Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 12

Thread: Old English Language (Anglo-Saxon)

  1. #1
    You are not wrong, who deem / That my days have been a dream Johannes de Len's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Last Online
    Sunday, April 15th, 2012 @ 11:03 AM
    Ethnicity
    Iberian
    Subrace
    Atlanto-Baskid
    Location
    Terra Firma
    Gender
    Politics
    Nationalism
    Posts
    1,477
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    1
    Thanked in
    1 Post

    Post Old English Language (Anglo-Saxon)

    Old English (also called Anglo-Saxon) is an early form of the English language which was spoken in England some 1000 years ago. It was a West Germanic language, and was very similar to Old Norse (and, by extension, to modern Icelandic). Unlike modern English, Old English was a language rich with morphological diversity, and was still pronounced basically as spelled. It maintained several distinct cases: the nominative, dative, accusative, genitive, and instrumental, remnants of which survive only in a few pronouns today. Old English was not a static form. Its usage covered a period of some 700 or so years from the Anglo-Saxon migrations into England in approximately 450 AD, to some time after the Norman invasion in 1066, when the language underwent a major and dramatic transition. During this period of time, it assimilated some aspects of the indigenous pre-Celtic languages, some of the Celtic languages which it came into contact with, and some of the two variants of the invading Scandinavian languages occupying and controlling the Danelaw.

    Latin influence

    The influence of Latin on Old English should not be ignored. A large percentage of the educated and literate population (monks, clerics, etc.) were competent in Latin, which was then Europe's prevalent lingua franca. It is sometimes possible to roughly date the entry of individual Latin words into Old English based on which patterns of linguistic change they have undergone, though this is not always reliable. There were at least three notable periods of Latin influence. The first occurred before the ancestral Saxons left continental Europe for England. The second began when the Anglo-Saxons were converted to Christianity, and Latin-speaking priests became widespread. However, the largest single transfer of Latin-based words occurred following the Norman conquest of 1066, after which an enormous number of Norman words entered the language. Most of these ol language words were themselves derived ultimately from classical Latin, although a notable stock of Norse words were introduced, or re-introduced, in Norman form. The Norman Conquest approximately marks the end of Old English and the advent of Middle English.

    The language was further altered by the transition away from the runic alphabet (also known as futhark) to the Latin alphabet, which was also a significant factor in the developmental pressures brought to bear on the language. Words were spelled as they were pronounced; the silent letters of Modern English, therefore, did not often exist in Old English. The K in "knight", for example, was pronounced. Another side-effect of spelling words phonetically was that spelling was extremely variable -- the spelling of a word would reflect differences in the phonetics of the writer's regional dialect, and also idiosyncratic spelling choices which varied from author to author. Thus, for example, the word "and" could be spelled either "and" or "ond". Old English spelling is even more muddled than modern English spelling. Most students these days learn using normalized versions, and are only introduced to variant spellings after they have mastered the basics of the language.

    Viking influence

    The second major source of loanwords to Old English were the Scandinavian words introduced during the Viking raids of the ninth and tenth centuries. These tend to be everyday words, and those which are concerned with particular administrative aspects of the Danelaw (that is, the area of land under Viking control, which included extensive holdings all along the eastern seaboard of England and Scotland). The Vikings spoke Old Norse, a language which is related to English in that they both derive from the same ancestral Germanic language. One theory holds that the presence of very similar words in both Old Norse and Old English helped accelerate the decline of case endings in Old English -- that is, if your Nordic neighbor says "horsu" and you say "horsa", you split the difference and just say "horse", reducing the ending to no more than a silent vowel.

    Celtic influence

    The number of Celtic loanwords is of a much lower order than either Latin or Scandinavian. As few as twelve loanwords have been identified as being entirely secure. Out of all the known and suspected Celtic loanwords, most are names of geographical features, and especially rivers.

