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Thread: Islamist Leader Tells Aussie Muslims to 'Shun Democracy'

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    Islamist Leader Tells Aussie Muslims to 'Shun Democracy'

    LEADERS of the global Islamist group Hizb ut-Tahrir have called on Australian Muslims to spurn secular democracy and Western notions of moderate Islam and join the struggle for a transnational Islamic state.
    British Hizb ut-Tahrir leader Burhan Hanif told participants at a conference in western Sydney yesterday that democracy is "haram" (forbidden) for Muslims, whose political engagement should be be based purely on Islamic law.

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    At least he is consequent. Islam and democracy are incompatible (and there is nothing wrong with it). As I wrote once already: I don't see what's so exciting about the fallacy that the majority has a patent on the truth.

    We should actually ponder ourselves whether "representative democracy" and "parliamentarism" constitute the best imaginable form of government and all we can come up with.

    Political parties appear to be outdated. In addition, the role, power, composition, duties and limits of the mass media are nowhere constitutionally regulated. The influence of "the fourth power" has multiplied in the last 200 years, in particular since the advent of radio and television.

    As if donations to candidates and financial lobbying wouldn't be bad enough already, the influence of the mass media converts whatever is left of "democracy" into the power of those who are able to effect significant changes in the voting behavior and who have the power to change, over years and generations, the values held by the majority.

    Since it takes an enormous amount of money to operate national or even international TV stations, that's plutocracy at its finest.

    Like the slave who believes he is free, the citizen who thinks he has a choice is wrong. The grip the mass media have on our society is probably the single most important and destructive factor responsible for the dissolution of the Western civilization as we knew it.
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    Right On!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Thorburn View Post
    At least he is consequent. Islam and democracy are incompatible (and there is nothing wrong with it). As I wrote once already: I don't see what's so exciting about the fallacy that the majority has a patent on the truth.

    We should actually ponder ourselves whether "representative democracy" and "parliamentarism" constitute the best imaginable form of government and all we can come up with.

    Political parties appear to be outdated. In addition, the role, power, composition, duties and limits of the mass media are nowhere constitutionally regulated. The influence of "the fourth power" has multiplied in the last 200 years, in particular since the advent of radio and television.

    As if donations to candidates and financial lobbying wouldn't be bad enough already, the influence of the mass media converts whatever is left of "democracy" into the power of those who are able to effect significant changes in the voting behavior and who have the power to change, over years and generations, the values held by the majority.

    Since it takes an enormous amount of money to operate national or even international TV stations, that's plutocracy at its finest.

    Like the slave who believes he is free, the citizen who thinks he has a choice is wrong. The grip the mass media have on our society is probably the single most important and destructive factor responsible for the dissolution of the Western civilization as we knew it.
    Democracy's best shot got us into the mess we find ourselves in now!!
    I think the SF writer Robert Heinlein had it right : Only Military Veterans
    should have the right to vote, that's Veterans that served in combat zones,
    not some clerk/typist that served in Nebraska.
    Kudos to the Lady who's Signature is Heinlein"s famous Quote about
    an Armed Society.
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    Ex Gladio Libertas ! Μολών λαβέ !
    Si vis pacem, Para bellum !
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    Quote Originally Posted by arcticdoctor View Post
    Democracy's best shot got us into the mess we find ourselves in now!!
    I think the SF writer Robert Heinlein had it right : Only Military Veterans
    should have the right to vote, that's Veterans that served in combat zones,
    not some clerk/typist that served in Nebraska.
    Kudos to the Lady who's Signature is Heinlein"s famous Quote about
    an Armed Society.
    I know right why shouldn't they shun democracy and who cares if they do, its a system that leaves how a nation is governed up to the common man and alongside of him the screw up.

    If we and the Islamists have common enemies in the screw ups, high school drop outs and democracy as a system I say kudos to that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thorburn View Post
    At least he is consequent. Islam and democracy are incompatible (and there is nothing wrong with it). As I wrote once already: I don't see what's so exciting about the fallacy that the majority has a patent on the truth.

