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Thread: Have You Officially Renounced Your Religion? Are You Considering It?

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    Have You Officially Renounced Your Religion? Are You Considering It?

    I was originally going to place it in the Atheism forum, but since the post which inspired me was made by a Heathen, it might as well fit in here.

    Did you renounce your religion officially? Does your religion permit you to? What made you come to your decision? Is it important for you, to not be officially Christian?

    Lucky those who weren't baptized.

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    I was raised by athiests, I never had a religion. My mom just told me to put protestant on hospital forms.

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    I advise against doing that, especially as adolescents or younger. I know some peoples will say it's because I'm Christian so I want to convert everyone, but think about it beyond a little bit. What if one day you become to regret the decision you've made years ago? You can't change that you got yourself excommunicated. What will you do then?

    In my view, Heathens and Atheists who were raised Christian can think of it like this: it wasn't my choice to begin with, it was my parents' decision, not mine. I never decided to be part of this religion, so unsubscribing is not going to undo it. Besides, in my view it's a little bit disrespectful towards your parents, like throwing their education to the trash can. They were probably thinking it was best for you. But anyway, no one can force you to practice a religion against your will.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Siebenbürgerin
    I advise against doing that, especially as adolescents or younger. I know some peoples will say it's because I'm Christian so I want to convert everyone, but think about it beyond a little bit. What if one day you become to regret the decision you've made years ago? You can't change that you got yourself excommunicated. What will you do then?
    I dont know about your area, but in Germany it has absolutely no consequencies, unless you're catholic. They wouldnt take you back.

    The point is though, you dont 'excommunicate' at a church, but in a local city bureau, and when you pick up another job and meanwhile regretted your decision, you tell your new employer you're evangelic (whatever) and from that point on you're part of the christian herd again. And no priest will have the power to do something against it. Only catholics have a way to excommunicate you, the rest dont.

    Quote Originally Posted by Siebenbürgerin
    In my view, Heathens and Atheists who were raised Christian can think of it like this: it wasn't my choice to begin with, it was my parents' decision, not mine. I never decided to be part of this religion, so unsubscribing is not going to undo it.
    Probably this argumentation for an atheist works, because he stops to believe alltogether. For him it is not about a specific religion but about religion and belief as such. Nonetheless he would most likely consider it wrong, because you pay the church tax then, and why should he support something which he just decided to have no place in his life? He would be reminded each month on his wages slip that he is not consequent with his decision.

    For a Heathen though this is an outright heresy. Paying for the support of christianity for a heathen is the same like sacrificing to the christian god, betraying his own belief and his gods.

    Quote Originally Posted by Siebenbürgerin
    Besides, in my view it's a little bit disrespectful towards your parents, like throwing their education to the trash can. They were probably thinking it was best for you. But anyway, no one can force you to practice a religion against your will.
    What is about the disrespectful decision of my parents to force me into a belief noone asked me if I want it to have? Is this not disrespectful? It is always said that belief is something intimate, something private. How do they come to think that they could decide for me about such a matter then?

    My parents (until I was six), then my mother did not raise me in any form religious, beside the occasional x-mas visit I've never seen a church from the inside. Nonetheless she forced me to take a baptism and communion, with the same foul argumentation. Honestly, I thought I'd read the words of my mother when I read your post.

    Did I had anything positive from it? No. I felt even more discomfort than before, I felt forced to something I didnt want, I felt pushed to something (the lessons before) I didnt want and I actually found utterly ridiculous, and I felt SOLD. By my own mother.

    When I was 18 I went to the local bureau and unsubscribed from the robbery.
    Shortly after I came to know a celtic wiccan witch. I didnt know anything about that belief, nor the mystics, nothing. But she offered me a ritual which would cleanse me from the baptism and communion without forcing me to become myself wiccan or force anything else on me. Of course I took it.

    I never regretted this decisions.
    Ein Leben ist nichts, deine Sprosse sind alles
    Aller Sturm nimmt nichts, weil dein Wurzelgriff zu stark ist
    und endet meine Frist, weiss ich dass du noch da bist
    Gefürchtet von der Zeit, mein Baum, mein Stamm in Ewigkeit

    my signature

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    Quote Originally Posted by velvet View Post
    I dont know about your area, but in Germany it has absolutely no consequencies, unless you're catholic. They wouldnt take you back.

    The point is though, you dont 'excommunicate' at a church, but in a local city bureau, and when you pick up another job and meanwhile regretted your decision, you tell your new employer you're evangelic (whatever) and from that point on you're part of the christian herd again. And no priest will have the power to do something against it. Only catholics have a way to excommunicate you, the rest dont.
    I was referring to Catholicism especially, because in Lutheranism excommunication exists more in theory than in practice, it isn't common and there are no precise rules followed in every denomination for it, and in Eastern Orthodoxy excommunication means only exclusion from the Eucharist, which doesn't mean you leave the religion at all. In such religions it's more difficult to leave the Church, because in some Lutheran churches you've to have your will subjected to a vote, and sometime it has to be unanimous.

    So my argumentation is mainly about the Church where excommunication is traditional: the Catholic Church.

    Probably this argumentation for an atheist works, because he stops to believe alltogether. For him it is not about a specific religion but about religion and belief as such. Nonetheless he would most likely consider it wrong, because you pay the church tax then, and why should he support something which he just decided to have no place in his life? He would be reminded each month on his wages slip that he is not consequent with his decision.

    For a Heathen though this is an outright heresy. Paying for the support of christianity for a heathen is the same like sacrificing to the christian god, betraying his own belief and his gods.
    As if all the taxes we pay are for things we believe in and support? Not for everybody. The problem isn't about being raised in a religion, it's about a tax. Even if the tax disappears, it doesn't mean the Church does too.

    What is about the disrespectful decision of my parents to force me into a belief noone asked me if I want it to have? Is this not disrespectful? It is always said that belief is something intimate, something private. How do they come to think that they could decide for me about such a matter then?

    My parents (until I was six), then my mother did not raise me in any form religious, beside the occasional x-mas visit I've never seen a church from the inside. Nonetheless she forced me to take a baptism and communion, with the same foul argumentation. Honestly, I thought I'd read the words of my mother when I read your post.

    Did I had anything positive from it? No. I felt even more discomfort than before, I felt forced to something I didnt want, I felt pushed to something (the lessons before) I didnt want and I actually found utterly ridiculous, and I felt SOLD. By my own mother.
    I've to disagree with you. It isn't disrespectful for parents to baptise their children and make them take communion. No parent wishes to disrespect the child. Parents want what's best, even if they're wrong about it sometime. Like I said, they can't force a belief on you. They can just create a path. It's up to you if you want to follow it or not. You decided not to, but other peoples (like me), decided to follow the traditions in which my family was raised itself, and transmitted them down to me. There was a time when it didn't make much sense to me, but as I grew up, it did more and more.

    Besides, how could your mother know when you were born, that you would want a Heathen path?

    When I was 18 I went to the local bureau and unsubscribed from the robbery.
    Shortly after I came to know a celtic wiccan witch. I didnt know anything about that belief, nor the mystics, nothing. But she offered me a ritual which would cleanse me from the baptism and communion without forcing me to become myself wiccan or force anything else on me. Of course I took it.

    I never regretted this decisions.
    But you aren't a Wiccan now. And how about the peoples who unsubscribe, like you, experiment a new religion, and then regret it? Not everybody makes the right choices. When the Judgment Day comes, it might be too late to repent.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Siebenbürgerin
    As if all the taxes we pay are for things we believe in and support? Not for everybody. The problem isn't about being raised in a religion, it's about a tax. Even if the tax disappears, it doesn't mean the Church does too.
    No, but you also dont support it further.
    And you'll have the good feeling to be consequent with your decisions.

    And, it is a tax that you can decide to pay or not to pay, an option that doesnt exist for the rest of the robbery.

    Quote Originally Posted by Siebenbürgerin
    I've to disagree with you. It isn't disrespectful for parents to baptise their children and make them take communion. No parent wishes to disrespect the child. Parents want what's best, even if they're wrong about it sometime.
    You dont know my mother. There is a reason why I broke contact with her and my entire 'family' directly connected with her some eight years ago.
    And like anything else what she did also this was a complete selfish wish, she worried about what her neighbors could think if I dont get baptised. As said, religion did not exist or play any role in my childhood.

    Quote Originally Posted by Siebenbürgerin
    Besides, how could your mother know when you were born, that you would want a Heathen path?
    I was baptised when I was 13, along with the communion. By that time I already was atheist.

    Quote Originally Posted by Siebenbürgerin
    But you aren't a Wiccan now. And how about the peoples who unsubscribe, like you, experiment a new religion, and then regret it? Not everybody makes the right choices. When the Judgment Day comes, it might be too late to repent.
    No, I am no Wiccan now, and it is one of many reasons why I hold Celtics / Wiccans in high esteem. They offer help where they can help and else demand nothing and force nothing. And spouse no threats one will burn in hell.
    A stance I highly appreciate.


    When someone regrets it, he is free to get a new baptism. Even if he was catholic, there are countless catholic sects, in addition to the countless otherwise christian sects, one of them will welcome him with open arms

    And many christians here reject any of the official denominations anyway, they are christians despite them being no member of one of the clubs. So I guess even that is not required.
    Ein Leben ist nichts, deine Sprosse sind alles
    Aller Sturm nimmt nichts, weil dein Wurzelgriff zu stark ist
    und endet meine Frist, weiss ich dass du noch da bist
    Gefürchtet von der Zeit, mein Baum, mein Stamm in Ewigkeit

    my signature

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    Ive never been a christian, and wasnt brought up christian. My mothers family is not very religious, but my father side is or was.
    My father wanted me to have the name "Christian", and wanted me baptized. But Im neither baptized or confirmed

    "Make strong old dreams lest our world lose heart." -Ezra Pound



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    I'm not baptized nor confirmated, though I went to the confirmation class because my mother thought I should decide myself if I wanted to become a lutheran christan (she's a weak agnostic herself). My father, a convicted atheist, always found religion to be, as he said, "dumm Tüch" (Plattdüütsch for nonsense), but in the end he agreed. I liked the lessions about the christian faith and found the legends from those unknown, past and far away ages exciting and interesting, but I never felt attracted to it or actually believed in god, so I choose not to get confirmated.

    What made you come to your decision?
    My engagement in and study of philosophy in my late 10s. I was an agnostic throughout my early and middle teenage years. At the age of 17 or 18, I found the atheistic stance I still hold today (The existence of an almighty god is impossible because the whole concept of omnipotence is a paradoxum. The existence of superhuman, extraterrestrial enities is possible, even likely, but they are bound to the laws of matter and existance and therefore not godlike).

    Still, I don't see myself as "rebellious" or "critical" because of the fact I'm an atheist at all. Quite the opposite is true: My family on the paternal side has a long tradition of atheist thinking, going back to the Imperial Age where atheism was still something unusual and innovative.

    Is it important for you, to not be officially Christian?
    No, I wouldn't care about being a christian on paper other than indirectly supporting the church. It's not that I'd be ashamed or have my honor blemished by being a member of the church, but as I embrace and support the downfall of all five world religions in favour of reason, atheist philosophy and personal spirituality, so I don't want to support the church.
    "Lever dot as slav."

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    I went to a catholic school and soon got into trouble. To many rules, no thinking. Later on I studied Nietzsche (as I was 12/13 or so, didn't understand much, but his words carried so much strength, I just got addicted to it). He provided me with a different point of view and of course with a lot of arguments. I learned quickly, that there is a border of how far reason takes them, afterwards are only dogmata.

    After I was 14 things had so much deteriorated that everybody finally agreed that I would better go to a state school. It was like breathing fresh air.

    Looking with a 20/20 hindsight I can only say I learned a lot about religion. So this time was valuable for me. Of course I didn't learn what I was supposed to learn, but I grew anyway. It seems the catholic church provided the bone to sharpen my teeth.

    I loved and still love the catholic mass, though I am not christian anymore.

    My mother married an atheist and needed a permission from the bishop to marry, which was only granted that the kids have to grow up catholic. My father wasn't really an atheist, he loved nature and brought us out into the woods frequently and very very early in the morning. I learned more about real religion from those experiences.

    The questions from my youth didn't leave me and I followed different tracks to find answers. Today I know that catholicism, or christianity provides valid answers and help. It's just the people who don't understand what is said.

    I prefer a heathinistic approach over Christianity, as the desert religion doesn't appeal to my essence. I rather go into nature for my exercises and contacts than into a house or temple.

    The early break with organized religion and 'believes' was necessary for me, otherwise i would have dried out and would have become an outward religious men without inner experiences or insights.

    I think it is an individual path. If you feel you get stones instead of bread you better go before you starve internally to death. Some people have a strong desire to get somewhere others don't. Just follow your path and accept it.

    A sufi saying is: You meet your fate on the road where you try to avoid it.

    I found that to be true.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hersir View Post
    Ive never been a christian, and wasnt brought up christian. My mothers family is not very religious, but my father side is or was.
    My father wanted me to have the name "Christian", and wanted me baptized. But Im neither baptized or confirmed
    Sounds like my family set up

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