    Dialects

    To further complicate matters, Old English was rich in dialect forms. The four principal dialect forms of Old English were Northumbrian, Mercian, Kentish and West Saxon. Each of these was associated with an independent kingdom on the island. Of these, Northumbria and Kent were wholly overrun by Vikings during the 9th century. Most of Mercia was overrun as well, though a portion of it was successfully defended by and then integrated into Wessex.

    After the process of unification of the diverse Anglo-Saxon kingdoms in 878 by Alfred the Great, there is a marked decline in the importance of regional dialects. This is not because they stopped existing: regional dialects continued even after that time, as evidenced both by the existence of Middle English dialects later on, and by common sense - people don't spontaneously develop new accents when there is a sudden change of political power.

    However, the bulk of the surviving documents from the Anglo-Saxon period are written in the dialect of Wessex, Alfred's home kingdom. It seems likely that, with consolidation of power, it became necessary to standardize the language of government to reduce the difficulty of administering the remoter areas of the kingdom. As a result, paperwork was written in West Saxon. The Church was likewise affected, especially since Alfred initiated an ambitious program to translate religious materials into the vernacular. In order to retain his patronage and ensure the widest circulation of the translated materials, the monks and priests engaged in the program worked in his dialect. Alfred himself seems to have translated books out of Latin and into English, notably Pope Gregory the Great's treatise on administration, "Pastoral Care."

    Due at least partially to the centralization of power, and to the Viking invasions, there is little or no written evidence for the development of non-Wessex dialects after Alfred's unification.

    Phonology and Standardized Orthography

    Old English was at first written in runes, but shifted to the Latin alphabet with some additions: the letter yogh, adopted from Irish; and three runes: thorn, edh, and wynn. Also used were a symbol for the conjunction 'and', a character identical to a mirror-image of a capital gamma, and one for the relative pronoun 't', a thorn with a crossbar through the ascender. Also used occasionally were macrons over vowels, abbreviations for following 'm's or 'n's.

    All sound descriptions are in SAMPA and International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA). Where SAMPA and IPA symbols differ, they are separated by a slash. SAMPA is on the left and IPA is on the right.

    Consonants


    • b: [ b ]
    • c: unpredictably, [k] or [tS/t?]; the affricate 'c' is generally written with a diacritic by modern speakers for the sake of pronunciation, like so: 'c' or ''
    • cg: [dZ/d?]
    • d: [d]
    • /: initially, finally, or between a vowel and an unvoiced consonant: [T/?]; between two vowel or between a vowel and a voiced consonant: [D/]; in the modern orthography, all unvoiced ''/''s use the thorn (''), while all voiced ones use the edh ('')
    • : [T:/??]
    • f: initially, finally, or between a vowel and an unvoiced consonant: [f]; between two vowel or between a vowel and a voiced consonant: [v]
    • ff: [f:]
    • g: unpredictably, [j], [g], or, only after an 'n', [dZ/d?]; [j] and [dZ] are generally represented with the number three ('3') by modern speakers, representing yogh (?/?)
    • h: when initial or following a consonant: [h\/?]; following a back vowel or a diphthong beginning with a back vowel: [C/]; following a front vowel or a diphthong beginning with a front vowel: [x]
    • k: [k] (rarely used)
    • l: [l]
    • m: [m]
    • n: when preceding a 'g' or 'c': [N/?]; otherwise: [n]
    • p: [p]
    • q: [k] (used before a consonantal 'u') (rarely used)
    • r: perhaps [r\`/?]
    • s: initially, finally, or between a vowel and an unvoiced consonant: [s]; between two vowel or between a vowel and a voiced consonant: [z]
    • sc: unpredictably, [sk] or [S/?]; however, [S/?] is by far the more common, while [sk] is used only in a few words, the most common of which being 'ascian' ('to ask')
    • ss: [s:]
    • t: [t]
    • w/(wynn): [w]
    • x: [ks]
    • z: [z]
    Doubled consonants have doubly long durations; '', 'ff', and 'ss' are shown above only to demonstrate that they cannot be voiced as their single constituents can be.

    Vowels

    Pure vowels and diphthongs in Old English have two degrees of length; though these were originally unpredictable, in our modern orthography we use acute accent marks or following colons to denote long vowels and leave short ones unmarked.


    • a: [a]
    • : [A/?]
    • : [{/]
    • :: [{:/?]
    • e: [E/?]
    • : [e]
    • i: [I/?]
    • : [ i ]
    • o: [Q/?]
    • : [o]
    • u: [U/?]
    • : [u]
    • y: [9/]
    • : [2/]
    Diphthongs:


    • ea: [{@/?]
    • a: [{:@/??]
    • eo: [E@/??]
    • o: [e@/e?]
    • ie: [I@/??]
    • e: [i@/i?]
    Old English Grammar

    Syntax

    As a West Germanic language, Old English syntax has a great deal of common ground with Dutch and German. Old English is not dependent upon S (subject), V (verb), O (object) or "SVO" word order in the way that Modern English is. The syntax of an Old English sentence can be in any of these shapes: SVO order, VSO order, and OVS order. The only constant rule, as in German, is that the verb must come as the second concept. That is, in the sentence 'in the town, we ate some food', it could appear as 'in the town, ate we some food', or 'in the town, ate some food we'. This variable word order is especially common in poetry. Prose, while still displaying variable word order, is much more likely to use SVO ordering. Similarly, word order became less flexible as time went on: the older a text is, the less likely it is to have a fixed word order.

    To further complicate the matter, prepositions may appear after their object, though they are not postpositions, as they may occur in front of the noun too, and usually do, e.g.:

    God cw him us to
    (lit) God said him thus to
    i.e. God said thus to him



    Verbs

    Verbs in Old English are divided into strong or weak verbs.




    Strong Verbs

    Strong verbs use the Germanic form of conjugation (known as Ablaut). In this form of conjugation, the stem of the word changes to indicate the tense. We still have verbs like this in modern English: for example, "sing, sang, sung" is a strong verb, as are "swim, swam, swum" and "choose, chose, chosen." The root portion of the word changes rather than its ending. In Old English, there were seven major classes of strong verb; each class has its own pattern of stem changes. Learning these is a major challenge for students of the language.

    The classes had the following distinguishing features to their infinitive stems:

    Class I - i: + 1 consonant
    Class II - e:o or u: + 1 consonant
    Class III - Originally e + 2 consonants(This was no longer the case by the time of written Old English)
    Class IV - e + 1 consonant(usually l or r, plus the verb brecan'to break')
    Class V - e + 1 consonant (usually a stop or a fricative)
    Class VI - a + 1 consonant
    Class VII - No specific rule - 1st and 2nd have identical stems(e: or e:o), and the infinitive and the past participle also have the same stem.




    The first preterite stem is used in the preterite tense, for the first and third persons singular. The second preterite stem is used for second person singular, and all persons in the plural (as well as the preterite subjunctive). The third class went through so many sound changes that it was barely recognisable as a single class. The first was a process called 'breaking'. Before <h>, and <r> + another consonant, <> turned into <ea>, and <e> to <eo>. Also, before <l> + another consonant, the same happened to <>, but <e> remained unchanged (except before combination <lh>).

    The second sound-change to affect it was the influence of palatal sounds <g>, <c>, and <sc>. These turned anteceding <e> and <> to <ie> and <ea>, respectively.

    The third sound change turned <e> to <i>, <> to <a>, and <o> to <u> before nasals.

    Altogether, this split the third class into five sub-classes:

    a)e + two consonants(apart from clusters beginning with l)
    b)eo + r or h + another consonant
    c)e + l + another consonant
    d)g, c, or sc + ie + two consonants
    e)i + nasal + another consonant


    >


    Regular strong verbs were all declined roughly the same, with the main differences being in the stem vowel.