    We should actually ponder ourselves whether "representative democracy" and "parliamentarism" constitute the best imaginable form of government and all we can come up with.

    Political parties appear to be outdated. In addition, the role, power, composition, duties and limits of the mass media are nowhere constitutionally regulated. The influence of "the fourth power" has multiplied in the last 200 years, in particular since the advent of radio and television.

    As if donations to candidates and financial lobbying wouldn't be bad enough already, the influence of the mass media converts whatever is left of "democracy" into the power of those who are able to effect significant changes in the voting behavior and who have the power to change, over years and generations, the values held by the majority.

    Since it takes an enormous amount of money to operate national or even international TV stations, that's plutocracy at its finest.

    Like the slave who believes he is free, the citizen who thinks he has a choice is wrong. The grip the mass media have on our society is probably the single most important and destructive factor responsible for the dissolution of the Western civilization as we knew it.
    Whoever has the media connections and huge amounts of lobbying money gets to sway the system and elections wherever they see fit. Disgusting, just like political and cultural prostitution...
    "What is done out of love always takes place beyond good and evil." Friedrich Nietzche

    "Virtue - all virtue - is knowledge."
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    One thing that's very ironic is that in particular those advocates of "representative democracy" who prostitute themselves at every opportunity as super-democrats are typically also vehemently opposed to "direct democracy." The people, they argue, would be "too irresponsible" and "too much driven by emotions" to decide questions in a direct referendum which are of utmost importance or even affect their survival: such as the immigration issue. "Populist," "racist" and "xenophobe" politicians would allegedly mislead them. And so we are only allowed to choose between parties all of which more or less support the status quo and the current multi-cultural policies.

    It usually doesn't matter anymore if you vote for party A or party B or support movement C or candidate D. Some might be a bit more bearable than others, some might propose some more reasonable tax policies or wish to slow down immigration for a while (until the economy recovers), but none of the established parties plans to go into reverse. We usually only have the choice whether we'll rush over the cliffs with 50 or 80 mph.

    Actually, these self-proclaimed super-democrats don't even accept it if the people vote for parties whose functionaries don't belong to the same country clubs, lodges or synagogues than they and which are considered "undesired" because they disrupt their convenient political arrangements.

    When in Austria too many people took the liberty to vote for the Freedom Party -- wryly enough nothing more than a pseudo-nationalist opposition -- the EU imposed sanctions and a so-called "Council of the Wise" (no kidding, that's how it was called!) was brought into being whose purpose it was to police and watch the Freedom Party and the Austrian government and to assure that they wouldn't discriminate against non-Europeans or implement any xenophobic and racist policies.

    When in Belgium too many people decided to vote for the Flemish Bloc, it was simply banned on the charge of racism. How convenient to bar the winners of elections from representing its electorate.

    When the majority of Algerians voted for the FIS (Islamic Salvation Front), the electoral process was canceled, the president was forced to resign, the FIS was dissolved and 10,000's of its leaders and members were arrested.

    When the majority of the electorate in the Palestinian Territories voted for the Hamas which then formed the government, as it should in accordance with the provisional constitution ... I'm beginning to repeat myself.

    Even the "representative democracy" sold to us by the current world order is an absolute farce. Our right to choose and to vote is factually limited to those parties and organizations which promote the aims of the latter. Parties which don't are redlined in the best and banned and dissolved in the worst case. Woe to those who dare to deviate from this limited pluralism and who support political movements to whom democracy and the best for the people are not only a lip service.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thorburn View Post
    When in Belgium too many people decided to vote for the Flemish Bloc, it was simply banned on the charge of racism. How convenient to bar the winners of elections from representing its electorate.
    And when their successors, the Vlaams Belang, became so powerful that too many people decided to vote for them, the naturalisation time spans were simply lowered so ridiculously by the government just to ensure that they'd stay in power (since the ethnics wouldn't vote for them).

    Even the "representative democracy" sold to us by the current world order is an absolute farce. Our right to choose and to vote is factually limited to those parties and organizations which promote the aims of the latter.
    Essentially, it should be true aristocracy (note the root ar-, noble, going back to acre/farmer, representing the original ruling caste of Indo-Europeans). No, not about inherited gluttonous barons and viscounts and what not all, that is as outdated, but literally in the meaning of the word: the best. Those predestined to lead, arranging into a natural hierarchy than functions on two levels, horizontally as much as vertically.

    With a philosopher king (a Platonic take on the 'Führer principle') at its forefront. With the natural Alpha-Wolf (one for each pack), assisted by his Beta-Wolf (one for each pack), validated by their Gamma-1 wolves (approx. 5%) and validating upon them; so that the Gamma-2 wolves (approx. 95%) can lead their daily lives without fear of unsound decisions that affect them.

    What we have instead is not just plutocracy (reign of the few, in itself not an issue), but it is true cacistocracy (reign of the worst, in itself an issue). If it is the worst that reign, then this will rub off on the general populus, who will in turn become denizens of that rot, and will do anything to further spread it themselves. Gamma wolves follow by example anyway, it takes 95% of sheeple to follow 5% of a leading caste, if that leading caste is thoroughly rotten and destructive to the folk's interest, it threatens the very fabric of that folk.

    If the natural aristocratic (again, by the true meaning of the word) principle is applied correctly, however then this would automatically become much more democratic (in the true meaning of the word) since it would automatically represent the well-being of the folk, with the philosopher leaders knowing how to represent the wishes of the people to their best. The 95% of sheeple would still follow ... but they would follow a good example that is in the favour of that folk and which strengthens the very fabric of that folk.
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    Surely all Western nations must eventually wake up and expel violent, arrogant aliens like those muslims in Australia, or illegal mestizoes in my own country.
    Too optimistic, but I can dream of common sense solutions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by beowulf wodenson View Post
    Surely all Western nations must eventually wake up and expel violent, arrogant aliens like those muslims in Australia, or illegal mestizoes in my own country.
    Too optimistic, but I can dream of common sense solutions.
    I like to be alittle optimistic about this too, Islam belongs to the middle eastern arab and african cultures and maybe the militant mestizos who've been adopting it. Democracy is championed by the common man and it stinks but if they see what its like over here and how much guys like us despise it then why would they want to come to our part of the world to apply for citizenship in the first place?!

    Thinking about it this way makes the motives of immigrant muslims sound alittle suspucious.
    "What is done out of love always takes place beyond good and evil." Friedrich Nietzche

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    Actually, I'm fully supporting "Islamic fundamentalism" in Europe. I'm supporting that many more non-European Muslims immigrate to Europe and that they stay true to their Islamic culture and faith, yes, even strengthen it.

    I'm supporting the hijab in schools, at universities, in court rooms, and in all public institutions.

    I'm supporting that the parliament passes Draconian and vague "hate speech" laws threatening everyone who even remotely dares to criticize Islam, prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him), the Qur'an, the Shari'a, Muslims, their immigration, social welfare bestowed upon them, the construction of Mosques, religious slaughter, halal food, gender segregation, and any other religious or only cultural aspects of Islam with long-term imprisonment and that these laws are rigorously enforced.

    I'm supporting Mosques in every village and in every district of every town in the country. And may muezzins lead the call to prayer at 4 a.m. (or whenever the sun rises) from the minarets everywhere, enjoying the benefits of electronic amplification aids, so that their adhan wakes even the last native in the most remote valley of the country. And let all those who publicly or in front of several persons oppose this religious freedom be arrested and thrown in shekels into prison for preaching "religious hatred and intolerance."

    Our countries have been taken away from our Germanic peoples a long time ago, yet most people either don't realize or don't care. Such measures in combination with a real economic collapse might indeed be Europe's last chance to a wakening call leading to a second reconquista.

    It's time to take our countries back.
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