Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 23

Thread: Shooting High?

  1. #11
    Senior Member Germaid's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Last Online
    Saturday, August 25th, 2012 @ 01:25 PM
    Ethnicity
    German
    Ancestry
    Württemberg, Franconia and I recently discovered old ancestors in Saxony
    Country
    Germany Germany
    State
    Baden-Wuerttemberg Baden-Wuerttemberg
    Gender
    Posts
    577
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    0
    Thanked in
    0 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Neophyte View Post
    Actually you could, or rather: it would be easy to make you do it quite willingly. Generally you see that operators of crew serviced weapons such as machine guns and mortars are much more willing to shoot effectively at the enemy. Not killing would be to let your mates down, and that is apparently carries an even stronger disincentive than killing.

    So the trick would be to make you a machine gunner. Then you would be part of a crew consisting of at least a loader and a spotter/commander; the spotter would observe and call out targets and correct your fire. I also suspect that guilt would be diffused in a situation like that since the gunner feels that he is not acting entirely according to his own volition.

    This is why heavy machine guns, which basically took a whole squad to move and operate, turned out to be so enormously effective in WWI.
    Sounds plausible. I guess it's just a different situation in wartimes when your with your colleagues.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ocko View Post
    The military prepares you for the moment of your first kill.

    There is also a situational different person than the one right now occupying your body.

    Women are more connected with life-giving activities, men tend to be more the opposite. They have a destructive streak.
    And what about non-military situations? For example someone breaks into my house at night. I wake up, grab my gun and then what? I believe I'd be scared to death and would rather hide somewhere until they are gone again. Furthermore, when you're nervous and untrained with guns you are likely to miss your target. And then start praying he doesn't get you!

    Quote Originally Posted by Thorolf View Post
    I truly believe something it is something subconcious. I notice this even in airsoft which is similar to paintball, just with plastic bbs. Almost every new recruit can hit a target fine, but when they fire at other people they aim high. It takes some time before they shooting at people properly.
    I believe most people are reluctant to shoot at others if not absolutely necessary. As most animals are reluctant to kill their own kind.

  2. #12
    Eala Freia Fresena
    "Friend of Germanics"
    Skadi Funding Member

    Ocko's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Last Online
    Tuesday, February 5th, 2019 @ 03:10 AM
    Status
    Available
    Ethnicity
    Friese
    Ancestry
    Friesland
    Subrace
    Nordid
    Country
    United States United States
    State
    Montana Montana
    Location
    Glacier park
    Gender
    Family
    Married
    Occupation
    selfemployed
    Politics
    rightwing
    Religion
    none/pagan
    Posts
    2,923
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    1
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    17
    Thanked in
    16 Posts
    You would be surprised what you can do in dangerous situations. There is something coming out from a corner inside you, you had never seen before.
    weel nich will dieken dej mot wieken

  3. #13
    Senior Member Edgard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Last Online
    Wednesday, August 22nd, 2012 @ 10:25 PM
    Status
    Available
    Ethnicity
    English
    Ancestry
    Jute/Angle
    Subrace
    Angle/Jute
    Country
    England England
    State
    Wessex Wessex
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Gender
    Family
    Married
    Occupation
    Education
    Politics
    conservative/pan Nordish
    Religion
    Mysticism/Christianity
    Posts
    992
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    1
    Thanked in
    1 Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Turin son of Hurin View Post
    Can anyone clear this up. We are sometimes told that people instinctually shoot higher than the targeted person because they have a naturel aversion to shooting a person.

    Or is it just the kick of the gun?

    I believe it's just the kick of the gun that makes it nessesary to be trained in aiming lower.

    Can some gun experts answer?
    I believe this was based on WW2 statistical analysis of American solderers. It was influenced by religious feeling with solders unwilling to kill as the bible said not to, only about 20% shoot to kill.

    In World War II, only 15 to 20% of American soldiers reported
    actually firing at the enemy. The great majority were non-firers, men
    who went into combat but never used their weapon. That means at
    most one out of every five men was actually trying to kill the enemy.
    http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&sou...sJKyVNmNGVNcCA

    With modern training its more like 95%

    This is unsafe to use out of context although more up to date research in Cardiff university bore this out. In our feminized and Christian/post Christian society most people have lost the ability to kill. Of the 2% who can kill without hesitation 1/2 were psychos and the other heroes who could kill when they had to but were good citizens.

