View Poll Results: All In All Did Christianity Have A Positive Impact on Europe?

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  • Yes Christianity did have a Positive Effect on Europe

    27 41.54%
  • Europe would have been better without Christianity's Influence

    11 16.92%
  • Christianity Ruined Europe

    21 32.31%
  • Christianity Strengthend Europe and Without it Europe would still be in the Dark Ages

    6 9.23%
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Thread: All In All Did Christianity Have A Positive Impact on Europe?

  1. #31
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    Post Re: All In All Did Christianity Have A Positive Impact on Europe?

    Here's a quote I've been meaning to post for some time. Further proof of Christianity's positive impact on Europe.


    ‘It was not the case that the dominance of the lay and clerical aristocracy had a merely negative, inhibiting effect on the field of technology, in some areas it needs and tastes favoured a certain progress. The clergy and above all the monks were obliged to have few contacts as possible with the outside world, including economic relations, and above all they desired to be freed from material tasks to have time for the Opus Dei and for properly spiritual occupations (offices and prayers), and for their work of charity, which obliged them to provide for the economic needs not only of their numerous familia but also for the poor and of wandering beggars by distributing foodstuff. This encouraged them to develop equipment of a certain technical standard. If one is looking for the earliest mills, water mills, or for the progress in farming techniques, one often sees the religious orders in the vanguard. It was not a coincidence if here during the early Middle Ages men attributed the invention of the watermill to a saint who introduced it into a region, for example St. Orens of Auch who had a mill setup at St. Gabriel on the Durancole in the 6th century….As we have seen, the Church encouraged improvements in the measurement of time for the needs of ecclesiastical computation. The building of churches – the first great buildings of the Middle Ages – gave a stimulus to technical progress, not only in building techniques, but also in the tools used, in methods of transportation, and in the auxiliary skills such as glasswork.”
    --Jacques Le Goff Medieval Civilization 400-1500 pg. 198

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  3. #32
    Senior Member Jack's Avatar
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    Post Re: All In All Did Christianity Have A Positive Impact on Europe?

    Christianity created Christendom. Without Christendom there would have been no 'Europe' to speak of, merely a land filled with scattered clans and tribes.
    All men dream, but not equally. Those who dream at night, in the dusky recesses of their minds, wake in the day to find that it was vanity. But the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act their dreams, with open eyes, to make it possible.

  4. #33
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    Post Re: All In All Did Christianity Have A Positive Impact on Europe?

    ΕΥΤΥΧΕΙΤΕ!

    Dear Fellows, of course it ruined Europe! Mainly, it ruined Europe in a mentally point of view: European stop to feel like that and start to play "Christians" another arificiαl type of Human (?) being!
    Kindest Regards!

    Έστωσαν οι Θεοί αρωγοί Υμών!


    Quote Originally Posted by Northern_Paladin
    All In All Did Christianity Have A Positive Impact on Europe?

    Was the "Net" Effect of Christianity Positive or would Europe have been a better place without it's Influence.

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  6. #34
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    Post Re: All In All Did Christianity Have A Positive Impact on Europe?

    Quote Originally Posted by A R I S T O T L E
    ΕΥΤΥΧΕΙΤΕ!

    Dear Fellows, of course it ruined Europe!
    How?

    Mainly, it ruined Europe in a mentally point of view: European stop to feel like that and start to play "Christians" another arificiαl type of Human (?) being!
    Kindest Regards!
    Stopped feeling like what? And how is being a Christian artificial?

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    Post Re: All In All Did Christianity Have A Positive Impact on Europe?

    Well one of the problems with the struggle is that we all don't see eye to eye. I want to see Western European peoples and culture survive. Some of you think that Christianity is inherent to that culture. I think it is an abomination perpetuated on European peoples in order to make them more submissive to authority. In my eyes if you worship the Jewish God as a Christian you're essentially a quasi Jew. After all but whole thing is Jewish the mythos the scriptures the worldview. I do not wish to live in a Christian republic I have spent half my life in Ulster and seen what wonders Christianity does their, without the help of any Jews. my experience with Jews has been mostly positive, I have several friends who are of Jewish descent although obviously a minority of their genetics,they do not give a damn about Judaism, but they have some trepidation that some nut case Christian might come along and persecute them of the fact the greatgrandma was a Simon or Ginsburg. I do believe in a higher power but I do not believe that it involves itself with history or is anthropomorphic. In that respect I share a similar view with Washington, Jefferson, Franklin and others. Lincoln was primarily influenced by British mercantilism the amalgamation of corporate enterprises with government, this is hardly a socialist. The worst thing that ever happened to the Germanic people was the introduction of Middle Eastern Monotheism. There is a famous story of the King of France going to meet with Vikings he asked them who is the leader here, they all stood up. That was the old pagan Germanic spirit. King Olaf was a race traitor, the worst in our history. As for the Jews as individuals I just read them according to their character.itself is simplistic, I identify with the Sons and daughters of Europa, Celts,Germans Slavs,latins,Finns and so on. the best chance for survival is to expunge the Middle Eastern mystery cults that teach that the Supreme source of the universe is a tribal god of a Semite. as far as I'm concerned they're all the same. There was a story that the Macedonians under Alexander came across some Celtic warriors, he brought them in his tent and questioned them, he asked one of them what is it that you fear the most, the giant blond Celt answered with a big grin, the blue sky should fall upon my head and roared out in laughter. Alexander turned to the other and said and what about you do not fear the gods, the other Celt stuck his hand into a blazing pot pulled out a burning coal and crushed it in his hand. Smiling at Alexander he said what the gods fear me! that to meet is our true heritage, uniquely European untainted and unstained. Great Odin is sleeping in our genes waiting to arise, his Blond fury will shake the world, and our enemies will run from us like dear from Wolves.
    . Certainly one cannot deny the artistic, architectural and musical influences of Christianity, whoever the question can be posed what would have Europe created without that influence. The essential problem with Christianity is at its core it is irrational, It requires a leap of faith and at at this point one is either transformed in a soteriological sense, or merely surrenders ones will to ignorance and subjugation. As the saying goes many are called but few are chosen. Christianity was not used to enlighten the masses but to pacify them so that they might be easier subjects for temporal and secular power. I do not think the great philosophers of Europe would have ceased to exist outside the context of Christianity. I think rather they would have forged a more consistent philosophy and spirituality, that would not have subjected us to the denial of our own language culture and heritage.

