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Thread: Pope Asks Europeans to Defend Christian Heritage

  1. #31
    Member Aequoreus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Godwinson View Post
    The bottom line is that the IRA were heavily involved in rackets and organised crime and eventually became a pseudo-Marxist group.
    I wont deny that there were corrupt elements within the (P)IRA. But please keep in mind that it was nothing compared to the whole-sale corruption of Loyalist terrorist forces or British security forces.

    The Marxist politics of the post-Border Campaign (P)IRA is of course a sad occurence, but understandable in light of the treatment Irishmen suffered under British and Protestant rule.

    They were basically murderous thugs, who even blew people up at a Remembrance Sunday parade to honour the dead for God's sake!!!
    People honouring the British Army. But even then, the civilians were not the target of that bomb, they were unfortunate casualties. Servicemen were the target.

    I think it's easy to get some romantic notion of them as "freedom fighters" because of their Nationalist objectives but they were just riff-raff recruited from local housing estates and financed by undesirables, including Soviet Communists and even Colonel Kadhafi at one point!
    Please, do not speak to me as if I was suffering some romantic dillusions of grandeur. I recognise the faults of the (P)IRA/SF movement after the Border Campaign before the Troubles. But I also understand why everything played out as it did.

    I am curious though.. are you a nationalist? What could be more nationalist than normal everyday people fighting for their nation? Also, the recruitment went far beyond the housing estates. I would say it was a 60/40 split between urban and rural recruitment respectivley.

    Even more so, the fact that you are trying to associate living on a housing estate with being almost less than human, you should keep in mind that the Irish people were forced into those ghettos by a Protestant terrorist state.

    In regards to Soviet financing, I am not sure on the specifics. The majority of the cash flow into the (P)IRA came from America and Ireland. It is possible that the Soviets financed the (P)IRA. But it would just have easily been Hitler who financed the (P)IRA. Neither were interested in helping Ireland, but both would want to weaken Britain.

    I wouldn't have brought this up but for the Catholic connection, and to see to what lengths you would go to defend your own kind (albeit with a few reservations).
    Stop painting the (P)IRA or any IRA movement as a Catholic movement, because unlike the Loyalist death squads, the (P)IRA or any incarnation of the IRA has not been religiously motivated and has not been sectarian to anywhere near the same extent as our Protestant cousins. Minor elements yes, the movement as a whole? Get real.

    Funny though how squeamish you are about NS, which I could have understood had you just been a peace-loving Christian, but you're not!
    My reservations about National Socialism has nothing to do with its military outlook. It's the fact that it is a God-hating ideology. An ideology riddled with materialism and dogmatic secularism whose grass-roots supporters is quite.. I am sorry, but crazy!

    n fact, you don't even like many of your fellow Christians despite the fact you keep referring to "Christianity" as a single entity. Interesting how you don't perceive Protestants (for example) as your co-religionists when they are also Christians, so I think you're really only interested in your own tribe rather than being a Christian in the wider sense.
    This is all dependent on your definition of what it is to be Christian. Therefore it is null and void to anything in this discussion.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wanderer View Post
    the rest of western civilization, including the vatican, seemed to have no problem with letting its greatest protector be crushed in the vise of a two-front war.
    This is really the only part of your post worth mention, in my honest opinion, and that mention is just an 'lol'. Bismark once said that Germany will never again return to Canossa, but.. well, I'll be waiting there with open arms .

  2. #32
    Senior Member velvet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chlod
    Mjolnir, Christianity and communism are archenemies, it's not because you dislike the both of them, that they're in fact the same thing.

    Especially communism - which was so opposed to the old, traditional Christian order, in all its aspects - communist practical policies seemed to be all about the destruction of Christianity in the first place
    Communism is highly based in judeo-christian views. What makes them "archenemies" is that communism doesnt like the concurrence of (the judeo-christian) 'god' in its system. The archenemy thing is about the idolised god figure (communism: the state), not about the system itself.

    It is the same nonsense to claim that christianity would be inherently hostile to Judaism. It is not. Christianity was just a counter movement to orthodox Judaism. It was never meant to anyone else than Jews.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aequoreus
    The anomosity felt by Catholics in the British Isles towards Protestants is compeltely understandable in light of history and reason.
    The game is called "devide and conquer". A game christianity (or Judaism light) has always been good at. Christianity divided our folk into Catholics, Protestants, Amish, Lutherans, Russian Orthodox, Greek Orthodox, the Jesuits, the Mormons and round about 3000 other sects and subsects.

    And while hostile immigrant sweep our lands, the christians fight each other

    Quote Originally Posted by Aequoreus
    My God, what is it with you people? Isolationism has never worked. The Holy Father has a dialogue with other peoples, other faiths. This is quite a natural human occurrence. I assure you the Germanic cheiftains of old did not hide away in their little corners. As you say below, they have a warrior spirit.
    They didnt give church asylum to criminal muslim scum. They didnt give entire church districts and church buildings to raiding muslim scum. They dont hide them to safe them from being send back home.

    Just because one has contact with other folks doesnt neccessarily mean one has to house them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aequoreus
    The Holy Father prayed towards Mecca apparently. What some people do not realise is that before the Vatican II Council, Christians always prayed and celebrated Mass facing towards Jerusalem. You nor I know the intent of the Holy Father when he prayed then, but going by past actions I think it is a safe assumption that he was not praying to Mohammed.
    So, you do a 'safe assumption' that he didnt pray to Mohammed. This would indeed be strange, because as far as I remember, the muslim god is called Allah, who is identical with YHWE.

    Jerusalem / Israel is the holy land of the Jews, as well as YHWE is the god of the Jews. Jesus was a Jew, all the stories in the bible tell about Jewish life and rules and customs, it tells about the homeland of the Jews. It is about Jewish values, Jewish virtues, Jewish laws.

    In what way does this religion represent anything Germanic?
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  3. #33
    Member Aequoreus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by velvet View Post
    Communism is highly based in judeo-christian views.
    A tired and stale formula. Care to actually demonstrate how this is the case?

    It is the same nonsense to claim that christianity would be inherently hostile to Judaism. It is not. Christianity was just a counter movement to orthodox Judaism.
    Orthodox Judaism is different from Talmudic Judaism which is what the Jewish people have now. Orthodox Judaism became Christianity. The Church is Israel.

    It was never meant to anyone else than Jews.
    Then why would the Holy Ghost guide the Apostles to bring the Truth to the gentiles?

    The game is called "devide and conquer". A game christianity (or Judaism light) has always been good at. Christianity divided our folk into Catholics, Protestants, Amish, Lutherans, Russian Orthodox, Greek Orthodox, the Jesuits, the Mormons and round about 3000 other sects and subsects.

    And while hostile immigrant sweep our lands, the christians fight each other
    Where as before Christianity European people were divided by what tree they worshipped . Well, eitherway, the devil is strong and cunning. It is no wonder such heresies as Lutheranism and Calvinism exist.

    They didnt give church asylum to criminal muslim scum. They didnt give entire church districts and church buildings to raiding muslim scum.
    Evidence and examples, please?

    They dont hide them to safe them from being send back home.
    Oh, I am aware it's happened a few times in America in regards to Latin-Americans and I am sure I have heard a story or two about the same happening in Europe. However, these are simply minority and extraordinary cases, and in no way reflect the teachings of the Church.

    Just because one has contact with other folks doesnt neccessarily mean one has to house them.
    Nor have I said otherwise.

    So, you do a 'safe assumption' that he didnt pray to Mohammed. This would indeed be strange, because as far as I remember, the muslim god is called Allah, who is identical with YHWE.
    Oh, fair point, you got me there ! However, to say they are identical is not exactly true, is it? For a start, Christians believe in a Trinitarian God .

    Jerusalem / Israel is the holy land of the Jews, as well as YHWE is the god of the Jews. Jesus was a Jew, all the stories in the bible tell about Jewish life and rules and customs, it tells about the homeland of the Jews. It is about Jewish values, Jewish virtues, Jewish laws.
    Of course it is! The Jewish people were entrusted with a task from God, they failed. When God took on human flesh, He came to fufill the Law. The fufillment of that law was the salvation of all men.

    But you're confusing something.. there is a remarkable difference between the Israelites of 2000 years ago, and the Talmudic Jewish banking elite of the 21st Century. So do not speak of them as if they were of the same cloth when they are not.

    In what way does this religion represent anything Germanic?
    Hm.. let me see.. it couldn't be that generations of Germanic peoples have been freely Christian for centuries? It couldn't be that most of the modern day Germanic ethnic identities, culture and even language truly developed in the Christian era?

    No, it cannot be that!

  4. #34
    Senior Member SaxonPagan's Avatar
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    Aequoreus, I am not going to haggle forever over the finer details of the IRA except to reiterate that it is to all intents a Catholic terrorist group. There are NO Protestants within it, only Catholics, and it has the support (to varying degrees) of 99% of the Catholic community so I don’t really think you can get much more Catholic than that!

    Please note that I am not tarnishing all of Catholicism and have a lot of Catholic friends in France, but they don’t see things from such a narrow, sectarian perspective as you do. You even advocate (or at least excuse) terrorism against fellow Christians, and to justify this in your own mind you’ve decided to re-define Christianity by excluding Protestants. Well, I’m sorry to inform you that Protestants are just as Christian as Catholics and you don’t have any more of a claim on God than they do so it could be time to emerge from that bubble you’re living in.

    Velvet is quite right – these different religious sub-groups are all part of the "divide and conquer" scenario that is proving so effective for your real enemies. You even appear to prefer Jews to Protestants from what I can gather, and all because of some regional dispute in the UK! How Germanic you are in the strictest sense I’m not entirely sure but when someone has missed the bigger picture by so wide a margin it’s very hard to see what use they’d be to the Preservationist cause anyway.

  5. #35
    Senior Member velvet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aequoreus
    Orthodox Judaism is different from Talmudic Judaism which is what the Jewish people have now. Orthodox Judaism became Christianity. The Church is Israel.
    This should ring some alarm bells, shouldnt it?
    When we talk about "christian heritage" to defend, and when the "church is Israel", what exactly is it what we should defend?

    Do we refer to Europe, or do we in fact refer to Israel, which gets its greedy fingers ever deeper and deeper into the core of our people? Isnt it Israel (or how they like to call themselves: world Jewry) who designs our genocide?

    There is no way for us Germanics to win this battle, when half the Germanics will rather fight against their own people than the real enemy


    Quote Originally Posted by Aequoreus
    Then why would the Holy Ghost guide the Apostles to bring the Truth to the gentiles?
    It havent been "the apostles", but Paul, who preached that poison alone and without consense of the other self-claimed apostles to the Gentiles.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aequoreus
    Where as before Christianity European people were divided by what tree they worshipped . Well, eitherway, the devil is strong and cunning. It is no wonder such heresies as Lutheranism and Calvinism exist.
    You see, one devil worship isnt better than the other, and to avoid misunderstandings: with devil I mean your god.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aequoreus
    Evidence and examples, please?
    www.brusselsjournal.com, for example, you'll find some interesting articles to this topic there.


    Quote Originally Posted by Aequoreus
    Oh, fair point, you got me there ! However, to say they are identical is not exactly true, is it? For a start, Christians believe in a Trinitarian God.
    You worship the same desert demon like muslims. No however twisted interpretation will change that.


    Quote Originally Posted by Aequoreus
    Of course it is! The Jewish people were entrusted with a task from God, they failed. When God took on human flesh, He came to fufill the Law. The fufillment of that law was the salvation of all men.
    Last time I checked the Jews are in charge of Europe and America. Doesnt really seem like anyone told them that they failed

    Besides, I dont buy into this salvation nonsense. The "sins of men" was a Jewish thing, not a Germanic one, so we didnt need salvation.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aequoreus
    But you're confusing something.. there is a remarkable difference between the Israelites of 2000 years ago, and the Talmudic Jewish banking elite of the 21st Century. So do not speak of them as if they were of the same cloth when they are not.
    Well, the Jewish banking elite will disagree with you. And even if they agree, they still see themselves as the chosen people and act accordingly.

    The problem starts when Germanic people adhere to a religion that has exactly this at the center of its cult: the Jews as the chosen people. Your book of hate is full of examples how Jews view Gentiles, as beasts with speech. Worthless creatures, that either serve the chosen people or die.

    I would call this first class interest conflict, when the times comes to make a decision on which side to stand.

    Btw, it is perfectly unimportant whether Jews of today still are the same people like Jews from 2000 years ago. They are not Germanic.


    Quote Originally Posted by Aequoreus
    Hm.. let me see.. it couldn't be that generations of Germanic peoples have been freely Christian for centuries? It couldn't be that most of the modern day Germanic ethnic identities, culture and even language truly developed in the Christian era?
    Freely?!? Nope, really not. And in what way massive wars in the name of Jews and for Jews (crusades, etc all the way to WWII), or against fellow Germanics who refused to become christian, should have served us in any way positive is out of my mind too.
    I also dont see the benefit of writing down our history in latin or greek, instead of using our own language. I fail to see the benefit of christian churches being erected on Heathen holy sites. I fail to see the benefit in perverting the Germanic pantheon with the interpretatio romana. Et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. This stuff is in depths discussed in the "Is christianity alien to Germanics" thread on over 100 pages though.

    And still, it all remains interpretation and speculation. Just because christianity was present when those developments happened (and especially many science and medicine happened despite the church, certainly not because of), it long doesnt mean that it hadnt happened without christianity. In fact, the hints are legion that certain developments would have happened much faster without christianity, and for other things other solutions could have been found, which would benefit us today probably much more than what christianity allowed to come about.
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  6. #36
    Sound methods Chlodovech's Avatar
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    This is a good moment to quote Pope Leo XIII.

    "For, indeed, although the socialists, stealing the very Gospel itself with a view to deceive more easily the unwary, have been accustomed to distort it so as to suit their own purposes, nevertheless so great is the difference between their depraved teachings and the most pure doctrine of Christ that none greater could exist: “for what participation hath justice with injustice or what fellowship hath light with darkness?” Their habit, as we have intimated, is always to maintain that nature has made all men equal, and that, therefore, neither honor nor respect is due to majesty, nor obedience to laws, unless, perhaps, to those sanctioned by their own good pleasure. But, on the contrary, in accordance with the teachings of the Gospel, the equality of men consists in this: that all, having inherited the same nature, are called to the same most high dignity of the sons of God, and that, as one and the same end is set before all, each one is to be judged by the same law and will receive punishment or reward according to his deserts. The inequality of rights and of power proceeds from the very Author of nature, “from whom all paternity in heaven and earth is named.” Pope Leo XIII on Socialism.
    "After the year 1900 people will become unrecognisable. When the time for the Advent of the Antichrist approaches, peoples minds will grow cloudy from carnal passions, and dishonour and lawlessness will grow stronger. Peoples appearances will change, and it will be impossible to distinguish men from women due to there shamelessness in dress and style of hair. These people will be cruel and will be like wild animals because of the temptations of the Antichrist. There will be no respect for parents or elders, love will disappear, and Christian pastors, bishops, and priests will become vain men, completely failing to distinguish the right hand way from the left. At that time the morals and traditions of Christians and the Church will change. People will abandon modesty, and dissipation will reign. Falsehood and greed will attain great proportions, and woe to those who pile up treasures. Lust, adultery, homosexuality, secret deeds and murder will rule in society." - St. Nilus, 430 AD

  7. #37
    Member Aequoreus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Godwinson View Post
    Aequoreus, I am not going to haggle forever over the finer details of the IRA except to reiterate that it is to all intents a Catholic terrorist group. There are NO Protestants within it, only Catholics, and it has the support (to varying degrees) of 99% of the Catholic community so I don’t really think you can get much more Catholic than that!
    You say the (P)IRA is a Catholic terrorist group, because its grassroots are Irish Catholics. My friend, I would rather ask my self why Catholics feel the need to support a so-called "terrorist" group than anything else. Why would 99% of the Catholic community support then (P)IRA? Again, it says more about the Protestant state and England than it does about Irish Catholicism.

    As to your claim that no Protestants served as volunteers, I am going to take that with a pinch of salt and assume that instead you are employing hyperbole.

    In regards to your claim that 99% of the Irish Catholic community supported the (P)IRA. I don't think so. You've clearly demonstrated your lack of knowledge on this subject and you unconditional surrender is quite frankly the only thing you can offer here to save some sense of face.

    Dear God, even after Bloody Sunday, when the (P)IRA had its biggest boost in new recruits, I would still wage if you were lucky if even 80% of the Irish Catholic population gave support to the (P)IRA.

    There is a major difference between support and empathy, by the way.

    Please note that I am not tarnishing all of Catholicism and have a lot of Catholic friends in France, but they don’t see things from such a narrow, sectarian perspective as you do.
    Then they are simply not good Catholics. Do they even go to Chapel on a Sunday? By the way, you sound like some liberal. Stop throwing around their nice little buzz words.

    You even advocate (or at least excuse) terrorism against fellow Christians, and to justify this in your own mind you’ve decided to re-define Christianity by excluding Protestants.
    For starters, Protestants have never been accepted as Christians by the traditional and orthodox Christian community (Catholic and Orthodox communities). In fact, it was not up until the build up to Vatican II that the religion of Luther was accepted as being "Christian" in a wider sense. Which of course sickens me.

    Secondly, I have no advocated any form of physical violence against an innocent Protestant community. I have said I empathise with the (P)IRA's struggle against the British and Orange terror states. But again, I think that says much more about those two than it does me or any other Catholic.

    Well, I’m sorry to inform you that Protestants are just as Christian as Catholics and you don’t have any more of a claim on God than they do so it could be time to emerge from that bubble you’re living in.
    It's a shame Skadi doesn't have a 'rofl' emoticon. Hm.. let me see, the Catholic Church is the Church of God founded by Christ. Protestantism is a 16th century heresy that spread like wildfire amongst northern Europeans. It's roots are in Luther and Calvin, not Christ unlike my Church.

    Again, stop using little buzz words like "narrow minded" or "living in a bubble". Honestly, you do sound like a liberal. I suppose you'll tell me next we can all just get a long !

    Velvet is quite right – these different religious sub-groups are all part of the "divide and conquer" scenario that is proving so effective for your real enemies. You even appear to prefer Jews to Protestants from what I can gather, and all because of some regional dispute in the UK! How Germanic you are in the strictest sense I’m not entirely sure but when someone has missed the bigger picture by so wide a margin it’s very hard to see what use they’d be to the Preservationist cause anyway.
    You're too narrow minded my friend. You must open up your mind, and come out of your bubble .

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    Senior Member SaxonPagan's Avatar
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    Well, Aequoreus, I’m not going to argue forever (as I said previously) about the IRA and whether most Catholics “support” them or just “empathise” with them. However, they are widely recognised as a Catholic group and I think the fact they use bombs and bullets to further their aims qualifies them as terrorists too. However, my original reference to them was to highlight how Christians cannot even get on amongst themselves - something you have since confirmed!

    It’s a shame that you pour scorn on my Catholic friends in France simply because they are not as militant as you. I realise you enjoy re-defining individuals and groups to suit your own narrow views but this doesn’t mean they are “not good Catholics” and I think they do their religion far greater credit than you fanatics!

    Anyway, let’s sum up; The Pope has called upon Europeans to defend the Christian heritage but I'm wondering if Christians will even be able to define what this is. You in particular seem to have an issue with many other Christians (or not, as you perceive them) and whilst you're all bickering over who the "real" Christians are I'm afraid your enemies will keep gaining ground due to them being more united.

    No wonder Europe is in such as state!

  9. #39
    Senior Member velvet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aequoreus
    Hm.. let me see, the Catholic Church is the Church of God founded by Christ. Protestantism is a 16th century heresy that spread like wildfire amongst northern Europeans. It's roots are in Luther and Calvin, not Christ unlike my Church.
    "Christ" has founded no church at all. Your belief as you know it didnt even exist before the end of the 2d century C.E., because a large part of the gospels werent written yet, and none of them base in actual experiences, and while Markus and Lukas at least knew (most likely, but not 100 percent proven) the heretic hippy freak called Joshua of Nazarene, Paul, on whose letters the founding of the church later bases, did not know him.

    And again, nothing of this happened on European soil. Although Paul was a Greek Jew, his "teachings" were first listened to among North Africans, and the construct infiltrated the Roman Empire from there. And later it has been in the semitic part of the Empire (Byzantine) that it ceased to be a prosecuted sect. And it was only when Byzantine became the center of power in a declining empire that it became an acknowledged religion, and Constantine employed it as a power tool. Noone to that time cared about the spritiual value or lack thereof, it was just an instrument to shift power and establish a new order.

    An interesting side note is that christianity was best promoted in the multicultural cesspool the eastern part of the empire has been. It attrackted outcasts, the poor, the ill, the weak, whores and criminals, culturally and ethnically highly confused people. A group of people rapidly growing in a declining empire as large as the Roman empire.

    It's funny over and over again that people who claim for themselves to have eaten all the wisdom of the catholic church dont know the history of their sect.

    Btw, what you call heresy was the first and only serious try to Germanise this Jewish sect. But because the catholic church prefered to steal their richness through the sell of letters of indulgence, Luther was excommunicated for his belief that the salvation from sin is solely gained through faith in god, and can never be gained through money. It is funny that his hypocrisy is bought by so many people, the catholic church has herself never acted according to the oh so highly claimed teachings of Jesus, but they demanded that from their followers, most of all when it served to make the church even more rich. So much to christianity despises materialism. It only preaches that to get their greedy fingers easier onto the materials of others.
    Ein Leben ist nichts, deine Sprosse sind alles
    Aller Sturm nimmt nichts, weil dein Wurzelgriff zu stark ist
    und endet meine Frist, weiss ich dass du noch da bist
    Gefürchtet von der Zeit, mein Baum, mein Stamm in Ewigkeit

    my signature

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    Senior Member Mjolnir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aequoreus View Post
    Communism is a materialistic cultural and economic ideaology. Christianity opposes materialism. Christianbity hates materialism to its very core. It was Christianity that was the bulwark against Communism in Eastern Europe.

    How in God's most beautiful green earth are Communism and Christianity going hand-in-hand?
    Thats is where Christianity went wrong. The only thing which differs in Christisnity and Communism is RACE...Blood AND Earth (BLUT UND BODEN), genes and Nature's laws.

    Christianity persuits equatalriaism and is defying all sensable laws of nature.. (Like "all men are created equal").
    Communism is defying all racial laws on top of that.

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