View Poll Results: Must love and loyalty towards family be unconditional?

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  • No.

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Thread: Must Love and Loyalty Towards Family Be Unconditional?

  1. #1
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    Must Love and Loyalty Towards Family Be Unconditional?

    A recent post of Bärin served as inspiration for this theme. I'm opening a new thread because it's off topic in the original one. Here the post I wanted to make a comment about:

    Quote Originally Posted by Bärin View Post
    The philosophy in Star Wars is one to be a traitor. The dark side isn't better than the force. They're both degenerates who act because of their personal interest not the good of the communities. Star Wars is a family soap opera, it's all about father-mother-son-daughter relationship, all who were too weak and let their emotional side interfere with their duty. Anakin left the Force to join the Sith, because he wanted to save Padme from dying, not because he really thought it was the right philosophy. When Luke Skywalker found out Darth Vader was formerly Anakin his father he couldn't do his duty and fight him and Darth Vader had a weakness for Luke too. The Emperor just played with their weakness for each other and he was ready to betray Vader and let him die if it meant to convert Luke. But Luke managed to convert Vader and Vader betrayed the dark side to save his son. This is to me a liberal mindset, the same one behind people who accept racemixing in their families and among friends because the feelings count more than the principles.
    http://forums.skadi.net/showpost.php...0&postcount=12

    I found some themes which are a little bit related but not exactly on spot about what I want to ask. You can read them at the links below:

    Disowning/Renouncing Children:
    http://forums.skadi.net/showthread.php?t=101809

    What Would You Do If Your Son Or Daughter Turned Out To Be Gay?
    http://forums.skadi.net/showthread.php?t=111542

    Holding Families Responsible:
    http://forums.skadi.net/showthread.php?t=85570

    Have You Ever Been Ostracized by a Family Member for ‘Thought Crimes’?
    http://forums.skadi.net/showthread.php?t=128360

    My own questions and comments:

    As the title of the theme reads, must love and loyalty towards family be unconditional? I'm asking must even though some peoples say it comes naturally to love a child, a father, a mother and so on. But it's obvious to me it doesn't always, because in the news I always hear about some parents who abuse their children or even kill them.

    But normally, do you think love, respect, loyalty, consideration, support and other similar attitudes towards the family should be a duty to everyone? Should it be unconditional? I'm understanding Bärin's point of view, but we must also think about the theory that the community's smallest unit is the family. The unit made from mother, father and children. If there is no cohesion in this unit, everything else could be bound for failure. What if there was a little bit more effort from everyone in families to stick together and compromise, would the community as a whole be more positive too?

    I'm clear what the general opinions are about disowning. I understand if peoples would want to break ties with their conflictual family members. But what about if you were put in a position to oppose and fight against your family, do you see yourself capable to do it? What would come first, and why? Do you consider it treason to help your flesh and blood first instead of helping the peoples you represent but aren't directly related to you? Whom would you be loyal to first and foremost?

    What would be striking too far? If family member commits a crime, and you're aware of it, do you turn him/her in to the police or do you stay silent?

  2. #2
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    Hey, there could be a middle way to face the problem. In your last example, the only choice is not between turning a family member in and being silent. You could try to persuade that person to turn themselves in. You wouldn't make the decision for them, but you'd make them see the reality of the consequences of their crime. It depends also what kind of crime, what kind of treason would it be. Stealing something isn't the same as murdering someone and I suppose I could overlook it.

    I'd try to solve it in a way that I don't have to break my rules and neither renounce anyone. Before renouncing a child for race mixing, I'd do anything in my power to prevent that from happening. If it's necessary, force them to break it before it becomes serious (marriage, children).

    Love for family though, I think people could feel it even if they decided to oppose their kin. That's why it hurts so much. Hence I don't know so much if love is really a matter of choice. You feel what you feel. But loyalty is, you're right. It's a matter if you act on those feelings of love or not.

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    ^ Yeah, prevention is better than anything but if it doesn't work, I support the philosophy of principles coming first. If my child committed an unforgivable crime, I'd disown him no mater how much I love him, because the consequences are greater and long term. All future generations might suffer because of my inability to ignore my love and weakness for one person, even if he is my reason to live and breathe. The right choice isn't always easy. That's how life is, tough on you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Siebenbürgerin View Post
    As the title of the theme reads, must love and loyalty towards family be unconditional? I'm asking must even though some peoples say it comes naturally to love a child, a father, a mother and so on. But it's obvious to me it doesn't always, because in the news I always hear about some parents who abuse their children or even kill them.
    It can be difficult sometimes but the answer should be yes.

    But normally, do you think love, respect, loyalty, consideration, support and other similar attitudes towards the family should be a duty to everyone?
    Yes

    Should it be unconditional?
    If they treat you with respect they deserve the same. If they don't you need to make the effort to tolerate it (up to a point) and to try and make them see reason. If they absolutely refuse to, then of course things become more complicated. The situation will dictate which measures need to be taken. Also, sometimes people's attitudes change, they realise the errors of their ways. We should be gracious enough to recognise and accept their apologies / change of attitude should they be willing to offer it.

    I'm understanding Bärin's point of view, but we must also think about the theory that the community's smallest unit is the family. The unit made from mother, father and children. If there is no cohesion in this unit, everything else could be bound for failure.
    That's right, this is the core issue. Healthy families = healthy communities and healthy communities form healthy cultures / nations. Once the family is poisoned the country is ruined.

    What if there was a little bit more effort from everyone in families to stick together and compromise, would the community as a whole be more positive too?
    Of course it would. The problem is that "whites" have started becoming too obsessed with themselves and materialism and media fads and as a result many have started neglecting their families in favour of selfish pursuits.

    I'm clear what the general opinions are about disowning. I understand if peoples would want to break ties with their conflictual family members. But what about if you were put in a position to oppose and fight against your family, do you see yourself capable to do it? What would come first, and why?
    Fighting one's family is a very tragic situation to be in. It should be avoided by all available means. Of course it isn't always possible.

    Do you consider it treason to help your flesh and blood first instead of helping the peoples you represent but aren't directly related to you? Whom would you be loyal to first and foremost?
    In my opinion one's primary loyalty ought to be towards your immediate family, then perhaps your more distant family, friends, your community and then your country.

    Provided you remember where your loyalties ought to lie (and your family does the same thing) there will be no problem.

    If one's family started choosing sides from outside (other cultures, groups, countries and communities) against your own side, then it becomes debateable whether they are worth being considered as family anymore. After all, their loyalties are elsewhere.

    Having said all this, it is a very complicated situation. For example, if one's local community has already been poisoned or infiltrated or brainwashed, then does it really matter if one were against them?

    What would be striking too far? If family member commits a crime, and you're aware of it, do you turn him/her in to the police or do you stay silent?
    Depends on the crime, depends on the situation. For example, there are so many laws today that simply reading the wrong type of book makes one a criminal in many European countries. Simply saying the wrong thing in the wrong company can result in criminal charges. Simply carrying an object not on the State's "approved" list of items can get one into serious trouble.

    Should I now therefore perform my "duties as a citizen" to go report to the police on my family members? Of course I won't.

    If a family member was doing serious harm to him / herself, other family members and the local community then yes, one has an obligation to turn them in.

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    It's indeed those drastic and most radical and tragic situations I'm talking about like doing something with very negative consequences.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoyBatty View Post
    Depends on the crime, depends on the situation. For example, there are so many laws today that simply reading the wrong type of book makes one a criminal in many European countries. Simply saying the wrong thing in the wrong company can result in criminal charges. Simply carrying an object not on the State's "approved" list of items can get one into serious trouble.

    Should I now therefore perform my "duties as a citizen" to go report to the police on my family members? Of course I won't.

    If a family member was doing serious harm to him / herself, other family members and the local community then yes, one has an obligation to turn them in.
    To make my question clearer it would be a crime all or at least most forum members here would frown at, a very grave thing. Not a "thought crime" or "hate crime" like it's called nowadays. In the communist times families were encouraged to gossip and turn in relatives whose views were against the Party, that was what it meant to be a model citisen. But that's not what I'm talking about here of course. But about a crime which would place a Germanic person or community in grave danger. Something unjustified and evil.

    As Bärin was talking about treason in the Star Wars films; Anakin/Darth Vader turned against his son even with the knowledge he was his son, and made things which endangered Luke which could have caused him to die. But Luke loved his father when he found out about the blood relation between them and didn't want to fight him. Would it be the right thing what Luke did, or is it as Bärin's view says, a treason? I've to admit I can't imagine myself fighting against my own mother or father even if they opposed me verily. I'd just try to step aside and avoid it if I can't do anything else to reconcile with them.

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    Your choices should be based on logic first, love second. Love can be used to manipulate you. Never ever give up your principles for the sake of a confused or treasonous family member. No one is worthy of unconditional support. Why should you have to ignore the bad a family member does to you just because you're related? Why should you continue to support them if they prove to you they don't care about you by their attitude?

    It's ridiculous to me to think I have to support no matter what. If I do that all rationality goes out the window and I sign my own sentence. I'm a mother and I love my son. I love my mother, father, brothers and sisters. But if anyone miscegenates, I will be against them and tell them to their face what I think they are, traitors. If they don't stop I will stop considering them family. I don't relate myself unconditionally to traitors. Who says you can't choose your family. You can.

    I've seen so many people who don't have the guts to say what they think to their family and accept and tolerate foreigners for their sake. They always end up miserably. Always.

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    Hm this is a hard topic for me, because i´m in just this situation. My mother is an oldschool green femninistic leftist. Tough enough. But i really despise my sisters way of life. She´s deeply into this one world multikulti shit, and has a halfbreed negro offspring with a criminal alien who wants to gain german citizenship. And i want to reject my niece for what she stands for (my sister just fucked asians and negroes to spit on our grandparents values), but then she´s just a 2 year old child who don´t know yet anything about such things.

    I cannot surpress my sense of "caring for the family", even i want to. When i turn my back on them, whats left in the world? ^^ Except a racial aware municipality maybe...

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    I don't know about you folks but I don't have any problem with the issue

    of owning or disowning family members. I am loyal to my family as long

    as they are loyal to me. And I am loyal to them as long as they are

    deserving of loyalty and not engaging in degenerate behavior.

    Remember that group loyalty is a 2 way street. I see people all the time

    that feel obligated to support some renegade family member even though

    the renegade is totally screwing over the rest of the family. Sorry, but I have

    absolutely no sympathy for people that take advantage of or violate that most

    basic of all human instincts,i.e., love for your immediate kin. And that is what

    these bastards are doing, they prey on your altruistic drive. And the main

    reason they target their own relatives is because its safe and easy. If they

    screw over a stranger, the stranger will retaliate. But these creeps will blithely

    rob, cheat, and steal from their relatives for years safe in the knowledge that

    granny, or mom and pop, or sis won't be able to bring themselves to drop the

    dime on their sorry asses.

    Unfortunately, I have several relatives who are just cheap grifters and

    confidence men. They have spent their entire adult lives scamming family,

    friends, and church members. And they have gotten away with it because

    no one can bring themselves to call the cops because "they're family".

    Screw that. Anyone who screws over the family ain't no family of mine.

    A good example of this mind set: A little old native lady came in my office

    totally distraught because her coked-up grandson had come into her house

    demanding money. When granny wouldn't give him any, he flew into a rage

    and busted up her huge chest freezer full of her winters supply of wild game

    and fish. She was totally terrified of the kid and of starving that winter

    because all her meat was rotting on her kitchen floor. When she tearfully

    asked me what to do, I stated firmly that she had to call the police and

    have him arrested. She gave me an anguished look and replied " But you

    don't understand, in our culture we have to take care of our relatives."

    To which I replied "That's right, you have to take care of your grandson,

    but your grandson has to take of you, in fact, in your culture your grandson

    has a much greater responsibility to take care of the Elders. In fact, why the

    hell isn't your grandson out hunting and fishing for you instead of trying to bum

    money off you for coke?"

    Well, needless to say, the light bulb went on over her head, she called the

    cops and sonny got hauled off to the the local jail for a well deserved dose

    of cultural sensitivity.


    As for miscegenation, and other degenerate behavior or "lifestyles", well they

    have cut themselves off by their own actions. I didn't tell them to do it, so

    I feel no "obligation". In fact, I feel that it is imperative that we be proactive,

    especially with our children and grandchildren. We need to make it clear,

    now, before they start to date or socialize that we will not tolerate degeneracy.


    I didn't become really racially aware until after my children were grown, but

    luckily my extensive experience with non-white cultures made it abundantly

    clear that they usually treat their women like shit. And during the heyday of

    the multi-culti 60's, when all us whiteys, especially women, felt compelled to

    show our blk/brn brothers that we "weren't racist", I witnessed the sad outcome

    of countless white women mating with non-white males.

    So early on I was counciling my children on the cultural impracticality of

    race-mixing, thank god.


    But now that we have all the facts, we know that r/m is a cultural,

    biological, genetic, racial, spiritual disaster for our people. So now

    I would have no trouble disowning family members for r/m because

    they have murdered their own genetic line and by setting a bad example

    they put everyone else at risk of being infected by their poisonous

    mind set.
    Illegitimi non Carborundum ! Coitus non Circum !
    Ex Gladio Libertas ! Μολών λαβέ !
    Si vis pacem, Para bellum !
    'All Political Power Grows out of the Barrel of a Gun' Chairman Mao

  9. #9
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    Love towards family is, or should be unconditional, but loyalty should not. I believe that I would continue to love my siblings for instance (using them as a tangible example, as I don't have children yet) even if they grew up to be race-mixers, criminals, younameit.

    However meaning that I would continue to love a relative who made a choice of some severity which I could not condone to the extent that I would feel uneasy to be judged by their company, doesn't mean that I'll be forever loyal to them. I would then let them know that they're still my sibling/parent/child, but would also let them know that they needn't expect my support until they decide to sever ties with whatever it is that I cannot condone.

    The whole topic, especially on the matter of race-mixing (unlike going down the criminal route, which can be changed if they elaborate upon their actions its consequences are final and forever, and continue for generations), is something I've worried about for a while. If race-mixing was included I probably wouldn't literally disown them, but at the very least make sure that this particularly relative could at no point inherit any of my property. They would not be invited to family celebrations etc. Which however doesn't mean I wouldn't cry if they passed.
    -In kalte Schatten versunken... /Germaniens Volk erstarrt / Gefroren von Lügen / In denen die Welt verharrt-
    -Die alte Seele trauernd und verlassen / Verblassend in einer erklärbaren Welt / Schwebend in einem Dunst der Wehmut / Ein Schrei der nur unmerklich gellt-
    -Auch ich verspüre Demut / Vor dem alten Geiste der Ahnen / Wird es mir vergönnt sein / Gen Walhalla aufzufahren?-

    (Heimdalls Wacht, In kalte Schatten versunken, stanzas 4-6)

  10. #10
    Senior Member Gary in TX's Avatar
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    Like others have already said to me love is conditional upon that family members behavior.

    If a family member is such a piece of garbage and they're the type of person that you would never associate with if they weren't your family why and how could you possibly love them?

    I save my love and loyalty for the people that deserve it, family or not.

    I'm the type of person that doesn't give my love or loyalty easily at all, but once they've earned it then that's basically it. I'll love that person and look out for their well being until the day I die.

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