  8. #36
    Senior Member Mac Seafraidh's Avatar
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    Post AW: Re: All In All Did Christianity Have A Positive Impact on Europe?

    Quote Originally Posted by König Ludwig II.
    Positive impact at that time, but I see the death of it a little later in history might have been a positive. This Jewish intervention of Christ has people down on their knees praying to a pedestrian that myths have past on and created people to believe that religion is above all things, which is not a good thing.
    This is not me anymore, but I believe in Catholicism. Germanic and Roman Gods are part of the culture. I am not a worshiper of the Gods, though the mysticism of them is great and rich. I think Christianity should be revived and people should keep the gods to the side. Everyone that claims paganism is most likely a Christian. It is ridiculous to see people spit on Christianity. The media started labeling it as "Judeo-Christianity" The gods are still with you in spirit, but you NEED God. I listen to music that bashes religion for the most part and I waiting for it to change. I am not telling people to convert.Paganism is just showing how much you hate your family,unless they respect it.

    Anyway, practically all the greatest Europeans in history were either Catholic or Lutheran for the most part, but even said religin was weak or nothing. Mussolini later regretted that he did not pray to God. His mother was very religious. I read in high school in some book in the library. Anyway, that is all I have to say.

  9. #37
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    Now, I don't believe that Christianity ruined Europe, yet still agree that the Holy Roman Empire ruined Germanic lands through feudal degeneracy. The system of master and slave that the Vatican instituted greatly depreciated the vitality of free Nordic folks.

  10. #38
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    I don't think it had a very positive impact, and it is because of some core worldview elements.

    Just going to name a few:

    1. Faith before folk - the notion that Christianity unites people and transcends blood and culture. I don't think I need to elaborate in how this mentality has changed things for Europe.

    2. Love each other, love thy enemy, turn the other cheek - now look how that turned out, LOL

    3. Man is above all other living beings in nature, only one with a soul - has let to the loss of contact with, and respect for, nature, to industrialization, urbanization, utilization of animals (and habitats) for commercial purposes, mass extinction of species and habitants and so on. Folks before that, were much more in synch and harmony with Nature and other beings.

    4. The notion of the afterlife, in my own opinion, has led to a phobic approach in life, and has extinguished the fire in men (and women)

    5. Last but not least, the notion of inherent & unconditional equality of all people.

    I don't mean to offend anyone's faith; this is my very own personal and distanced take as I try to analyze the social, political and philosophical impact of a certain religion over the culture and mentality of people. All in all, it appears to me, the impact has been negative. But on the other hand it is, over the centuries, entirely interwoven with European/Germanic folks so...

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  12. #39
    Senior Member Uwe Jens Lornsen's Avatar
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    Wink

    What Christianity had brought to Europe are
    mortar, clay bricks and stone buildings.

    These stone buildings were much more able to provide
    a long-term housing, than easy-to-build wooden houses.

    In these buildings scripture could be deposited much better,
    than in buildings intended to not last that long.

    Unfortunately, these stone buildings also stored early
    notices about our ancestors of the regions.

    Without these notes, we probably would not have much
    knowledge about our ancestors.

    The content of the Bible is unfortunately always 2-sided,
    like the tongue of a snake.

    But instead of discussing the Bible and reformations from inside,
    now churches in cities build after 1850 are transformed to
    mosques, without a visible occupation,
    but by an occupation by "Natives" , Officials and Politicians .

    The "HOW" about the Islamification is upsetting me much more,
    than the islamification as itself.



    About the 2-sided feature of the Bible :
    "Everyone" knows the 'Love your neighbour like yourself' ,
    but it is already written in Leviticus at least once buried under
    tons of repeated sacrificial procedures,
    and therfore not "intelectual property" of Jesus;
    AND
    Jesus says that one , who does not hate himself,
    can not be a disciple of him : LK 14:26
    26
    “If anyone comes to Me and does not hate his father and mother and wife
    and children and brothers and sisters
    — yes, even his own life —
    he cannot be My disciple.
    http://biblehub.com/luke/14-26.htm

    Where we are then at the label "Self-Hating Whites" ,
    that shows up once here and there ..
    Mk 10:18 What do you call me a good master, no-one is good .

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    aka Johan the Blind Goodman John's Avatar
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    I'm sure there are the souls of quite a few million non-Christians (and Christians deemed to be heretics) would just as soon Christianity (at least in the form of the Church) had never reared its head in their neighborhood. Personally, I think the Church- from at least 1000CE on- retarded European growth by a good 3-500 years. It certainly stifled political and educational progress, and did so while enriching itself at the expense of the poor.

    Christianity- as a religion- itself was neither good nor bad for Europe; it was just another religion- one of many- as I'm sure many of the locals considered it to be when the first missionaries hit the road.

    As with most religions, they're pretty benign on their own merits. It's when you get into HOW a religion is spread and how it runs its internal business is where things can begin to look a little sleazy.
    When someone asks, "What would Jesus do?" remind them that flipping tables and chasing people with a whip is entirely possible.

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