    Weak Verbs

    Weak verbs are formed principally by adding endings to past and participles. An example is "walk, walked" or "learn, learned". There are only three different classes of weak verb.

    Linguistic trends have greatly favored weak verbs over the last 1200 years. In Old English, especially early on, strong verbs were the dominant form of verb. Today, there are many more weak verbs than strong verbs. Some verbs that were originally strong have become weak; most foreign verbs are adopted as weak verbs; and when verbs are made from nouns (eg "to scroll" or "to water") the resulting verb is weak. Additionally, weak verbs are easier to conjugate, since there are fewer different classes of them. In combination, these factors have drastically reduced the number of strong verbs, so that in modern English weak verbs are the dominant form (although occasionally a weak verb may turn into a strong verb through the process of analogy).

    Atypical Verbs

    Additionally there is a further group of four verbs which are anomalous, the verbs "will", "do", "go" and "be". These four have their own conjugation schemes which differ significantly from all the other classes of verb. This is not especially unusual: "will", "do", "go", and "be" are the most commonly used verbs in the language, and are very important to the meaning of the sentences they are used in. They have their own conjugation schemes to make them as distinct as possible, to reduce the possibility that a listener will mis-hear the word.

    Nouns

    Old English nouns were declined -- that is, the ending of the noun changed to reflect its function in the sentence. There were five major cases: nominative, genitive, dative, accusative, and instrumental. The instrumental case is also known as "ablative", for those who know Latin. The nominative case indicated the subject of the sentence (eg "cyning" means "king"). The genitive case indicated possession (eg the "cyninges scip" is "the ship of the king" or "the king's ship"). The dative case indicated the indirect object of the sentence (eg "hringas cyninge" means "rings for the king" or "rings to the king"). The accusative indicates the direct object of the sentence (eg "elbald lufode cyning" means "elbald loved the king", where elbald is the subject and the king is the object). The instrumental case indicates the agency whereby something was done, eg "lifde sweorde", "he lived by the sword", where "sweorde" is the instrumental form of "sweord"). There were different endings depending on whether the noun was in the singular (eg "hring", one ring) or plural ("hringas", many rings).

    Nouns are also categorized by grammatical gender -- masculine, feminine, or neuter. Masculine and neuter words generally share their endings. Feminine words have their own subset of endings.

    Furthermore, Old English nouns are divided as either strong or weak. Weak nouns have their own endings. In general, weak nouns are easier than strong nouns, since they had begun to lose their declensional system. However, there is a great deal of overlap between the various classes of noun: they are not totally distinct from one another. There are only a couple dozen endings in practice, so it's a lot easier than it sounds at first.

    Here are the weak declension and the strong declension:


    For the '-u / -' forms above, the '-u' is used with a root ending in a short syllable while roots ending in long ones are not inflected. For the '-a, -e' forms, either suffix is acceptable.

    In addition, nouns which end in '-or' are unchanged as per usual in the uninflected forms, but the '-or' is removed and '-r' suffixed to the root for all suffixed forms. Here is an example of such a declension:


    Adjectives

    Adjectives in Old English are declined like nouns. They fall under the same categories (strong or weak, masculine or feminine or neuter, singular or plural) and have the same number of cases (nominative, genitive, dative, accusative, and instrumental). There is a great deal of overlap between the endings of adjectives and those of nouns, especially since you usually match the two. That is, you assign the same ending to the adjective and the word it describes.

    Pronouns

    Most of pronouns are declined by number, case and gender; in the plural form most pronouns have only one form for all genders. Additionally, Old English pronouns reserve the dual form (which is specifically for talking about groups of two things, eg "we two" or "you two" or "they two"). These were uncommon even then, but remained in use throughout the period.

    Personal pronouns


    Many of the forms above bear strong resemblances to their contemporary English language equivalents: for instance in the genitive case ower became "your", re became "our", mn became "mine".

    Prepositions

    Prepositions (like our words by, for, with, because) often follow the word which they govern, in which case they are called postpositions. They are not declined.

    See also Old English language (list of prepositions)

    Front Mutation

    Front Mutation (also known as "I/J Mutation") is an important type of linguistic change, in which if a stressed syllable is followed by an unstressed syllable which contained a letter "i" or "j", then the previous stressed vowel is fronted or raised. The "i" or "j" is dropped from the word or changes to "e".

    A particular class of nouns contain an "i" in the dative singular and plural nominative accusative forms. Consequent upon front mutation, irregular singular/plural oppositions therefore occur such as fot and fet (our foot and feet), and mus and mys (our mouse and mice).

    Front mutation is particularly important to the development of English, since it explains many of the changes in pronunciation that have taken place over the last 1200 years.
    .

  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Last Online
    Tuesday, July 26th, 2005 @ 03:22 AM
    Gender
    Posts
    766
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    4
    Thanked in
    4 Posts

    Post Re: Old English Language (Anglo-Saxon)

    I tend to think it's for the best that English became an uninflected language over time. When I studied Latin, some years ago, I certainly found declensions of nouns to be the most frustrating topic area to master.

  3. #3
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Last Online
    Thursday, April 28th, 2011 @ 05:29 AM
    Ethnicity
    German
    Subrace
    Nordid
    Country
    Germany Germany
    State
    Berlin Berlin
    Location
    Berlin
    Gender
    Age
    38
    Occupation
    student
    Politics
    deutschnational
    Religion
    Lutheran
    Posts
    70
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    1
    Thanked in
    1 Post

    Post Re: Old English Language (Anglo-Saxon)

    RE Old English

    Has anyone informations about differences between the OE dialects?
    It has been claimed that the Angles were a north Germanic tribe because
    the ending -folk in Norfolk and Suffolk, -farne (as in Sjaellandsfarer) and some
    other names point at northern Europe. But the overall picture seems to be
    that the Angles migrated from the Elbgermanic centre to Schleswig in the 2nd
    century BC

    @Telperion
    At least in Latin there are only few relicts of the athematic flection.
    Consider that in PIE there probably havent been regular verbs at all.
    Last edited by beowulf_; Saturday, June 5th, 2004 at 12:14 AM.

  4. The Following User Says Thank You to beowulf_ For This Useful Post:


  5. #4
    Member Theudanaz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Last Online
    Wednesday, February 10th, 2010 @ 11:22 PM
    Ethnicity
    Mixed Germanic
    Ancestry
    Danish, Swedish, Norwegian, English, Scottish
    Subrace
    Nordalpinoid
    Country
    United States United States
    Gender
    Age
    42
    Family
    Married, happily
    Occupation
    Engraving
    Religion
    Gnesio evangelical catholick
    Posts
    1,068
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    7
    Thanked in
    5 Posts

    Post Re: Old English Language (Anglo-Saxon)

    http://www.kami.demon.co.uk/gesithas/biblio/bib02.html

    5. Dialects

    For OE texts in dialect, see especially Sweet (1978) in Section Three, part 4.
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------

    a) General Works

    Ekwall, Eilert, Contributions to the History of Old English Dialects (Lund, 1917).
    Skeat, Walter W., English Dialects from the Eighth Century to the Present Day (Cambridge, 1911).
    Wakelin, Martyn F., Discovering English Dialects, third edition (Princes Risborough, 1985).
    For a larger book on dialects, see Wakelin (1977).

    Wakelin, Martyn F., English Dialects: an Introduction, revised edition (London, 1977).
    For a smaller book on dialects, see Wakelin (1985).
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------

    b) Specific Dialects

    Some introductory grammars listed in part 4.a are restricted to a particular dialect. See Mitchell and Robinson, Quirk and Wrenn, and Sweet.

