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Thread: Food Reform: Senate Bill S510 Makes It Illegal to Grow, Share, Trade or Sell Homegrown Food, or Even to Produce Your Own Food

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    Senior Member SaxonCeorl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wittwer View Post
    To say that the implementation of regulations and controls to protect the Public's Safety and Health by securing the food chain because it violates one's Freedom of action (or commercial activity) is irresponsible at best.
    We don't need anything more than light government regulation of the food chain; the free market will regulate it just fine. Remember Chi-Chi's restaurant? Remember the Hepatitis outbreak linked to them? People stopped going there, and now they're out of business. Which is a shame, because they made one mean taco.

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    Senior Member wittwer's Avatar
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    Food safety

    Yeah, right, the "Free Market" will solve all our problems... Just like it did when the World Financial Industry went into free fall and meltdown. I and millions of others like me are certainly not going to lay our Health and Safety on the Altar of the "Free Market" as controlled by the "Priests of Corruption"...

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    Senior Member SaxonCeorl's Avatar
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    Yeah, thank God the Government swooped in and fixed everything with the bailout. Oh wait...

    In general, people need to stop being so damn scared to live life. There are bad things that happen in this world. Sometimes food gets contaminated and people die. If it does, let's fix it as a private society. It's no excuse to have government come in and bubble-wrap everything and surround us with padded walls.

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    Would not there be less chance of contamination if food was produced locally and consumed locally?

    There would only be risk of a local population eating contaminated food.

    Make no mistake about this bill, this is about government control. Sure, they may say it is for our protection is it really though? Remember those that trade Liberty for security deserve neither.

    I have been following Senate Bill S510 since it first came into being. I have read the whole bill numerous times. To say the least it nothing more than a new way to tax people. To say the worst it is about control of every life in the country through control of the food.

    If you want to find out who is really behind this bill then follow the money. The money trail ends with large food produces(large mega corps.). They want to make sure that people are only buying their products. No more real food raised by real people, that is the agenda behind it.
    Life is like a fire hydrant- sometimes you help people put out their fires, but most of the time you just get peed on by every dog in the neighborhood.

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    Senior Member wittwer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpearBrave View Post
    Would not there be less chance of contamination if food was produced locally and consumed locally?

    There would only be risk of a local population eating contaminated food.

    Make no mistake about this bill, this is about government control. Sure, they may say it is for our protection is it really though? Remember those that trade Liberty for security deserve neither.

    I have been following Senate Bill S510 since it first came into being. I have read the whole bill numerous times. To say the least it nothing more than a new way to tax people. To say the worst it is about control of every life in the country through control of the food.

    If you want to find out who is really behind this bill then follow the money. The money trail ends with large food produces(large mega corps.). They want to make sure that people are only buying their products. No more real food raised by real people, that is the agenda behind it.
    Local production and consumption would be nice. The fact of the matter is that local operations only produce a very narrow product line and are not capable of year round production. Which results in shortages or missing product altogether at times. The Ag business has long since gone National and now International. Of all the self sufficency Farmers I've ever heard of, the majority have called it quits. And the local production Farmers & Markets have become nothing more than small "Food Boutiques".

    The current U.S. population is approx. 311 million, the World's population approx. 6.85 billion. Can local small farm operations feed this level of population on a local daily basis? I think not. As for the taxation issue, this is a Congressionally mandated requirement for Agencies to become self financing so that the Individual's personal income tax is not increased to cover Corporate or Private operations. This self financing "tax" is a fee asessed to the user of the Dep't. services, not the individual taxpayer. "But like most taxes and fees they give it back with one hand and take it away with the other".

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    Quote Originally Posted by wittwer View Post
    Local production and consumption would be nice. The fact of the matter is that local operations only produce a very narrow product line and are not capable of year round production. Which results in shortages or missing product altogether at times. The Ag business has long since gone National and now International. Of all the self sufficency Farmers I've ever heard of, the majority have called it quits. And the local production Farmers & Markets have become nothing more than small "Food Boutiques".
    Have you read the bill? It is a attack on the small farmer. They want to destroy all ways of a free market through over regulation. I am very aware that not all the food can be produced locally, I grew up on a farm, own a farm, and am surrounded by farms. This bill is aimed at killing the small individual farmer( meaning free man ). I will explain that in my next response to your post.

    On the larger scale of things farmers will only be allowed to sell to certain markets and the those markets will be controlled as well. That is not Ag business but Ag socialism.