    We studied it in uni with regards the ancient world, some joker had tried to apply this to the Romans and ancient Greeks. This was funny as for them killing enemies was a good thing and so they would not hold back.

  4. #14
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Last Online
    Monday, August 6th, 2012 @ 07:12 AM
    Ethnicity
    German/Irish
    Country
    United States United States
    State
    Texas Texas
    Gender
    Age
    43
    Family
    Single
    Occupation
    Computer CAD/ Civil
    Politics
    Libertarian/Conservative
    Posts
    1,773
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    2
    Thanked in
    2 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Germaid View Post
    Sounds plausible. I guess it's just a different situation in wartimes when your with your colleagues.



    And what about non-military situations? For example someone breaks into my house at night. I wake up, grab my gun and then what? I believe I'd be scared to death and would rather hide somewhere until they are gone again. Furthermore, when you're nervous and untrained with guns you are likely to miss your target. And then start praying he doesn't get you!



    I believe most people are reluctant to shoot at others if not absolutely necessary. As most animals are reluctant to kill their own kind.
    It is always wise to have several barriers between you and the outside world.

    That means install a alarm system, or another form of pre warning system so that you are not surprised. A dead bolt door is a good investment as well.

    And if possible do your best to avoid direct conflict with the criminal, because he may be, and probably IS also be armed. And even if you have a weapon, a gun fight is generally fatal.

    A gun is a last resort weapon, it is there to save your life after all other reasonable options have failed. But if need be don't hesitate to protect your life with it, even if you are a bad shot or what ever.

    And here is the main thing, KNOW YOUR Weapon, because if you do not in a crisis situation you will be surprised how man things can screw up. So knowing your weapon will eliminate one more unknown situation.

    But here is the the deal, also if you can just call the cops and have them deal with the criminal, that is probably best as opposed to just blasting him.

  5. #15
    New Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Last Online
    Wednesday, November 2nd, 2011 @ 06:41 AM
    Ethnicity
    Danish
    Ancestry
    Denmark
    Country
    United States United States
    State
    Florida Florida
    Location
    Panhandle
    Gender
    Family
    Single adult
    Occupation
    United States Army
    Politics
    Republican
    Religion
    Asatru
    Posts
    3
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    0
    Thanked in
    0 Posts
    Coming from someone who has served 3 and a half years active duty infantry I can assure you that it truly depends on the individual. I used to dread the thought of taking another persons life but when the opportunity came (and it did), I found the "Kill or be killed" mentality kicked it. We are taught that our inner animal come out in us during combat and that is what keeps us alive. All those statistics about new soldiers shooting high are rumor, by the time a infantryman hits the field he has been broken down and reprogrammed to kill or be killed.

    - Now recoil is a entire different story.

    ~ A news women reporting in Afghanistan asked a Army Scout Sniper how he felt when he killed baited Afghan civilians (opposition, they would leave ammo catches and bomb equipment on a street corner and watch for anyone to go for them). The Sniper replied with a smile "recoil".~

  6. #16
    Senior Member Thorolf's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Last Online
    Friday, January 25th, 2019 @ 12:24 AM
    Ethnicity
    Anglo-American
    Country
    Vinland Vinland
    State
    Maryland Maryland
    Gender
    Age
    28
    Religion
    My religious ways are odd.
    Posts
    505
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    4
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    4
    Thanked in
    4 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Uhtred View Post
    Coming from someone who has served 3 and a half years active duty infantry I can assure you that it truly depends on the individual. I used to dread the thought of taking another persons life but when the opportunity came (and it did), I found the "Kill or be killed" mentality kicked it. We are taught that our inner animal come out in us during combat and that is what keeps us alive. All those statistics about new soldiers shooting high are rumor, by the time a infantryman hits the field he has been broken down and reprogrammed to kill or be killed.

    - Now recoil is a entire different story.

    ~ A news women reporting in Afghanistan asked a Army Scout Sniper how he felt when he killed baited Afghan civilians (opposition, they would leave ammo catches and bomb equipment on a street corner and watch for anyone to go for them). The Sniper replied with a smile "recoil".~
    I might be wrong, but I think a lot of the shoot high studies are sorta old. Depending on when they are from, it could have been during a time they were drafting people. I also don't know if training during vietnam and earlier was as good as now.

  7. #17
    Senior Member Schopenhauer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Last Online
    Sunday, July 22nd, 2012 @ 07:31 PM
    Ethnicity
    Anglo-American
    Ancestry
    England, Ireland, and Wales
    Country
    United States United States
    Location
    Arkham, MA
    Gender
    Occupation
    Cultist
    Politics
    Cthulhic
    Religion
    LHP
    Posts
    763
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    1
    Thanked in
    1 Post
    Usually people are just put off by the "blast and flash" of a handgun/rifle.

    A good way to start training in order to avoid flinching, is to start with a .22, then slowly and incrementally build up to larger calibers. Shooting high/flinching is a result of the shooter anticipating what they perceive will be an uncomfortable amount of recoil. Proper trigger and breath control will go a long way towards keeping bad habits from forming.
    Omnia risus et omnis pulvis et omnia nihil - HPL

    "Oh, you should never, never doubt what nobody is sure about." - Willy Wonka

    “niemand bleibt hier” - Maria Orsic

  8. #18
    Senior Member Thorolf's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Last Online
    Friday, January 25th, 2019 @ 12:24 AM
    Ethnicity
    Anglo-American
    Country
    Vinland Vinland
    State
    Maryland Maryland
    Gender
    Age
    28
    Religion
    My religious ways are odd.
    Posts
    505
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    4
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    4
    Thanked in
    4 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Thorolf View Post
    I might be wrong, but I think a lot of the shoot high studies are sorta old. Depending on when they are from, it could have been during a time they were drafting people. I also don't know if training during vietnam and earlier was as good as now.
    To add to what i said earlier. I do remember learning a lot about vietnam. The M16A1 is fully automatic. Soldiers weren't trained properly and the army especially at the time tended to just spray leading to the recoil pulling the gun higher. This was one of the reasons our newer m16's shoot in bursts.

  9. #19
    New Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Last Online
    Friday, July 28th, 2017 @ 11:17 PM
    Ethnicity
    Neanderthal
    Ancestry
    Germany/Ireland
    Country
    United States United States
    State
    Zug Zug
    Location
    desert
    Gender
    Occupation
    secret
    Politics
    deplorable+
    Religion
    blond jesus
    Posts
    10
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    0
    Thanked in
    0 Posts
    I've heard before about people intentionally aiming high say in times of early muskets but it's clearly BS. When someone is trying to shoot you there is no such hesitation.

    It's probably due to the huge kick of early muskets combined with throwing troops out with very little training.

    It's also wrong to say the bullet is gone before the kick. The bullet moving at all is only a reaction to the explosion against the case/chamber, so it is definitely the opposite.

    With a modern small bullet and light kick it is not a big effect. I have not shot a musket but with loose tolerances and a very hot charge and a massive bullet I am sure it is a much different story. And people today who do fire muskets fire them with light charges. Military charges were very strong.

  10. #20
    Proffessional Hickerbilly
    "Friend of Germanics"
    Skadi Funding Member

    SpearBrave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Last Online
    @
    Status
    Available
    Ethnicity
    American of German decent
    Ancestry
    Bavaria/Switzerland
    Country
    Other Other
    State
    Kentucky Kentucky
    Location
    Central
    Gender
    Age
    52
    Zodiac Sign
    Libra
    Family
    Married
    Occupation
    Kunstschmiede
    Politics
    Self-Reliance
    Religion
    Asatru
    Posts
    4,513
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    2,634
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    1,242
    Thanked in
    569 Posts
    Most people shoot high due to lack of trigger control and sight alignment. If you shoot all the time this becomes less of an issue. Your breathing also effects this greatly, you should fully exhale and slowly squeeze the trigger.

    The big thing about shooting accurately is practice, practice and more practice until the weapon becomes an extension of you finger. to increase this also carry your firearm as much as possible.
    Life is like a fire hydrant- sometimes you help people put out their fires, but most of the time you just get peed on by every dog in the neighborhood.

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Another Police Shooting
    By Æmeric in forum The United States
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: Monday, July 24th, 2017, 03:16 AM
  2. Replies: 5
    Last Post: Sunday, June 26th, 2016, 12:51 AM
  3. Sikh Temple Shooting
    By Fredericus Rex in forum The United States
    Replies: 41
    Last Post: Monday, August 13th, 2012, 02:27 AM
  4. Replies: 3
    Last Post: Monday, May 3rd, 2010, 11:47 AM
  5. Replies: 2
    Last Post: Wednesday, January 13th, 2010, 12:34 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •