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Thread: Colonials as Europeans

  1. #411
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primus View Post
    Some Americans seem obsessed with Anglo-Saxonism (I was too when I was a bit naive) but Anglo-Saxons (and, later, Danes and Normans) are merely the latest participants in an ongoing ethnohistory. There were Celts prior to any Angles, Saxons, Jutes, etc. and pre-Celts from God knows where before the Celts- the history of human habitation in Britain predates the Germanic tribes by at least 10,000 years after the last period of glaciation and it's foolish to assume that these people were wiped out by Celts (and then the Celts wiped out by the Romans and Germanic tribes and the Anglo-Saxons wiped out by the Normans...).
    Very true. I'm not sure why Anglo-Saxon seems to be the generic term. What I mean is, we (Americans, Australians, Kiwis, Canadians, Englishmen) use Anglo-Saxon in the same way continentals use Germanic, in day to day speech. The English call themselves English, Americans 'Americans', but in the face of anything that is not a part of the White English speaking world, we are Anglo-Saxons. Like with Norwegians, Danes and Swedes calling themselves 'Scandinavians'.

    I guess 'Anglo-Saxon' is used over other more sensible terms, because of the sympathy with the Saxons over the Normans.

  2. #412
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    Quote Originally Posted by Svanhild View Post
    From the view of the ones who were left behind and couldn't or didn't want to leave, they were. Don't take it as an indignity but as a measurement. Europe has been in difficult and tough situations throughout the centuries but it were the people who stayed that made our home a better place. Again and again. It must have been promising to hear of a new far-away land where you can start all over again, with own acres and new rules yet to be made. To leave all known problems and sorrows behind and set sail for something new. Seducements and temptations.
    Well, I take it as an indignity when you use terms that imply such. My point was that it's very presumptuous of you to think that you know the minds and thoughts of the people who settled here. You have no idea what their situations may have been and likely have never lived through anything even remotely similar (and neither have I for that matter). To call them castaways & cowards is very short-sighted. Would you refer to the Angles, Saxons, Norse etc. who left their homes for greener pastures the same? What about the horse-riders from the steppes who left their homelands and settled in Europe and implanted their languages or the original humans to settle in Europe in the first place?

    But it still stands: Preservationists don't flee and leave for good. Europe is on fire? You can stay, burn your hands and help to extinguish the fire. Or you can leave. It's no reproach to you or any other living American member. Your home is America now.
    Well, the powers-that-were in Europe should have thought of this as they incessently feuded, using the commoners as their soldiers to fight their petty wars. The German princes should have thought of this as they eagerly sold their soldiers to the British to fight the Americans in the Revolution. The nobles should have thought of this as they increasingly taxed the poor farmers to support their haughty life-styles and bickerings with other nobles. The King and lairds of Britain should have thought of this as they cleared the highland crofts to make way for intensive sheep farming. Preservationists? There was no incentive for the commoners to preserve anything remotely "national"--there was no nationalism in those days (speaking of the 1600s & 1700s in particular). They could only attempt to preserve themselves. By coming here, they were the ultimate preservationists.

    And yes, America is our home now. I agreed with that from the start. You can criticze modern Americans all you want but to presume to know the minds of the settlers is too much.

    The ones who left for America were great workers and had an incredibly difficult job to create a country out of nothing in nowhere's land. Credit where credit is due. They were working hard. But they weren't working for their own original countries and not for the land of their people and forefathers. Generation later, the children of the settlers bombed down Germany to dust so that they could apply their ideas and ideologies of "freedom" and "equality" on us.
    Agreed on the issue of WWII. The Great Fratricide and a terrible shame it was for all Europeans and their cousins here.

  3. #413
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    Quote Originally Posted by Theodericus View Post
    I guess 'Anglo-Saxon' is used over other more sensible terms, because of the sympathy with the Saxons over the Normans.
    I've encountered some Anglo-Saxon romanticists online who post on various boards, people who seem to have this hatred of the Normans as representing Romanism (i.e. the Catholic Church, Contentalism or Francoism, and so on). At least in the US I think the term Anglo-Saxon is used, and is popular, due to the romanticism attached to the old Puritans in New England (and the Pilgrims, of course). Frankly I don't really see much to value in the Puritans outside of their abilities as scholars.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Primus View Post
    The proper term for any such person is myself is probably Celtogermanic, especially considering the often hard-to-distinguish line between the two in Britain proper, i.e. the name of the founder of the kingdom of Wessex is Cerdic, which is Caractacus when Latinized (an earlier Caractacus fought the Romans during the invasion by Claudius)- a Celtic name but the founder of an Anglo-Saxon kingdom (an Anglicized Celt? an Anglo-Saxon adopted and raised by Celts?).
    The over use of combined terms like calling yourself some CeltoGermanicAngloSaxonAmerican gets pretty retarded after a while. We don't even really know where the Germanic and Celtic tribes came from prior to being in that region, or if others were in that region first that just died out. I'm not going to pretend my family lineage is un-touched throughout history and I come from 10,000 years of families who only originated, married and bred blond hair blue eyed children on some shoreline in Denmark or Sweden. What I will do is continue the on-going Germanic traditions here in America while not pretending I am something or come from somewhere I am not. If you are sitting home eating Sauerkraut because you think it is this sacred German food brought by Thor I have some bad news for you, it was introduced by the Chinese.
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  5. #415
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primus View Post
    I've encountered some Anglo-Saxon romanticists online who post on various boards, people who seem to have this hatred of the Normans as representing Romanism (i.e. the Catholic Church, Contentalism or Francoism, and so on). At least in the US I think the term Anglo-Saxon is used, and is popular, due to the romanticism attached to the old Puritans in New England (and the Pilgrims, of course). Frankly I don't really see much to value in the Puritans outside of their abilities as scholars.
    My surname is Norman, and I have a traceable Norman lineage back to the Battle of Hastings, which doesn't go down so well when mentioned with Englishmen, but 1000 years later, the Normans don't exist outside of a regional culture of France. We're all essentially English/British today. But to be honest, I would prefer that the Saxons won on that day at Hastings, I like the idea of our history being far more entwined with that of Scandinavia than suddenly being thrusted into continental/French feudal politics.

    I have been told by patriotic Americans that the Puritan spirit is what guided the country. Some sort of religious zeal involved with Manifest Destiny. Not sure if they played that role though, but it's what I've heard.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dvergr View Post
    They over use of combined terms like calling yourself some CeltoGermanicAngloSaxonAmerican gets pretty retarded after a while. We don't even really know where the Germanic and Celtic tribes came from prior to being in that region, or if others were in that region first that just died out.
    There is some historicity of the often blurred lines between Celt and German- Greeks and Romans had trouble, at times, in telling them apart. We have the Germania of Tacitus, of course, and there's the lost ethnography of Posidonius on the Celts, as well as other information provided by classical annalists that the dividing line between Celtic and Germanic is, in some ways, a modern invention. I merely use the term Celtogermanic in its most generic sense; I don't literally think that I'm an Anglii on one hand and an Icenii on the other.

    Quote Originally Posted by Theodericus View Post
    I have been told by patriotic Americans that the Puritan spirit is what guided the country. Some sort of religious zeal involved with Manifest Destiny. Not sure if they played that role though, but it's what I've heard.
    I have some Puritan ancestors but the dourness of the sect doesn't appeal to me. The fanaticism of the Calvanists isn't much of a turn on to me and it's this zealotry that may've inspired the ideation of American Manifest Destiny.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Primus View Post
    There is some historicity of the often blurred lines between Celt and German- Greeks and Romans had trouble, at times, in telling them apart. We have the Germania of Tacitus, of course, and there's the lost ethnography of Posidonius on the Celts, as well as other information provided by classical annalists that the dividing line between Celtic and Germanic is, in some ways, a modern invention. I merely use the term Celtogermanic in its most generic sense; I don't literally think that I'm an Anglii on one hand and an Icenii on the other.
    Oh I wasn't criticizing you I was just pointing out that it seems the more pompous narcissists tend to fantasize a bit too much about how pure they or their supposed country is.
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  8. #418
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    Quote Originally Posted by OnePercent View Post
    This is a forum for people who are proud of their shared Germanic ancestry, a historic/genetic background that transcends geographical boundaries. If you really feel that the differences between Americans and Europeans are that significant then I have to wonder why you are on this site in the first place. By stating that Americans shouldn't try to "act European" you are denying the one common trait that we are all supposed to have to be members of this site, a shared heritage that originates in a specific part of Europe.



    Without igniting another debate about the validity of christianity as a part of Germanic heritage, the fact is that there are a lot of modern white Americans who feel no affinity toward the jewish god of christ and who have instead found spiritual resonance in the old Gods of our folk. To you it may seem as though we are being "silly" and "acting like a Norsman" but to us what we are doing is reviving the natural and long oppressed religion of our folk.

    And about the "cowboys", I hate to burst your bubble but the original cowboys were Spaniards. They were called vaqueros, a term that eventually transformed into "buckaroos" when Texans in the 1840's and 50's started adopting the Spanish cattle ranching practices that were required in the arid American west. The spanish origins of the "cowboy" are quite evident in the names of associated aspects of "cowboy" culture too: lariat or lasso, rodeo, even chaps.
    I have stated my stance on many posts, im Ethnicly Gerrmanic, not Culturally European, im Culturally American.

    The cowboys thing was a bad example, and who cares if they are influenced by Spaniards? are you a Nordicist?, the Spanish are just as White as you or i.

  9. #419
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dvergr View Post
    Oh I wasn't criticizing you I was just pointing out that it seems the more pompous narcissists tend to fantasize a bit too much about how pure they or their supposed country is.
    I call those kinds of people "role-players" who want to return to a time of ancient tribes that're consigned to history books. I think it's better to be more forward-thinking than this and to remember the ancients, emulate them certainly, but to return to them and being like them is pointless.

  10. #420
    You are speaking in very broad terms and are expressing an opinion so it's impossible for me to say more than I disagree with you unless you want to go into detail.

    And to destroy and ruin the original lands of their ancestors. Great deal. It adds more evidence to the conclusion that Americans are no Europeans. If 'German-Americans' had a sufficient feeling of connectedness with Germany they hadn't climbed the bombers to burn German towns along with their population to mere heaps of ashes and hadn't raised their guns in line with Afros, Indians or Russians to whack up Germans who were fighting for a German Germany independent of international high finance and their political demands.
    Not all Americans are German-Americans. The entrance of USA into WW1 forcibly suppressed the German-American identity years earlier. The German-American identity was residual at best by the time WW2 came around. Only more recently has there been an attempt to revive the German-American identity in response to the American identity being eroded over the decades from a racially assimilable (such as Germans) Anglo-Saxon-based nation to civic nationalism in which Mexicans and Kenyans can be Americans.

    Why would an American care if he is European? He is derived from Europeans but lives on North America. There are good parts of Europe and there are bad parts of Europe. A proper American is of racially assimilable stock and culturally assimilated into the founding Anglo-Saxon folk body.

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