    Biddulph, Joseph, A Handbook of Mercian: Remarks on the Midland Dialect of Late Anglo-Saxon (Pontypridd, 1985).
    Biddulph, Joseph, A Shippen o' Sheep: an Introduction to the West Saxon of King Alfred's Day (Pontypridd, 1986).
    Bryan, W.F., Studies in the Dialects of the Kentish Charters of the Old English Period (Chicago, 1915).
    Hilmer, H., Zur altnordhumbrischen Laut- und Flexionslehre, I: Lautlehre (Goslar, 1880).
    Kuhn, Sherman McAllister, A Grammar of the Mercian Dialect (Chicago, 1938).
    Rusch, Willard James, The Language of the East Midlands and the Development of Standard English: a Study in Diachronic Phonology (New York, 1992).
    Seebold, Elmar, 'Kentish and Old English Texts from Kent', Words, Texts and Manuscripts: Studies in Anglo-Saxon Culture Presented to Helmut Gneuss on the Occasion of his Sixty-Fifth Birthday, ed. by Michael Korhammer (Cambridge, 1992), p. 409-34.
    Trilsbach, G., Die Lautlehre der sptwestschsischen Evangelien (Bonn, 1905).


    -----
    Also check out:

    http://www.georgetown.edu/faculty/ba...d_english.html

    That site also has a very little OE phrasebook of sorts:
    http://www.georgetown.edu/faculty/ba...nstant-oe.html


    -Thiudans

  6. #5
    Member Theudanaz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Last Online
    Wednesday, February 10th, 2010 @ 11:22 PM
    Ethnicity
    Mixed Germanic
    Ancestry
    Danish, Swedish, Norwegian, English, Scottish
    Subrace
    Nordalpinoid
    Country
    United States United States
    Gender
    Age
    42
    Family
    Married, happily
    Occupation
    Engraving
    Religion
    Gnesio evangelical catholick
    Posts
    1,068
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    7
    Thanked in
    5 Posts

    Post Re: Old English Language (Anglo-Saxon)

    Quote Originally Posted by beowulf
    RE Old English
    @Telperion
    At least in Latin there are only few relicts of the athematic flection.
    Consider that in PIE there probably havent been regular verbs at all.
    I would propose the PIE was in fact more regular (in the sense that it inflected according to strict though numerous rules), though more complex. By the time early Latin is recorded, the italic, rhaetio-romance and osco-umbran languages had already undergone significant phonological and morphological change and re-formation, with declensions conflated and conjugations simplified. There are rules to the order, and rules to the exceptions. Studying the proto-language helps to understand why things changed, became less systematic. Though IMO the exceptions are what adds a sort of beauty to the system.

    -Thiudans

  7. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Last Online
    Thursday, April 28th, 2011 @ 05:29 AM
    Ethnicity
    German
    Subrace
    Nordid
    Country
    Germany Germany
    State
    Berlin Berlin
    Location
    Berlin
    Gender
    Age
    38
    Occupation
    student
    Politics
    deutschnational
    Religion
    Lutheran
    Posts
    70
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    1
    Thanked in
    1 Post

    Post Re: Old English Language (Anglo-Saxon)

    @Thiudans

    Thx for the links & infos.

    The speculations that PIE had no regular verbs is owed to the fact that
    the later-evolving IE languages conjugate regular verbs extremely different.
    For a long time the IE verbal paradigm has been reconstructed on the
    basis of Sanskrit (Veda) and Greek but in the last decades PIE
    has been de-sanskritized because of the analysis of the Hethito-Luvic group.
    Now it seams that the verb paradigm was on the brink to change from a categorial to a aspect system, so the situation becomes even more complicated.
    Last edited by beowulf_; Saturday, June 5th, 2004 at 12:32 AM.

  8. #7
    Funding Member
    "Friend of Germanics"
    Skadi Funding Member


    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Last Online
    Friday, September 5th, 2008 @ 06:36 AM
    Subrace
    Nordid
    Country
    United States United States
    State
    California California
    Gender
    Family
    Married
    Posts
    4,095
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    17
    Thanked in
    16 Posts

    Post Re: Old English Language (Anglo-Saxon)

    I see this thread has the attention of people who know, so let me ask a question about an English word. In English we have "Who" and "Whom" the nom. and dative. cases---right? What happened to the accusitive form and would it be "Whon". Another question: Without an accusitive case for "who", which word is the proper word to use, who or whom?

  9. #8
    Senior Member Mac Seafraidh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Last Online
    Friday, April 20th, 2018 @ 08:21 PM
    Ethnicity
    Anglo-American
    Ancestry
    German, Irish, Italian, and either Flemish or Walloon
    Subrace
    Alpinid/Borreby
    Country
    Vinland Vinland
    State
    Delaware Delaware
    Location
    U$$Rael
    Gender
    Age
    36
    Family
    Single, looking
    Occupation
    Forum activist
    Politics
    Fascism and National Socialism
    Religion
    Atheism
    Posts
    1,634
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    1
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    3
    Thanked in
    3 Posts

    Post Re: Old English Language (Anglo-Saxon)

    When it became Middle English French influence flourished into the language, but I am sure many already knew that.

  10. #9
    You are not wrong, who deem / That my days have been a dream Johannes de Len's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Last Online
    Sunday, April 15th, 2012 @ 11:03 AM
    Ethnicity
    Iberian
    Subrace
    Atlanto-Baskid
    Location
    Terra Firma
    Gender
    Politics
    Nationalism
    Posts
    1,477
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    1
    Thanked in
    1 Post

    Post Re: Old English Language (Anglo-Saxon)

    Quote Originally Posted by MVSSOLINI MIT VNS
    When it became Middle English French influence flourished into the language, but I am sure many already knew that.
    .

  11. #10
    Member Theudanaz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Last Online
    Wednesday, February 10th, 2010 @ 11:22 PM
    Ethnicity
    Mixed Germanic
    Ancestry
    Danish, Swedish, Norwegian, English, Scottish
    Subrace
    Nordalpinoid
    Country
    United States United States
    Gender
    Age
    42
    Family
    Married, happily
    Occupation
    Engraving
    Religion
    Gnesio evangelical catholick
    Posts
    1,068
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    7
    Thanked in
    5 Posts

    Post Re: Old English Language (Anglo-Saxon)

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Solar Wolff
    I see this thread has the attention of people who know, so let me ask a question about an English word. In English we have "Who" and "Whom" the nom. and dative. cases---right? What happened to the accusitive form and would it be "Whon". Another question: Without an accusitive case for "who", which word is the proper word to use, who or whom?
    Tut tut, Doctor, you're in California you should know 'who' is the only proper word for any case! But I use 'whom' formally for accusative and dative now, 'whose' or 'of whom' for genitive. I think final 'n' especially after vowels was weakened to a point that it was simply being dropped, in many cases starting perhaps in Middle English, esp. in words like infinitive endings -en. Though this shouldn't apply to single syllable words - 'hwon' - n occurs in a stressed syllable. The parallel of course is the loss of the accusative in the masculine pronoun - him replaced hine; Also in Swedish, Danish honom, ham replaced the earlier accusative forms, as also Vem, hvem, wem are orig. datives. Perhaps the dative simply occured more often and so eventually won out over other cases when simplification was occuring? Note how in OE already the accusative and dative were sometimes similar, as in ge - eow - eow (2nd pl.); ic - me(c) - me (1st sg.); we - us(ic) - us (1st pl.); etc.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 124
    Last Post: Saturday, May 19th, 2018, 02:00 PM
  2. Revival of Anglo-Saxon Language
    By Richard in forum Linguistics
    Replies: 24
    Last Post: Monday, April 23rd, 2018, 04:32 AM
  3. Replies: 1
    Last Post: Sunday, April 22nd, 2018, 06:41 AM
  4. Is the English Language Not Anglo-Saxon?
    By weland in forum Linguistics
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: Sunday, April 22nd, 2018, 05:33 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •