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Thread: US Survey Reveals That Evangelicals Are Most Likely to Despise Jesus’ Teachings

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    US Survey Reveals That Evangelicals Are Most Likely to Despise Jesus’ Teachings

    A PIECE written for Religiousintelligence.com – based on the results from a recent poll published by the Pew Forum on Religion and Public Life – says the finding reveal what social scientists have known for a long time:

    Authors Phil Zuckerman and Dan Cady wrote:

    Jesus unambiguously preached mercy and forgiveness. These are supposed to be cardinal virtues of the Christian faith. And yet Evangelicals are the most supportive of the death penalty, draconian sentencing, punitive punishment over rehabilitation, and the governmental use of torture.

    Jesus exhorted humans to be loving, peaceful, and non-violent. And yet Evangelicals are the group of Americans most supportive of easy-access weaponry, little-to-no regulation of handgun and semi-automatic gun ownership, not to mention the violent military invasion of various countries around the world.

    Jesus was very clear that the pursuit of wealth was inimical to the Kingdom of God, that the rich are to be condemned, and that to be a follower of Him means to give one’s money to the poor. And yet Evangelicals are the most supportive of corporate greed and capitalistic excess, and they are the most opposed to institutional help for the nation’s poor — especially poor children.

    They added:

    They hate anything that smacks of ‘socialism’, even though that is essentially what their Savior preached. They despise food stamp programs, subsidies for schools, hospitals, job training — anything that might dare to help out those in need. Even though helping out those in need was exactly what Jesus urged humans to do. In short, Evangelicals are that segment of America which is the most pro-militaristic, pro-gun, and pro-corporate, while simultaneously claiming to be most ardent lovers of the of the Prince of Peace.

    They concluded:

    Of course, conservative Americans have every right to support corporate greed, militarism, gun possession, and the death penalty, and to oppose welfare, food stamps, health care for those in need, etc. — it is just strange and contradictory when they claim these positions as somehow ‘Christian’. They aren’t.
    http://freethinker.co.uk/2011/04/26/...sus-teachings/

    http://www.religiousintelligence.com...ls-hate-jesus/

    Are there any Evangelical Christians on Skadi Forum that could explain this to me?

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    The Evangelicals are protestant in their origins, and protestantism has a special history in how it related to the state and its matters, and also the religion. Even though protestantism came with state churches, it still allowed for the state and the church to be separate or more equal in standing compared to Catholic countries where the dictates of the pope, the holy chair, would become the supreme source of authority. State matters could thus be separate from religion. Compare this to Islam where such a separation has never come about, there Islam and the teachings of the prophet are supreme, the state is at the mercy of the priesthood basically (Iran has taken this to its logical end, and can be seen as the opposite to where protestant nations ended up).

    Add to this the fact that protestantism also includes the old testament in its teachings, which became codified into most protestant countries penal codes. The Mosaic law which came into effect in Sweden was based on the old testament and meant that the death penalty would be administered for quite a few crimes.

    Back then (16th to 19th century), any discrepancies between the teachings of Jesus and worldly traditionalism would have been easily overlooked where need be. Tradition could thus exist parallell to the religion. When the pope comes around and condemns the death penalty for example this has no profound effect on traditionalist, protestant congregations. Their justification lies not in the words of the pope but in the bible, and the old testament especially.

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    Concerning poverty and wellfare administrated by the state one can point to the tradition within protestantism of hard work being viewed as a Christian act. To work hard and making an honest living is righteous. This makes the opposite, not working, a negative. By placing such a high value on work, and making it into a personal imperative, it is not hard to see how this could be transformed into a reluctance or even hostility towards wellfare. Especially if wellfare is understood as supporting undeserving individuals, people who do not work hard and who expect a hand out instead. If you would look at charity for example I think you would find that American evangelicals are very generous in this sense. Personal charity, giving to people who you know or believe to be in legitimate need of help is a Christian act. State sponsored wellfare then is different or differentiated from charity among Evangelicals. That would be my interpretation.

    My great grandfather was a deeply religious man, born in the late 1800s. He went around his village each christmas to try to collect food from the families there, this food he would then give to another family living in the village who didn't own any land and were basically living in starvation. At the same time, he had no sympathy for people who did not work to support themselves or didn't make an honest living with their hands. So there was that distinction, or paradox between charity on the one hand, and condemnation for those who did not pull their own weight or were undeserving due to their choice of occupation.

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    It's nonsense. Phil Zuckerman and Dan Cady make an Obama supporter out of Christ, by hijacking His teachings..

    They have a point when talking about the death penalty and greed, corporate or otherwise - and that's it.

    And yet Evangelicals are the most supportive of corporate greed and capitalistic excess, and they are the most opposed to institutional help for the nation’s poor — especially poor children.
    Did Christ ever talk about the need for a system of social security?

    Yes, it's unchristian to sit on a heap of money and not invest it back into society, or to simply desire more, more, more - but traditionally speaking a wealthy christian is seen as someone who is under God's good graces.

    They hate anything that smacks of ‘socialism’, even though that is essentially what their Savior preached.
    Christ put the emphasis on charity - you don't need the government for that. Charity is warm and personal, while receiving a monthly living wage from the state is a cold, anonymous and merely bureacratic process. It takes away the Christian essence of what it means to truly help your brother - and helps to make social democrats feel good about themselves and to be blind for their own egoism.

    I'm in favor of a strong system of social security, yet this preference has little to do with my faith - and more with my socialist and nationalist orientation. I also realize that enforced solidarity is not enough, on the contrary, it could be very negative for a society as a whole in the long run.

    They despise food stamp programs,
    To keep you poor and in your place. Food stamps are part of the problem in most cases, perhaps less in war time or during a nation wide catastrophe. But even then they're simply a temporary annoyance that has to be endured.

    subsidies for schools
    To keep you dumb, easy to control, and to fill your head with ideas that are in essence more unchristian than anything this article mentions.

    hospitals
    To kill more children in the womb of their mothers - and inject the elderly with lethal poison.

    job training
    Yes, definitely, Christ died on the cross so you could receive job training.

    militarism
    Militarism isn't the same thing as warmongering. And in peace time, a militarized nation means tons of jobs (and a form of respect from society) for the poor (that would be otherwise hard for them to attain) the same people the authors seem to care so much about.

    gun possession
    I wpuld love to hear the biblical quote in support of a monopoly of violence for the state. Didn't the apostles carry knives?
    “Traditionally, sex has been a very private, secretive activity. Herein perhaps lies its powerful force for uniting people in a strong bond. As we make sex less secretive, we may rob it of its power to hold men and women together.” - Thomas Szasz, “The Second Sin”

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    Oh there's plenty of degeneracy in the evangelical movement, it has all elements.

    I despise it because of it's fervent equality doctrines but then again Catholics and Atheists are worse in that regard so in the end I can't say it's an issue unique to evangelicals to which I despise them for. The heathens are just as bad on PC-equality madness if not much, much worse.

    On the issue of race mixing to which I care deeply I'll take a fervent Catholic or evangelical over an atheist or heathen any day.....

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    Ah, the joys of organized religion.

    I'm in no way surprised by these results.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chlodovech View Post
    Yes, definitely, Christ died on the cross so you could receive job training.
    Goddamn you, Chlodovech. Our opinions might differ, but that one had me laughing until I nearly spat coffee all over my laptop.
    Last edited by Lady Vengeance; Wednesday, April 27th, 2011 at 05:09 PM. Reason: spelling!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chlodovech View Post
    It's nonsense. Phil Zuckerman and Dan Cady make an Obama supporter out of Christ, by hijacking His teachings..

    They have a point when talking about the death penalty and greed, corporate or otherwise - and that's it.



    Did Christ ever talk about the need for a system of social security?

    Yes, it's unchristian to sit on a heap of money and not invest it back into society, or to simply desire more, more, more - but traditionally speaking a wealthy christian is seen as someone who is under God's good graces.



    Christ put the emphasis on charity - you don't need the government for that. Charity is warm and personal, while receiving a monthly living wage from the state is a cold, anonymous and merely bureacratic process. It takes away the Christian essence of what it means to truly help your brother - and helps to make social democrats feel good about themselves and to be blind for their own egoism.

    I'm in favor of a strong system of social security, yet this preference has little to do with my faith - and more with my socialist and nationalist orientation. I also realize that enforced solidarity is not enough, on the contrary, it could be very negative for a society as a whole in the long run.

    Militarism isn't the same thing as warmongering. And in peace time, a militarized nation means tons of jobs (and a form of respect from society) for the poor (that would be otherwise hard for them to attain) the same people the authors seem to care so much about.

    I wpuld love to hear the biblical quote in support of a monopoly of violence for the state. Didn't the apostles carry knives?
    The difference between a welfare system and private charity is certainly a valid point. I do seem to remember reading (somewhere) that there is considerably more private charity in the Red states of America which goes hand in hand with opposition to government welfare. Conversively, in Blue states private charity is on a much smaller scale, presumably because the people there consider it obsolete or redundant in a modern society, which is supposed to have government welfare in place.

    However, I simply do not understand how anyone can consider themselves to be Christians and still own a gun and advocate the use or even existence of a military. Jesus preached unconditional pacifism, even requiring Peter to lay down his sword when the Temple guards came to arrest him. As best as I can tell any kind of violence, even in self-defence, is clearly prohibited by the Bible.
    State monopoly of violence is certainly not something to be found in a 2000 year old text, but unconditional Pacifism is.

    And what of family? Evangelical Christians claim that their religion is strong on family values, but look at the teachings and example of Jesus. He stated that unless you hated your father you weren't a good Christian.
    It was obviously the aim of Jesus to establish a fellowship built not on family but allegiance to him and this allegiance was very anti-family.
    He also stated that if you weren't already married, you shouldn't bother getting married as the end of the world was near.

    Which of course leads me to my final point: Jesus expected the world to come to an end within the lifetime of the Apostles. Therefore, he advised them to abandon their families and all worthly possesions in order to prepare for the end of the world. He wasn't looking to provide a guideline for living a wholesome life in his own society and certainly not ours either.
    Which is why Evangelical Christians don't really look to the New Testament or the example of Jesus when deciding social and political issues. Instead, they resort to tradition (for lack of a better word) and legitimise this by claiming that it is mandated by Gospel even though it clearly isn't.

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