    Also I am very aware of the "farmers markets" and how and why they operate. How should growing and selling my surplus hurt anyone. This bill is just another big government/business scheme to force people to buy certain products. The next step in this saying you can't grow and store your own food. Thus controlling the food supply and making sure you rely on big business/government for your existence.

    In the end it reduces the farmer to the status of serf on his own land. Or worse yet a large communal co-op where the farmer works for the government.

    This type of intrusion on our rights is the major cause of the decline of free Americans.
    The current U.S. population is approx. 311 million, the World's population approx. 6.85 billion. Can local small farm operations feed this level of population on a local daily basis? I think not. As for the taxation issue, this is a Congressionally mandated requirement for Agencies to become self financing so that the Individual's personal income tax is not increased to cover Corporate or Private operations. This self financing "tax" is a fee asessed to the user of the Dep't. services, not the individual taxpayer. "But like most taxes and fees they give it back with one hand and take it away with the other".
    About the taxation issue no it does not plan to increase personal income tax. It plans on the small farmer paying a license fee(tax) to subsidize the whole program.

    I would be one of the ones paying that tax as would most of my neighbors.

    If I have to pay this tax, I will pass that cost onto the consumer( individual taxpayer), so yes it directly effects everybody.

    In the end can you show me where in the Constution it allows the government to pass and enact such laws?
    Life is like a fire hydrant- sometimes you help people put out their fires, but most of the time you just get peed on by every dog in the neighborhood.

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    Quote Originally Posted by wittwer
    Local production and consumption would be nice. The fact of the matter is that local operations only produce a very narrow product line and are not capable of year round production. Which results in shortages or missing product altogether at times.
    It is really surprising how man lived tens of thousands of years without supply of mega co-ops. It's a real miracle

    Quote Originally Posted by wittwer
    The Ag business has long since gone National and now International. Of all the self sufficency Farmers I've ever heard of, the majority have called it quits. And the local production Farmers & Markets have become nothing more than small "Food Boutiques".
    Don't know about America, but in Europe, EU, actively destroys small farmers. There is ONE seed producer who holds patents (wtf???) on seeds, farmers can only sell products from these seeds, and it is even illegal for them to keep their own seeds. They are forced to buy the seeds each year anew, and only the subsidising of farmers - from which small farmers are excluded btw - allows them to "survive".

    This is called "food chain security". The truth is that this seed producer sells GMO seeds without that it would be declared as such, because the gene-manipulated seeds then grow "normally" on fields. Noone knows the side effects of gene-manipulated veggies and grains. They're pumped full with growth hormones, just like all the "save" cattle where it is known that consumption of this sort of meat can cause infertility in humans and cancer and all sorts of other "unexpected" reactions, but farmers are forced to use them. I'm pretty sure that this is the same in the USA, and if not yet, this bill is the startup to implement it.

    The only thing secured with this bill, or with the regulations in Europe, is the profits of the GMO producers. "Food chain savety" is nothing but the dictation of the food chain. It has nothing to do with "food savety".

    And again, read up about the Codex Alimentarius, there is a thread somewhere here about it with links to further information. This codex is enforced throughout the first world nations, it limits vitamines to be sold by chemistries only, using certain dosises is illegal (this might even lead to that you can buy some things, like sage and other high vitamine fruits and veggies, only against proscription, if at all), wild herbs will become illegal to use and so on. Can you explain me what this has to do with "food savety"? It is the exact opposite. This codex is designed to leave first world nations with massive under and male nutrition. Check any random water analysis of a local water supplier (if by any chance possible not their own analysis). There are highly toxic things in it, which arent even checked for thanks to this codex that allows unhealthy amounts of toxics and hormones, while it limits vitamines and vital minerals. Genocide anyone?

    Quote Originally Posted by wittwer
    The current U.S. population is approx. 311 million, the World's population approx. 6.85 billion.
    Bullshit argument. These 311mio people do not live in ONE single place, there is space enough for local farms. And there is no need to transport food thousands of kilometers.

    And even less there is need to feed the world population. When they're unable to feed themselves, then they maybe shouldnt reproduce so much. It is exactly the "world feed programme" that breeds an endless supply of immigrants into first world nations. How long do you think America and Europe will still be first world when it is full of third world immigrants?

    Quote Originally Posted by wittwer
    Can local small farm operations feed this level of population on a local daily basis? I think not.
    It has been that way for thousands of years, since humans developed agriculture. The local farmer(s) supplied the local population. Worked basically good, until someone (a landlord, the church, a government...) "added" himself to the food supply chain as a parasite and started to regulate his income from other people's work.
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    Anybody who believes for second that any American is going to give up
    there right to grow their own Produce is only trying to fool themselves!
    Since the 1980's our Government has been at war with the Farmers of
    this country in order to consolidate farming and put it into the hands
    of Big Business.Since that has happened alot of our food you purchase
    at your local SuperMarket comes from Mexico and is not fit to eat.

    You know i'm going to create my own form of Codex Alimentarius and
    it will be called Codex GOF*CKYOURSELF!

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    Senior Member Thorodinssohn's Avatar
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    I have read the bill in its entirety, and while in its current form it does not limit the rights of private individuals to consume what they have grown for personal consumption, it does severely limit programs such as CSA's, Farmer's Markets and roadside stands. It allows for deployment of law enforcement, including national guard to enforce the limits on the movement of food outside the law. Yet another basic freedom sacrificed to the almighty interstate commerce clause.

    I implore all of you who know or are law enforcement officials or military personnel to read these "Orders we will NOT obey" from a non-profit organization called Oath Keepers:

    1. We will NOT obey orders to disarm the American people.

    2. We will NOT obey orders to conduct warrantless searches of the American people

    3. We will NOT obey orders to detain American citizens as “unlawful enemy combatants” or to subject them to military tribunal.

    4. We will NOT obey orders to impose martial law or a “state of emergency” on a state.

    5. We will NOT obey orders to invade and subjugate any state that asserts its sovereignty.

    6. We will NOT obey any order to blockade American cities, thus turning them into giant concentration camps.

    7. We will NOT obey any order to force American citizens into any form of detention camps under any pretext.

    8. We will NOT obey orders to assist or support the use of any foreign troops on U.S. soil against the American people to “keep the peace” or to “maintain control."

    9. We will NOT obey any orders to confiscate the property of the American people, including food and other essential supplies.

    10.We will NOT obey any orders which infringe on the right of the people to free speech, to peaceably assemble, and to petition their government for a redress of grievances.

    Pay specific attention to number two, number five and number nine. All of these are in jeopardy under this bill, which allows for the confiscation of "illegal" food, warrantless searches of people and businesses suspected or accused of possessing and distributing "illegal food" and a direct assault on the sovereignty of the States by the FDA.

    It is important that anyone who has taken an oath to the service of the United States understands what it does and does not entail. If they refuse to cooperate in the subjugation of the American people, then the bill falls on its face. Explain it to any friends or relatives you have who are in service to the people of the United States.
    We must be mad, literally mad, as a nation to be permitting the annual inflow of some 50,000 dependants, who are for the most part the material of the future growth of the immigrant descended population. -Enoch Powell

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    Senior Member wittwer's Avatar
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    Food Safety & Security

    These particuliar clauses you refer to in the Bill regarding the policing of Food, applies in times of National, State or Local Emergencies where Martial Law needs to be imposed (by Court Order) in order to recreate and/or maintain order. This is just a Federal reiteration of State Law that controls the movement and commercial aspects of any commodity during Emergencies to control Black Markets and assure equal access to commodities such as water, food and energy.

    As for the Constitutionality of the current piece of legislation, The Constitution under the "Commerce Clause" Art. I, Sec.8, Clause 3 and the "Necessary & Proper Clause" Art. I, Sec.8, Clause 18, allows for the enactment and enforcement of legislation for the security and wellbeing of the Nation. These particuliar applications vis a vis legislation have been further enhanced and developed by the Supreme Court Case, "McCulloch vs Maryland" and in the explanations developed in the Federalist Papers No.33 and No.44.

    As for the historical antecedents of this Bill, this has been a work in progress for over 100 years. It starts with the "Pure Food & Drug Act" of 1906 and has been amended and added to by the "Meat Inspection Act"; "Food, Drug & Cosmetic Act" and "Food Quality Protection Act". The current Bill, is just a continuation of these efforts to secure, protect, and ensure the safety and healthfulness of America's Food Supply well into the 21st Century.

    Have I seen the Bill? Yes. Copies of it were sent to the various State & County Agricultural Offices in our State for review and comment by Durbin's Office prior to release by the Committee.

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