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Thread: Poland/Germanic Poles

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    Question Why Not Poland?

    I am a German Polish mix. Poland borders Germany and if you looked at my grandmother one would never guess that she was Polish. Many of the foods/customs are the same. From the research I did (correct me if I'm wrong sometimes internet resources are crap) but some of Poland was part of Prussia at one time. Just wondering...

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    Prussia and Germany for that matter streched way further then the borders it has now. It was mainly due to a ongoing quest by the Teutonic Order back in the medieval ages. Not only in Poland but in many parts of Central- and Eastern Europe many Germans lived, even in Russia (Volksdeutchen) However, after WOII, Stalin kicked most of the Germans out of Eastern and central Europe and even out of their righteous ground in former Prussia, Polen that they have inhabited since ages.

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    A short overview



    Germanic tribes dwelled in the area. A few of these East Germanics stayed and were absorbed by West Slavs, most left, as Oswy explained.





    The major Germanic input into Poland was the German Ostsiedlung, which accompanied centuries of Germanic dominance in Central Europe.




    Most of it is gone now, only very little remains.


    Quote Originally Posted by Lavender Corrigan View Post
    I am a German Polish mix.
    I am getting the impression that you want to discuss under what circumstances Germanics with some Slavic ancestry could still be considered Germanic. You should just say so if that is what you really want to know.

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    My Polish Great Grandmother immigrated in 1918. I'd have to go back and do some digging to get the exact date. I'm not worried about my bloodlines at all...*L* I have nothing to prove to anyone. Just growing up with a Polish Grandmother and a German Grandfather I just noticed alot of similarities within the cultures. I have only 1/4 Polish. The rest of me is German with a little bit of dutch way down the line for flavor on my mother's side. In strictly speaking, did the Germans have more influence on Polish culture or the Slavs?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lavender Corrigan View Post
    My Polish Great Grandmother immigrated in 1918. I'd have to go back and do some digging to get the exact date. I'm not worried about my bloodlines at all...*L* I have nothing to prove to anyone. Just growing up with a Polish Grandmother and a German Grandfather I just noticed alot of similarities within the cultures. I have only 1/4 Polish. The rest of me is German with a little bit of dutch way down the line for flavor on my mother's side. In strictly speaking, did the Germans have more influence on Polish culture or the Slavs?

    When I lived in Berlin I knew 2 German families with Polish last names. They were Germans for many generations.

    You are right, there are similarities.

    In my Neighborhood, There is a Czek, a a German and several Polish restaurants. They all make Wiener Schnitzel. The Polish ones at about half the price of the German and Czek ones. I eat at the Polish ones,

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lavender Corrigan View Post
    In strictly speaking, did the Germans have more influence on Polish culture or the Slavs?
    German culture dominated the area for the greater part of the last millenium, but the Polish identity is thoroughly Slavic and their nationalist movement was specifically directed against Germany and her Germanisation efforts. They also did not like to be Russians, but were less threatened culturally by them.

    I have noticed that German low culture is slightly growing in importance again, but they are more heavily flooded with Amero-global trash.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lavender Corrigan View Post
    My Polish Great Grandmother immigrated in 1918. I'd have to go back and do some digging to get the exact date. I'm not worried about my bloodlines at all...*L* I have nothing to prove to anyone. Just growing up with a Polish Grandmother and a German Grandfather I just noticed alot of similarities within the cultures. I have only 1/4 Polish. The rest of me is German with a little bit of dutch way down the line for flavor on my mother's side. In strictly speaking, did the Germans have more influence on Polish culture or the Slavs?
    The Poles are Slavs, which makes the question somewhat strange, but to put it that way, it was not just a German influence, but more generally speaking a Western European one, from the centre of the occidental movements in medieval times, which is roughly speaking Northern France, BENELUX and North Western Germany. To this day this area is an economic and industrial centre and from this area most German and other Western European settlers came in the course of the "Ostsiedlung" and brought with them new methods of farming, new aspects of general laws, both for the cities as well as the farmers and of course monasteries and everything related to the Catholic church, which was, beside this North Western cultural centre, the most important aspect of occidental culture in medieval times.

    The Western influence can be easily determined in Europe if looking at the Catholic - Orthodox border. As we can see, Poland is a Catholic country, Western influenced more than Eastern, while retaining certain more archaic and Slavic characteristics, the Germans have not.

    In a way one can see the whole cultural niveau differences in Europe as the result of the distance from the "European Banana", the centre of cultural and economic development of the occident, stretching from South-Eastern England to Northern Italy, with the old Frankish centre being of greatest importance as already explained. The further away from those centre or better centres, the lower the general economic and (higher) cultural development was, as a general rule, to modern times even. Germans simply had the historic role of transmitting these modern methods and ways of living to the rest of Eastern Europe (others participated too, but it was largely a German dominated enterprise) which was part of their superiority in this region and one of the reasons for a certain arrogance, as "culture bearers in the steppe", as well for quite some time, partly to this day, because social discipline and structural development is still much more backward in most Eastern European areas if being compared to the "core area".

    If looking at the continent at night, where most lights are present, bigger agglomerations, high niveau of electrification, you can still imagine the cultural core of the occident...

    Compare:
    http://forums.skadi.net/showthread.php?t=40331

    Genetically speaking there were influences in both directions of course, but the differences between Poles and Germans are still larger than those between Germans and BENELUX or Northern France f.e. This being also true if comparing facial traits.
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    I do believe that Germany has had more influence on Poland and other Central-European countries than vica versa. Czech nationalism, for example, has been evolved trough German nobility.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Agrippa View Post
    In a way one can see the whole cultural niveau differences in Europe as the result of the distance from the "European Banana", the centre of cultural and economic development of the occident, stretching from South-Eastern England to Northern Italy, with the old Frankish centre being of greatest importance as already explained. The further away from those centre or better centres, the lower the general economic and (higher) cultural development was, as a general rule, to modern times even. Germans simply had the historic role of transmitting these modern methods and ways of living to the rest of Eastern Europe (others participated too, but it was largely a German dominated enterprise) which was part of their superiority in this region and one of the reasons for a certain arrogance, as "culture bearers in the steppe", as well for quite some time, partly to this day, because social discipline and structural development is still much more backward in most Eastern European areas if being compared to the "core area".

    If looking at the continent at night, where most lights are present, bigger agglomerations, high niveau of electrification, you can still imagine the cultural core of the occident...

    Compare:
    http://forums.skadi.net/showthread.php?t=40331
    I will have to read your European "banana" post more thoroughly when I am not swamped with work. I hope you didn't already say this in that post and I am not just repeating, but have you ever considered that this "banana" region is also the area where most old-stock Americans trace their ancestry to. I had been thinking that essentially my ancestry starts in the British Isles with the strongest concentration in Southeastern England and then jumps into Holland and from there essentially follows the Rhein down into Switzerland.

    So South-East England, Holland, then along the German Rhein (Palatinate, Alsace-Lorraine, Baden-Wuerttemberg, maybe Hessen can be incuded), and into Switzerland. We don't have many northern Italians but the rest fits perfectly. People from East Anglia and smaller numbers from Holland were the first to come to America followed thereafter by waves of Rheinlanders who also brought a significant number of Swiss-Germans. At the same time as the Rheinland-Pfalz immigrants came and after to about the 1830's many immigrants came here from Baden.

    It makes sense. It has a lot to do with the pressures put on the people of these regions. The population density together with these regions being the most technologically advanced (as well as war and famine) were prime conditions for the sort of emigration we saw.

    Maybe you could include that in your proofs for your theory.

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    It makes sense. It has a lot to do with the pressures put on the people of these regions. The population density together with these regions being the most technologically advanced (as well as war and famine) were prime conditions for the sort of emigration we saw.

    By Stalin's Anti-Germanic movements what was the constitution of too-Germanic?? Was it the way they looked, social behaviors, economic standing, etc. I'm just curious because I tried looking it up but couldn't find really anything on the particular political policies of Stalin, only a general summary. Approximately what years did this massive purge take place? Where did the majority of these people migrate to?

    I just noticed that you have Polish people who look German. You have Germans who have Polish names. There is a similarity there. Maybe it's naive of me but I'm scratching my head as to why one would deny culturally or otherwise those influences. I am wondering why Poles want to deny Germanic blood in themselves when it is present.

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