fear of 'everyone' because they are trying to 'subvert' me, I was simply pointing out the connections between hippies and Cultural Marxists, who HAVE tried to subvert us. And no, it's not just the hippies either, not at all. As for 'what to pass judgement on': IMO, being a good person is defined by ones actions, I won't go any further with that because I don't want this to turn into a discussion about morality, and I was not speaking about individual hippies, nor every single one of them, I was speaking about the effects the Cultural Marxist-influenced ones had on Western civilization and in destroying it. While they did not directly do it, they were simply 'hired guns' for those who were.
    KOG, I notice you've substantially changed (deleted?) the first message you wrote and replaced it with this one. However, just to clear things up, I wasn't implying that you have an irrational fear of everyone. Apologies if that's the way it came across but I was trying to highlight the risks in assuming that decent (albeit unconventional) folks with whom we get along socially must have subversive motives

    The names you mention - Hoffman, Rubin & Co. - are just the 'usual suspects' that one always finds in such mass movements ... you know how these people operate Perhaps they did, towards the end, try and take things off in their own direction but I don't believe that the Hippy movement was specifically created by the Frankfurter School/Cultural Marxists or anyone else with this in mind. It was a more or less spontaneous thing in the initial stages that just grew and grew, with the political opportunists only jumping onto the bandwagon in the later stages.

    As I said, I got on fine with most of the Hippies I knew (admittedly, by then it was just the dying embers of the 'Hippy' era) but there are a lot of misconceptions as to what they were about. I happen to believe that the vast majority of them were just into the whole scene for a good time. And a damn good time it was too

    By Storm Saxon: Hippies were the product of a (Jewish) Cultural Marxist experiment.

    I can't see why any self-described National Socialist would want to defend these leftist degenerates who lived like negroes and were constantly on drugs. In the actual Third Reich, this would never be allowed.
    I see. So you haven't actually read any of this thread then?

    I did in fact mention in my initial post the (apparent) contradiction between NS and all of this, whilst pointing out that there was some affinity with Paganism on the other hand.

    Incidentally, could you please have the courtesy to not refer to other members' belief systems, whether political or religious, as 'self-described'.

    Thank you!

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    As much as conservatives tend to idealize it, the society that the hippies rebelle against was already profoundly ill. The development of the military - industrial complex, wars for profit against small foreign countries, destruction of the environment, hypocrisy and social atomisation were all very real and worth complaining about.

    Unfortunately, like all mass movements in the television age they were co-opted and ended up doing more harm than good.

    Edit: the Wandervogel in Germany, especially in the Weimar era could be considered proto-hippies that emerged for the same reasons of social sickness.

  5. #25
    Senior Member Patrioten's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ampersand View Post
    As much as conservatives tend to idealize it, the society that the hippies rebelle against was already profoundly ill. The development of the military - industrial complex, wars for profit against small foreign countries, destruction of the environment, hypocrisy and social atomisation were all very real and worth complaining about.

    Unfortunately, like all mass movements in the television age they were co-opted and ended up doing more harm than good.
    Are you going to claim that Vietnam was fought over oil or something? If anything the post ww2 wars have been some of the most expensive and uneconomical wars ever, since they didn't include annexation of fertile agricultural land, nor did they include any hopes of large export markets. These wars were a pure economic loss, only fought for the sake of attempting to contain an expanding military power in the east, at great expense to the west.

  6. #26
    Senior Member Unity Mitford's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrioten View Post
    Are you going to claim that Vietnam was fought over oil or something? If anything the post ww2 wars have been some of the most expensive and uneconomical wars ever, since they didn't include annexation of fertile agricultural land, nor did they include any hopes of large export markets. These wars were a pure economic loss, only fought for the sake of attempting to contain an expanding military power in the east, at great expense to the west.
    It was also on economic grounds, though the results were futile - the US invaded Vietnam as they feared a 'domino effect' which would harm American economic interests

  7. #27
    Member Kveldssanger's Avatar
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    I am 31, so I obviously have no direct experience with the "original" hippie movement. I did spend some time in one of the subcultures that spawned from it in my adolescence and early adulthood, though.

    I think, like most things, that there are good and bad aspects to it. On a positive note, people in that subculture tend to eat organically and very healthy, and tend to be far more active outdoors (whether that's rock climbing, mountain biking, kayaking, etc.) than their "mainstream" counterparts. And the vast majority of hippie social circles I have known, events I have attended, etc., were overwhelmingly white (I've always wondered whether or not that fact caused any cognitive dissonance when combined with all of their cosmic, univeralist ideals).

    I think the great shame of the whole scene is that none of the "good things" they enjoy is intrinsically tied to that leftist worldview. One can still eat healthy, enjoy jam bands, and spend one's summers whitewater rafting and camping without buying into the anti-white (and by default, anti-Germanic), leftist worldview.

    I think people are attracted to it for natural reasons in their teenage years (good music [if you like jam bands], healthy food, a very active lifestyle, being outside, etc.), but the "community" or that "lifestyle" always seems to impose that very particular worldview onto them. That's one reason why my overall opinion of the hippie movement is negative. I have known a lot of Deadheads in my time, and they almost always have that anti-white, one world vibe to them. I can't even quite put my finger on it, or find the proper word to use, but it disgusts me.

    I also think that it has some cult-like features, primarily due to the heavy psychedelic usage. I think that also might be hard to grasp for people who don't have experience with them; and I don't mean that to sound gnostic or elitist. I wish I had never taken them, and not only do I choose not to take them again, having taken them extensively for a couple of years of my life, I would actually be frightened to take them again.

    It's just like most things. I have a conception of what childbirth is like, but I can't truly empathize with it. I have a conception of what dying from cancer is like, but I can't truly know that pain and despair. I have a conception of what war is like, but I am sure that the experience would be life-altering. Psychedelics are very powerful, and the use thereof is rampant in that community.

    And that creates a very real "us vs. them" mentality in some of them; the initiate vs. the uninitiated, the Gnostic vs. the herd, a la Ken Kesey's "You're either on the bus, or you're off the bus" koan. I think that feeling of "gnosis", though, and of finally being part of a true family or community, leads them to accept that venomous worldview in toto, since that is the "view" of the community, or tribe, or family which they have joined.

    And in the modern subcultures, there is a borderline Christlike view of Jerry Garcia. I am not saying that every Deadhead out there holds it to that degree, but I have personally heard many Deadheads (and read stuff to the same effect) speaking of Jerry as if he were practically Christ; that is, the One who lead them out of darkness and into the light.

    All that sounds funny, in a sense, or it can only be pictured in terms of satire, because a lot of peoples' conception of hippies derives from the media caricature of them. But to hear someone you know, someone with a soul, in the gravest and most serious of tones, tell you how the consciousness and moment was so intense at a post-Jerry's death Dead show, or fesitval, or Rat Dog, or Further, that he honestly thought it was the "Time" that Jerry was going to come back and reappear to them, that they had a vision of Jerry and Bob and Phil on a cosmic bus with them, and that they thought they touched heaven, that they were actually going to build a church called "the Church of Jerry"... it's disturbing. I have heard him called a Bodhisattva, have seen hand-drawn pictures in peoples' rooms with "We will always love you, Jerry", etc. I guess those are paltry examples, in retrospect, but cruise around on a Deadhead message board sometime and see what I mean.

    On another note, I also think that the psychedelic usage, and the plunge that people take into them, is somewhat understandable, if at least not justifiable. I know a lot of times when people take them for the first time they feel like they've discovered Atlantis, or another dimension, or an aspect to their life they had always been missing. I remember listening to one of the Follow the White Rabbit podcasts and hearing "Horus" talk about the uniqueness of white rabbits. He said something to the effect of, "If there's an ocean out there and someone says it's the edge of the world, you're going to find little white rabbits sailing out there to see for themselves." If I had to view the psychedelic usage charitably, I would phrase it in those terms. Germanics discover that inner "ocean" and want to sail to the edges to see what's there. I think it is ultimately destructive, but I can understand how it happens.

    I also tire of their pacifism. I truly think that most hippies I know have no true conception of the world. I realize that's a hopelessly broad generalization. I get the feeling, though, that they honestly think as long as they are "cool" with everyone, and are part of this Rainbow Love Tribe or whatever, that other races will realize that and just immediately accept them. I don't think they have any true realization that there are people out there who would hack them to pieces, or rape all of their cute hippie friends, without a moment's hesitation. I don't think they realize that society, and individuals, have to have a warlike edge of ferocity in them to survive in this world. I hate seeing dreadlocked twigs brag about how they don't own a gun and don't need one, knowing they couldn't survive five minutes in an inner city.

    They want all the beauty of Lothlorien, with none of the Galadhrim patrolling the borders for orcs.

    I suppose that wraps up my stream-of-consciousness rambling.

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    Senior Member Patrioten's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Unity Mitford View Post
    It was also on economic grounds, though the results were futile - the US invaded Vietnam as they feared a 'domino effect' which would harm American economic interests
    You ignore the Soviet position at this time, there was a credible contender at this time for world domination, and the west had a difficult time discerning the true reach of this super power in ascendancy. You might view the communist experiment as closer to home, whilst I don't, but you should at least acknowledge that there was more at stake here than a simple price mechanism.

  9. #29
    Senior Member SaxonPagan's Avatar
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    I'm a big advocate of alternative/natural medicine and the Hippies played a major role in its popularity today, bringing it in from the fringes. This is something they don't always receive due credit for and I was reminded of this just now whilst reading the following article ...

    -------------------------------

    We are all hippies now

    The term hippy is often used contemptuously. Some ex-hippies have a sense of failure with that counter culture movement's inability to change the world. The occupy movements taking place now are reviving memories of that 1960s anti-establishment counter culture activity. Hopefully, awareness of this counter culture's consciousness will not quickly fade.

    Of course the original hippy movement's fragile life raft couldn't continue in the corporate shark infested waters of today's corrupt culture. The movement peaked in the late 1960s and faded out completely by the 1980s, when Wall Streeter Gordon Gekko declared "greed is good."

    Sure, there were many who were too preoccupied with "sex, drugs, and rock and roll." But among them were conscientious and concerned humanists actively seeking not just exit doors from the establishment, but new doors for a better future. They left a legacy that Natural News helps maintain today.

    Positive dynamics that didn't exist before 1960

    The communal attempts of hippies to get back to the land didn't last for the most part, unfortunately. But that's where a lot of previously unknown vegetables such as kale, chard, and others that couldn't be purchased were grown. The resistance to Big Ag's "green movement" of large monoculture farming dependent on toxic chemicals for production had begun.

    And so did organic farming as the market expanded into mainstream commerce. Many health food stores in existence today were started by ex-hippies. This is also true for supplements and super foods.

    Different healing and health modalities with us today were initiated during the hippy era. Chinese and Ayurvedic medicine, especially acupuncture, began making inroads around that time. Not necessarily directly by hippies, but invited into this culture as a result of the openness for looking outside the box of mainstream medicine.

    Orthomolecular (non drug high dose vitamin therapy) psychiatry and medicine grew during that period. Orthomolecular psychiatry and medicine still exist today, though lately mainstream psychiatry has embraced Big Pharma more than ever before.

    Hatha yoga got built its foundation during that hippy era. On yoga's coat tails came Chi-Gong and Tai-Chi. Alternative and holistic medical approaches were very secluded until the hippies looked into it. Their interest survived even as the movement faded and they were forced to pursue more practical lifestyles suited to the way things are.

    The 1960s counter culture spawned ecological environmental awareness and anti-imperial war attitudes. Unfortunately, Big Brother has clamped down and the mainstream media is all about lies and withheld information. Much of the hippy legacy has been crushed. What little remains is seriously threatened by corporatism, big government,Big Ag, and Big Pharma.

    Revolution then and now

    Today's occupiers may possibly be a last gasp attempt at popularizing change from the current destructive status quo, if the internet remains long enough. Pre-internet alternative media also started during the hippy era. But in the 1960s, the mainstream media was not as much of an establishment propaganda voice as now.

    The hippy population was mostly a large group of middle class baby boomers that didn't have it bad materially, which puzzled many. The 1960s zeitgeist precipitated a shift of consciousness that motivated many baby boomers to walk away from middle class comforts.

    Hermann Hesse's 1927 Steppenwolf novel featured a character faced with the dilemma of staying with middle class comforts or stepping out of the matrix. That novel made the rounds among early hippies.

    Today's occupiers are coming from economic need mostly, and the fuel for their awareness of what's really going on behind the mainstream media curtain is the internet. Hopefully, this will precipitate a shift in human consciousness that 2012 is prophesized to initiate

    -------------------------------------

    http://www.naturalnews.com/034711_hi...#ixzz1nj1EexMW

  10. #30
    Senior Member velvet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Godwinson
    The names you mention - Hoffman, Rubin & Co. - are just the 'usual suspects' that one always finds in such mass movements ... you know how these people operate Perhaps they did, towards the end, try and take things off in their own direction but I don't believe that the Hippy movement was specifically created by the Frankfurter School/Cultural Marxists or anyone else with this in mind. It was a more or less spontaneous thing in the initial stages that just grew and grew, with the political opportunists only jumping onto the bandwagon in the later stages.

    As I said, I got on fine with most of the Hippies I knew (admittedly, by then it was just the dying embers of the 'Hippy' era) but there are a lot of misconceptions as to what they were about. I happen to believe that the vast majority of them were just into the whole scene for a good time. And a damn good time it was too
    This about sums it up.

    Sub- or counter cultures pop up all the time, and many of them have had a genuine motivation. The Hippie movement with its rejection of the developments and the middle class reality, it had a spiritual component as its core motivation too, that we cannot abuse the earth like we do, indeed a very green component, for community, self-reliance and healthy life-styles, for alternative technologies beyond the dogmas of the "west" (cant see what's in opposition to NS here, really ) etc. People may have been into it for various reasons, some maybe only for the music, and the "individual" approach was a necessity due to the existing reality. Sure enough, the movement was hijacked and turned into just another tool of the marxist mainstream. In America, btw, much more than in Europe, where the hippie movement was quite different from its American father. And that can also be said about other movements, be it Punk, Metal, Goth, the genuine, pre party Green / Anti Nuclear Power movement and what not. All white, btw.

    In the 60s, the European reality backdrop was the everyday reality of the Cold War right nex to us that created a No Future generation (in Germany certainly more intense than in England, where a similar effect had different reasons), the Wirtschaftswunder era died off and behind that was nothing to hope for, the "conservative" grip on society was a stranglehold, in England large scale trashing of the heavy industry led to a disenfrenchised white working class without jobs, without hope, without a future. This is the environment that brought forth Punk, the "against" reaction, and Metal, the "against (also against Punk) and this is the alternative" road (also had a spiritual/pagan component). The Hippie movement also found a reflection on this backdrop, likewise an against (the establishment) movement and a search for alternatives. In Germany, there was also the Anti-Nuclear movement that later became the Green party, which certainly had a hippie component, a movement born from the rejection of both nuclear power plants and nuclear weapons. The east-west blocs had their border, or rather fronts, on German soil. Destruction and a feel of omnipresent threat permeated every bit of life. No future was a reality.

    All those movements in Europe were quite different than in America though, something which is often overseen, they had different concrete motivations and took different shapes, what they shared though was the feeling that the way the world was heading was wrong. The hippie movement, as well as punk and the Green movement certainly were hijacked and twisted to other goals. An article lately shed some light on that, when a lefti asked the question when and why the pro-multikult dogma came into their political idea(l)s, and could not find a genuine reason why that would have been the result of what originally happened. Same with the Green movement, there is no reason whatsoever to have a multikult part in that ideology, it has nothing to do with anything. In fact, mass migration, globalisation etc are massive environment problems, so actually, as a Green, you should be against them. As a genuine anti-nuclear believer, you shouldnt and cannot wait that the whole world answers the empty, toothless call for more "common sense", you want to solve it for yourself, your own country first, and hope that others may follow. You really want an independent, free nation to be able to pursue your ideology. The globalisation and international dependence-isation is the exact opposite and prevents each and every goal one could have as a Green. Social justice also cannot wait for the whole world to become developed at a same level, you want to start with your own society, and hope that others may follow; to import ever more "disadvantaged" sabotages that goal fundamentally. So, how did the multikult end up in left ideologies? NS is a left ideology as well, and imho that's the reason why the leftist ideologies were the target of the hijacking, but indeed, this "little detail" changes the whole feel and political goals into anti-white agendas, while without this detail these ideologies would be not harmful at all, quite the opposite. We certainly need more green thinking, alternative technologies (the stone age didnt end due to a lack of stones) to the self-destructive technologies we currently have, more community sense, more "self-reliance" and functioning local economies, more health consciousness, better nutrition, more spirituality (in this connection it may be interesting to note that what had the most attraction to the hippies was India, an at least partly Aryan religion, and the holistic medicine approach extended into Chinese medicine etc), a more humble approach to the environment in general; the preservationist appraoch is actually so much "hippie" that it is almost funny to see it being rejected.

    Why let we steal the marxists our fields of arguments instead of reclaiming them for ourselves and our political goals? Indeed, I believe that all those movements originally were genuine white movements (and for the most part still are in fact, apart from some few foul apples who unfortunately claim leadership and mastermindship), opposing in one way or another that what was brought upon us by the same marxist elite that now steals our arguments to sell us under the cover of genuine widespread concerns something that no one asked for.
    Ein Leben ist nichts, deine Sprosse sind alles
    Aller Sturm nimmt nichts, weil dein Wurzelgriff zu stark ist
    und endet meine Frist, weiss ich dass du noch da bist
    Gefürchtet von der Zeit, mein Baum, mein Stamm in Ewigkeit

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