Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 11 to 15 of 15

Thread: Frisian & English: Comparisons & Contrasts

  1. #11
    Moderator "Friend of Germanics"
    Skadi Funding Member

    Sigurd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Last Online
    1 Day Ago @ 08:36 PM
    Status
    Available
    Ethnicity
    German
    Ancestry
    Bavarii, Saxones, Suebi, Alamanni
    Subrace
    Borreby + Atlantonordoid
    Country
    Germany Germany
    Location
    Einöde in den Alpen
    Gender
    Age
    31
    Zodiac Sign
    Libra
    Family
    Engaged
    Politics
    Tradition & Homeland
    Religion
    Odinist
    Posts
    9,109
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    73
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    217
    Thanked in
    127 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by velvet View Post
    German Platt knows "schnacken" for chatting, also in more northern regions spelled "snacken".
    English also knows "snack" which is thought to be etymologically related as euphemistic explanation for a light hearted 'tete a tete', often best had over a small meal.
    -In kalte Schatten versunken... /Germaniens Volk erstarrt / Gefroren von Lügen / In denen die Welt verharrt-
    -Die alte Seele trauernd und verlassen / Verblassend in einer erklärbaren Welt / Schwebend in einem Dunst der Wehmut / Ein Schrei der nur unmerklich gellt-
    -Auch ich verspüre Demut / Vor dem alten Geiste der Ahnen / Wird es mir vergönnt sein / Gen Walhalla aufzufahren?-

    (Heimdalls Wacht, In kalte Schatten versunken, stanzas 4-6)

  2. #12
    Senior Member velvet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Last Online
    8 Hours Ago @ 08:04 AM
    Status
    Available
    Ethnicity
    German
    Ancestry
    Northern Germany
    Subrace
    Faelid
    Country
    Germany Germany
    State
    North Rhine-Westphalia North Rhine-Westphalia
    Gender
    Age
    46
    Zodiac Sign
    Sagittarius
    Family
    Married
    Occupation
    Pestilent Supremacy
    Politics
    Blut und Boden
    Religion
    Fimbulwinter
    Posts
    4,893
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    1,196
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    1,297
    Thanked in
    553 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by +Suomut+
    Velvet, please reply to my query over the apparently modern Deut. (WHICH VARIETY? ) term 'Fenn.' ...
    Duden says it is north-German (Lower Saxony, Schleswig-Holstein, Ostfriesland, MeckPomm?), but I assume that it only vanished in more inland regions due to that most moores have been artificially dried out over the last 100 years or so and thus the specific word to describe the nature of this sort of land was no longer needed.

    I remember though, as a child, we had a small "Fenn" (heath moore) nearby (got dried out and some houses have been built upon...), also the city I lived in until end of last year has a protected heathland and ground water park, containing indeed peat-moores still. Heathland is a very common form of landscape up there in the north, being part moore, part peat, part "dry" (in summer), often featuring small lakes in between (quite dangerous to walk through if you dont know that form of landscape due to the moore "pits" hiding under small shrubs of heaths), the traditional lea / grazing land for Heidschnucken. Again, I remember, as a child, shepherds wandered around from one of those special heathlands to the next, because on them grew the special grasses and heaths (in German called Erika) and other plants those sheeps preferred. I eagerly awaited the shepherd arriving in spring with his small herd and those mysteriously well trained and very nice dogs guarding them.

    However, some 30 years ago heathland did still exist also more inland, and in some few protected parks it still does.

    One can trace the term through place names:


    Spelling variants:

    Fenn, Venn, Fehn, Vehn, Feen



    „Fenn“


    * Fenn, Naturschutzgebiet im Kreis Stendal
    * Fenne, ein Ort in der Warndt-Region
    * Fennsee (Wilmersdorf), ein See in Berlin
    * Fennsee (Westhavelland), ein See in Brandenburg
    * Fenn-See, ein See bei Damsdorf, Gemeinde Kloster Lehnin in Brandenburg
    * Großes Fenn, ein Naturschutzgebiet in Berlin
    * Großes Fenn, ehemaliges Sumpfgebiet in Berlin, siehe Rudolph-Wilde-Park
    * Großes Fenn und Kleines Fenn, Straßen in Ferchesar, Brandenburg
    * Fennberg, eine Landschaft im Südtiroler Unterland mit Ortsteilen der Gemeinden Margreid und Kurtatsch
    * Fennpfuhl, ein Ortsteil im Berliner Bezirk Lichtenberg
    * Fennpfuhlpark, ein Park in Berlin-Lichtenberg
    * Hundekehlefenn, Naturschutzgebiet der Berliner Grunewaldseenkette
    * Krummes Fenn, ein Landschaftsschutzgebiet in Berlin-Zehlendorf
    * Langes Fenn, ehemaliges Gelände des künstlich angelegten Koenigssees, Berlin
    * Mahlpfuhler Fenn, FFH und Naturschutzgebiet in Sachsen-Anhalt, in der Nähe von Tangerhütte, 1210ha groß.
    * Moosfenn, ein Hochmoor südlich von Potsdam in der Nähe des Großen Ravensberges (Landkreis-Potsdam-Mittelmark)
    * Plagefenn, Hochmoor im Biosphärenreservat Schorfheide-Chorin
    * Poschfenn, Flachwassersee im Brandenburger Naturpark Nuthe-Nieplitz
    * Riemeisterfenn, Naturschutzgebiet der Berliner Grunewaldseenkette
    * Rundes Fenn, ehemaliges Gelände des künstlich angelegten Herthasees, Berlin
    * Torffenn, ehemaliges Gelände des künstlich angelegten Hubertussees, Berlin


    „Venn“

    * Amtsvenn, Moorgebiet im Münsterland
    * Gildehauser Venn
    * Hohes Venn
    * Schwarzes Venn zwischen Heiden und Maria Veen im Naturpark Hohe Mark
    * Venn, Naturschutzgebiet in Emsdetten
    * Venn, Stadtteil von Mönchengladbach
    * Vennhausen, Stadtteil von Düsseldorf
    * Venner Moor in Senden
    * Weißes Venn bei Haltern im Naturpark Hohe Mark
    * Zwillbrocker Venn, Naturschutzgebiet in Vreden


    „Ven" / „Veen“

    * Veenhusen, Ort in Ostfriesland
    * Heerenveen, Ort in der nl. Provinz Friesland
    * Veendam, als Siedlung von Torfstechern entstandene Stadt in den Niederlanden
    * Venlo, Stadt in den Niederlanden (Toponymie unsicher)
    * Veen, Dorf der Gemeinde Alpen (Gemeinde), in der Nähe von Xanten am linken Niederrhein
    * Hoogeveen, Stadt in den Niederlanden
    * Maria Veen, Ortsteil von Reken


    „Fehn“

    * Augustfehn, Ort in der Gemeinde Apen bei Oldenburg
    * Beningafehn, Ortsteil der Gemeinde Hesel in Ostfriesland
    * Elisabethfehn, Ort im Landkreis Cloppenburg
    * Friedrichsfehn, Ort im Ammerland
    * Großefehn, Ort in Ostfriesland
    * Ihlowerfehn, Ort in Ostfriesland
    * Jheringsfehn, Ort in Ostfriesland
    * Lübbertsfehn, Ort in Ostfriesland
    * Neukamperfehn, Ort in Ostfriesland
    * Rhauderfehn, Ort in Ostfriesland
    * Spetzerfehn, Ortsteil der Gemeinde Großefehn
    * Völlenerfehn, Ort in Ostfriesland
    * Warsingsfehn, Ortsteil der Gemeinde Moormerland in Ostfriesland


    other spellings:

    * Venusberg, Stadtteil von Bonn (Der Name leitet sich von Fenn-Berg ab, da es sich um ein ehemaliges Hochmoorgebiet handelt)
    * Fensdorf, eine Gemeinde im Westerwald
    * Die Fens, eine Moorlandschaft in Ostengland

    (where is to note that Venus most likely does not come from Fen, but indeed from Venus, a not that uncommon name for hills/mountains going back to pre-christian times; but that's another topic, and, it wouldnt even really exclude each other since Venus is a fertility goddess and Fenns feature an almost fantastic collection of plants mostly unknown to other landscape forms; those two terms may have a deeper relation).

    One can see though that the term Fen/Fenn/Venn was even known as far down as South Tyrol, just the subsequent vanishing of this form of landscape also made the term dissappear, leaving it in those regions which still have them in higher frequency, ie northern Germany.
    Ein Leben ist nichts, deine Sprosse sind alles
    Aller Sturm nimmt nichts, weil dein Wurzelgriff zu stark ist
    und endet meine Frist, weiss ich dass du noch da bist
    Gefürchtet von der Zeit, mein Baum, mein Stamm in Ewigkeit

    my signature

  3. #13
    Aka kentynet Northumbria's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Last Online
    Saturday, May 13th, 2017 @ 12:06 AM
    Status
    Available
    Ethnicity
    English
    Ancestry
    Mainly English, some Irish
    Subrace
    Nord-Atlantid
    Y-DNA
    R1B-L48
    Country
    England England
    State
    Northumberland Northumberland
    Location
    The North
    Gender
    Zodiac Sign
    Capricorn
    Politics
    Right-wing
    Posts
    95
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    1
    Thanked in
    1 Post
    Here's the etymology of the mod. Eng. "wold," y'all: "--> from the Middle Eng. 'wald' and 'wold' (2 different spellings apparently common) --> from the Ang.-Sax. 'weald' and 'wald' both meaning, of course 'forest' and akin to the Althochdeutsch 'wald' (forest)." In Ang.-Sax. beyond meaning 'forest' 'weald' also could mean: (of course) 'wood(s)', grove, bushes, or any kind of foliage. Northumbria aptly defines/quotes what the MODERN meaning of 'wold(s)' is in English, but in my mind it's quite sad that it NO LONGER means 'forest'/'wood(s)', because IT SHOULD, but the course of centuries has caused Eng.-speakers to 'pervert'/INVERT this term into the EXACT OPPOSITE! with a meaning like "open country" (fields) when its ORIGINAL/TRUE form/meaning is NON!-open country. I don't mean this as a slight against English folks or Eng.-speakers, because I am MOSTLY ENGLISH BY 'BLOOD' (and am ELATED! to be ) , but this massive, opposite change in meaning was super screwed-up> (:-\
    'Weald' still means wood in those areas of England where it is used, but 'Wold' is quite devoid of trees.
    The Weald is actually thickly wooded by English standards. The Old Norse term which means 'plain' is very different too.

    You have to remember that England isn't really a wooded country (although the hedges and hedgerow trees make it look deceptively more wooded than it actually is), there's always been good pasture or arable to be had.
    Where woods do exist in England they have been coppiced (managed for renewable wood), but there are a few which have barely been touched.

    More important terms in English probably describe moorland, marshland and heathland. Large areas of England were wetlands when the Anglo-Saxons arrived and generally similar to the Netherlands throughout much of the East.

    Heathland is a very common form of landscape up there in the north, being part moore, part peat, part "dry" (in summer), often featuring small lakes in between (quite dangerous to walk through if you dont know that form of landscape due to the moore "pits" hiding under small shrubs of heaths), the traditional lea / grazing land for Heidschnucken.
    These landscapes are quite common in England, generally Moors in the North and Heaths in the South.

    A moor is usually composed of heather and a few shrubs and is in the hills, heathland has less heather and a wider variety of shrubs and wildlife. Both are quite similar though.
    The wet areas where you can sink are called 'Bogs' and you can try to avoid them by looking out for cotton grass and sphagnum moss.

    Again, I remember, as a child, shepherds wandered around from one of those special heathlands to the next, because on them grew the special grasses and heaths (in German called Erika)
    That is quite interesting, the scientific name of Heather is 'Ericae' (something like that).
    It's also interesting how both 'Erika' and 'Heather' can be used as names for names by women.


    Moorland and Heathland were traditionally used for sheep grazing here too, and the trees and dead wood for fire wood and the habitat as a whole for game. Peat was also used as fuel.

    Apart from farmland, moorland, heaths and marshes were always quite important habitats here. This post will give you a good idea as to how the English countryside looks, it goes from pastoral to heathland.

    This post will give you a general idea of how NW Europeans utilised the landscape up until the medieval period.

  4. #14
    Eala Freia Fresena
    "Friend of Germanics"
    Skadi Funding Member

    Ocko's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Last Online
    Monday, July 29th, 2019 @ 12:24 PM
    Status
    Available
    Ethnicity
    Friese
    Ancestry
    Friesland
    Subrace
    Nordid
    Country
    United States United States
    State
    Montana Montana
    Location
    Glacier park
    Gender
    Family
    Married
    Occupation
    selfemployed
    Politics
    rightwing
    Religion
    none/pagan
    Posts
    2,924
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    1
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    22
    Thanked in
    20 Posts
    The ending -ing denotes a clan or 'son of'

    Last names like

    Nanninga, Haddenga, Laninga, Etc,

    Indicates the clan/Sippe

    In England those clan names were used to name sites like: brytfordinga, Cystaninga (Keston in Kent). Etc.
    weel nich will dieken dej mot wieken

  5. #15
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Last Online
    Friday, November 25th, 2016 @ 10:08 AM
    Ethnicity
    German
    Ancestry
    Germany Denmark USA
    Country
    United States United States
    Gender
    Family
    Single adult
    Occupation
    Health care
    Politics
    National Socialist
    Religion
    Heathen/Asatru
    Posts
    237
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    0
    Thanked in
    0 Posts
    Might I suggest that besides writing the frisian words properly, you write, perhaps in parentheses, next to it how they would be written by an english speaker who only wrote what he heard as he would write an unknown english word without having seen it written? It would make it much easier to compare the two. I use an example. I am german. I can follow spoken dutch. But it is much harder to read it than to understand it spoken. Because the dutch and germans write even the same word in a different way. I use the example of "vrijheid". "Freiheit". The word for freedom. And even words that are slightly different when spoken. "Gezondheid", "Gesundheit", (health) It would be much more clear that "gesondheit" meant "Gesundheit" and that "freiheit" meant "Freiheit" than if you write them properly. It's probably the same with frisian/english comparisons.

    Just my two cents.
    Das Recht und die Gerechtigkeit haben nur selten miteinander etwas zu tun. Höchstens machen sie winki winki wenn sie aneinander vorbei gehen.
    The Law and Justice have only seldom anything to do with one another. At the most they wave at each other when they pass one another on the street.
    Niemals vergessen. Niemals vergeben.

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 0
    Last Post: Tuesday, October 10th, 2017, 01:47 PM
  2. Comparisons & Ignorance
    By Elysium in forum Modern
    Replies: 16
    Last Post: Saturday, November 24th, 2007, 12:10 AM
  3. Replies: 0
    Last Post: Sunday, February 5th, 2006, 02:21 AM
  4. Yule & Christmas: Origin & Comparisons
    By Rachel in forum Germanic Heathenry
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: Saturday, February 12th, 2005, 02:13 PM
  5. Dutch & English Study Group
    By Siegmund in forum Linguistics
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: Friday, November 5th, 2004, 04:16 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •